Flysight vs Recon Instruments

[Chris-Ottawa 0]

Pretty simple question, why would someone buy one over the other? I can't believe no one has asked this before.

Here's what I know:

Flysight:
Real time flight data via beep tones (much like a vario)
Price $249

Recon
Real time flight data via small HUD
Price: $199 (MOD), $299 (MOD Live)

To me, the Recon seems like a clean sweep, but I'm not sure if it logs, if there are accuracy differences (ie: 5Hz), or the fact that the Recon is goggle mounted could be cumbersome. I'm curious what others think!

Also, has anyone managed to mount a Recon on something other than a pair of goggle? IE: inside a Z1 or something.

Thanks!

"When once you have tasted flight..."

[Joe2003 0]

But you cant buy the recon HUD anymore, it was a one off batch.

[Chris-Ottawa 0]

Are you sure?

Their store is still live, and they released a new version of it, the MOD Live? I just added one to my cart and it says in stock.

http://shop.reconinstruments.com/product-category/mod-live-products/

"When once you have tasted flight..."

[mccordia 74]

The FlySight has quite a few advantages: You retain 3D vision, no occluded vision in one eye. No need to zero in altitude. Cheaper. Faster refresh/logging rate.

And in general. Its interesting to know your glide ratio. but with the ever changing windconditions the same flight will always vary in results.
So the only real usefull data during the flight is, is my glide improving or getting worse. And just having the audible feedback on the flysight does that.

The Recon goggles have a huge 'cool' factor, but in the end, the only practical info you get from it, is 'is my glide improving or getting worse' with each change in body position. And for that, the smaller and easier to use Flysight is more than enough.

Plus you get the fun extras on the flysight (Flying blind, aiming at a GPS location) which is awesome for blindfolded 'find the crate of beer' running games on the dropzone during winded out days. Because you'd never jump through clouds where you cant see the ground!

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[toomuchpresha 0]

You can still buy the HUD.

I sold mine and got a Fly Sight.

Using the goggles, I struggled to see my handles and was advised at Flock n Dock NOT to use them in larger flocks due to the peripheral vison. (Not to mention that I couldn't get a comfortable fit with the Tonfly 3XPlus)

I've used the Fly Sight about 8 or 10 times now and after some adjustment to get the volume right, I find it a great tool. I think you can still adjust the glide ratio as efficiently with sounds rather than vision for sure.

[ifell 0]

Hey Chris, just so we are all on the same page here there is a difference between the Recon Mod/Mod Live thing and the Flight HUD Limited edition they released for the skydive/BASE environment...

Get a Flysight

::if you don't see "Flight HUD" on the website it is because they are not available, to buy some you will need to buy used ones

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

I can see the potential benefit of the flysight, but can't for the life of me figure out why someone would want to occlude their vision on a wingsuit flight with that stupid Recon thing. I mean REALLY? I'm assuming it's the same people who jump with their Ipod music blaring. The word "novelty" comes to mind. Noobs can't navigate properly without distractions.

Chuck

[Chris-Ottawa 0]

Thanks!

I'm curious now, what's the different between the Flight HUD, and the one on the website? They seem to do exactly the same thing.

Based on this thread, I'm leaning towards the Flysight, but the novelty of the Recon gear does still interest me. It would be nice if I could attach it to the visor of my Z1, and then when the visor is open under canopy, my sight is unobstructed.

"When once you have tasted flight..."

[GobbleGobble 0]

Quote

Thanks!

I'm curious now, what's the different between the Flight HUD, and the one on the website? They seem to do exactly the same thing.

Based on this thread, I'm leaning towards the Flysight, but the novelty of the Recon gear does still interest me. It would be nice if I could attach it to the visor of my Z1, and then when the visor is open under canopy, my sight is unobstructed.

Integration like you are looking for isn't likely due to the form factor of the whole Recon package.

The "stock" firmware for Recon devices isn't really suitable for skydiving. It's one of the reasons the Flight HUD was done (limited run). You can find those for sale but you are looking at $300+ to get your hands on them. Recon might do another run at some point. But no one has any reason to believe that will actually happen (for now).

