PC Size, Bridle length and Main Question

[nikejumper 0]

Background: I have 400 something jumps, 150ish WS jumps in a V2 with a stiletto 170 (185lbs) and not 1 problem with it-- Took about a year and half off, did a bunch of fun jumps and then did a few back on my V2, then bought a Squirrel Colugo 1.

1st and only jump so far, exited and did a few practice pulls flew it and felt her out (WOW is all I have to say, it was like being inside an airplane!) pulled pretty much in full flight (not MAXED but decent flight) the PC toss was good and strong, at least I thought so. It felt like it took FOREVER for something to happen, very slowly stood me up and right into 4ish line twist. Long story short, fought out of them as they wanted to spin up more and landed uneventfully after that.

Questions:
1. I have an another rig with a Sabre 2 150, will a 150 saber have less of a spinning chance then the 170 stiletto all else equal?
2. what size PCs are ppl with big suits jumping?
3. If I add a WS bridle will that effect openings when I FF? Does it help with line twist
4. I know squirrel makes the skySnatch. Has anyone jumped and FF'd with it?? (i'm assuming it works good with a WS)

I would like to make a rig that can do both, WS and FF and sell the rig with the stiletto.

If I'm putting to much concern in 1 jump, just tell me to shut up and jump it. But if anyone has a (constructive) opinion, I'm all ears.

Sorry for all the questions. I've been out of the sport for a while and the WS word has made leaps and bounds on me, and I'm the only WS'er at my DZ, so any help would be greatly appreciated.

thanks
Jeff

Is it saturday yet?

[phoenixlpr 0]

I jumped X-Wing with 24" ZP kill-line PC on std long bridle.

I also jumped WS with 32" F111 kill line PC with short bridle(150cm), Bird-Man 28" ZP kill-line PC with long bridle.
All above gave me a good opening.

One of my 24" PC started to give some hesitation due to its age/mileage, so I have replaced that.

I would try skySnatch some day. That could help against some unexplained line twist.

I'm on the fast and heavy side: 90-100Km/h vertical on start of the opening. I also pull from flight, so my canopy would be deployed through a smaller burble.

[skow 6]

nikejumper

1. I have an another rig with a Sabre 2 150, will a 150 saber have less of a spinning chance then the 170 stiletto all else equal?

the nickname 'Spinletto' hasn't come from nowhere :)

[johnmatrix 21]

I've never jumped a Stiletto but based on a lot of what I've read here it seems that they're one of the worst canopies for wingsuiting you can get.

I would go to the Sabre2 and leave everything else as is.

If you want to change anything else probably a stowless / semi stowless D-bag would be the next best thing to change.

I jump a Sabre2 190, UPT semi-stowless D-bag, 9 foot bridle and 28" ZP PC.
But I also have a normal D-bag with normal length bridle spare that I feel comfortable jumping as well.

[birdynamnam 28]

As has already been mentioned, spinlettos are probl. the worst choice one can do. Squirrel SkySnatch works fine with any kind of skydiving and it comes with a bridle also. I use a 30" SkySnatch for my Storm 150.

[Prior23 0]

You're much better off jumping that Sabre if you're comfortable with the extra wingloading for sure. Getting an extended bridle wont change your openings when you are doing a FF jump but will most certainly help your PC to clear your burble when doing WS jumps. Towing your PC with a standard length bridle is not hard to do especially in a Colugo.

I also jump an anti twist D bag, not sure it is making much of a difference or not but I'd like to think so. I'm thinking of doing a bottomless corners mod as well soon.

B.A.S.E. #1734

[lyosha 50]

I'm a big boy. I got some (like a second at times) hesitation out of an ~8' bridle + 28" zp PC, so I bought 10' bridle + 34" PC and stowless D-Bag. No more hesitation. F111 PCs apparently work even better.

Use same setup for freeflying. Length of bridle doesn't impact your openings, and neither does size of PC. At least that's what my experience has been.

[