[The111 1]

Quote

I can see the potential benefit of the flysight, but can't for the life of me figure out why someone would want to occlude their vision on a wingsuit flight with that stupid Recon thing. I mean REALLY? I'm assuming it's the same people who jump with their Ipod music blaring. The word "novelty" comes to mind. Noobs can't navigate properly without distractions.

Chuck

You'll understand when you get more jumps.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[flipwithit 0]

the fly sight is definitely a good tool for someone to progress...best next to trying to keep up with the best pilot at break off.

i put 2 jumps on a pair of demo flight huds we had at lodi and cancelled my order

[Yorick 0]

Hi,

I recently came across a Recon, and had a change to put it on. (Pro-tip: test before you buy)
I was quiet disappointed to be honest. The actual display was in the lower right corner of the glasses. Which means you lose focus on anything else when looking at it. It's not like a real HUD you imagine form a fighter airplane where you see the information in your vision.
It's more like driving a new car and you want to change something on the console; you have to look away.
It became immediately clear the the Recon it pretty worthless when you want to fly with others; because you don't want to be extracted for even half a second. (and you loose a lot of peripheral vision)
So it's a nice toy when you do ONLY solo performance flying.

The Recon can be useful, but I think the pros don't outweigh the cons.

Disclaimer: I've bought the Flysight. ;-)

"The 'perfect' parachute jump was thought to be one where the opening shock and touchdown were simultaneous" -Lyle Cameron, ~1965
---
Falling-With-Style.com

[WickedWingsuits 0]

If you are going to only get 1 of these devices then go with the Flysight. It is much better designed for detailed analysis of performance and the tone is better suited for feedback I think.

The best device would be something that combined both...plus a few more options. I do like the Recon for seeing speed and altitude without moving head position BUT I have also found some of the speed numbers to be misleading, not sure why.

The use of an eye for Recon isn't as big a deal as some people are making out IF you use it on the right kind of flights. Leave it behind if you are going out on a flock.

Summer Rental special, 5 weeks for the price of 4! That is $160 a month.

Try before You Buy with Wicked Wingsuits - WingsuitRental.com

[mccordia 74]

Quote

The use of an eye for Recon isn't as big a deal as some people are making out IF you use it on the right kind of flights. Leave it behind if you are going out on a flock.

or flyby's on Table Mountain.....

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[MartijnMaas 0]

In addition: the Flysight is usable if you have glasses, the Recon is quit fast out of sight if either the display or you glasses move only a little bit. And worse: the best position for me is the display on the edge of my glasses, so it is kind of a splitscreen.
Using it without dark gogles is possible, but only if you are not flying into the sun.
As long as the display-content is so rigid (and slow) as it is now it's loosing it's usefullness when compared to the flexibility of the Flysight.

If Recon wants to be serious they need to give us some options:
-User must be able to select what he wants to see in digits and on the dial.
-User must be able to select GPS or barometric altitude, including a good solution for ground level-reset.
-User must be able to give the minimum and maximum vallues for the dial.
-The range to adjust the screen in relation to the unit must be increased, as wel as the distance to it.
-Updates of ALL vallues on screen must be 5Hz.
(For Jarno: next version will get a button for landingear)

I'm happy with the Flysight, glad I didn't spend any on the Recon. I they ever decide to update it I would be happy to try it but no way I'm buying before trying!

Edit: I wanted to spend money on the Flysight but they didn't let me. And my girl only had to pay half price... But if I had to pay I still would have bought it ;)

I'm not a complete idiot... Some parts are missing!

[DSE 5]

FWIW, we don't allow Recons for flocking. It blows that we have to have a rule about what _should_ be common sense.

[WickedWingsuits 0]

I tried to send some feedback to Recon but they didn't seem interested one bit. That was the most disappointing part of spending money on the goggles. I was really hoping they would be more interested in this just being a first version of the hardware but I think they are on to bigger markets again.

Summer Rental special, 5 weeks for the price of 4! That is $160 a month.

Try before You Buy with Wicked Wingsuits - WingsuitRental.com

[mccordia 74]

I think if you look at the skydiving/basejumping market, there is little to no good/functional gear designed by people who arent skydivers/basejumpers themselves.

By the people, for the people seems to be the only way in which a manufacturer can place themselves properly in the shoes of the user, and allow them to see the functionality the user wants/needs.

At least for most of the gear, that statement seems to hold true.
And like you say, for a company like Recon its probably a fun PR thing, but in terms of sales probably not even 1% of their other targeted markets.

JC
FlyLikeBrick
I'm an Athlete?

[roostnureye 2]

just had a freind this weekend jump a friends recons and was backflying in a wingsuit, hud displays 4300' he saw the ground out of the corner of his vision and pitched immediatly, was in the saddle at 1300' "DO NOT RELY ON THESE AS YOUR ALTIMETER"
yes he should have had an audible.

Flock University FWC / ZFlock
B.A.S.E. 1580
Aussie BASE 121

[Shredex 0]

Quote

just had a freind this weekend jump a friends recons and was backflying in a wingsuit, hud displays 4300' he saw the ground out of the corner of his vision and pitched immediatly, was in the saddle at 1300' "DO NOT RELY ON THESE AS YOUR ALTIMETER"
yes he should have had an audible.

That's because Recon doesn't auto zero it's altitude. You are able to manually adjust the altitude, but it takes ages. So people that jump them just remember that its reading so and so different. Just something you have to pre-prep for. My buddies was showing about 3K difference but it was spot on with that difference having his audible go off in sync when his display showed 7K in the goggles(4K alarm)

And Recon doesn't care. I've asked them if they were going to make anymore and they said no, but maybe if there was high demand for them then they would consider making more. Because the 600+ sold out of the 250 needed just wasn't enough demand :/


I guess it's more important that bicyclists know their altitude while biking trails...

[ifell 0]

Maybe they didn't luke all the great things the 600 people had to say about them lol

[The111 1]

Quote

That's because Recon doesn't auto zero it's altitude.

Not necessarily, it could also be because of a burble. Alti's mounted in weird places have been known to give unreliable readings while flying in weird orientations.

The lesson here is not "use an audible," or "zero out your toy." The lesson is to maintain altitude awareness in all flight modes. We have a dozen different ways to do that, but the most important ways are to use the things in our eye sockets and the thing on our wrist. Use those things.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[johnmatrix 21]

General article on this stuff...

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/hitech-goggles-open-up-new-dimensions-in-vision-20130422-2i9nh.html

Therein lies the rub. Safety advocates say it is not possible, as seductive as it might sound, to take in simultaneously two streams of information: the real-life action, and the virtual performance data.
"You're effectively skiing blind; you're going to miss a mogul or hit somebody," said David Strayer, a neuroscientist at the University of Utah, in Salt Lake City, who for more than two decades has studied the science of attention and distraction. Even the briefest glance at the information takes over a skier's field of vision and focus, he said.

[DSE 5]

Quote

General article on this stuff...

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/hitech-goggles-open-up-new-dimensions-in-vision-20130422-2i9nh.html

Therein lies the rub. Safety advocates say it is not possible, as seductive as it might sound, to take in simultaneously two streams of information: the real-life action, and the virtual performance data.
"You're effectively skiing blind; you're going to miss a mogul or hit somebody," said David Strayer, a neuroscientist at the University of Utah, in Salt Lake City, who for more than two decades has studied the science of attention and distraction. Even the briefest glance at the information takes over a skier's field of vision and focus, he said.

Only two weeks ago we had a wingsuiter arguing that his Recon's didn't affect his awareness nor vision in a flock. I guess that means skydivers have much better cognitive skills than skiers do.

[dthames 0]

Quote

General article on this stuff...

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/hitech-goggles-open-up-new-dimensions-in-vision-20130422-2i9nh.html

Therein lies the rub. Safety advocates say it is not possible, as seductive as it might sound, to take in simultaneously two streams of information: the real-life action, and the virtual performance data.
"You're effectively skiing blind; you're going to miss a mogul or hit somebody," said David Strayer, a neuroscientist at the University of Utah, in Salt Lake City, who for more than two decades has studied the science of attention and distraction. Even the briefest glance at the information takes over a skier's field of vision and focus, he said.

I am not an advocate of those goggles in any way. But consider the statement in the link, “Even the briefest glance at the information takes over a skier's field of vision and focus, he said.”, So I think, “What happens when we look in the rear view mirror of our car, while driving?” The same thing. Just saying.

Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”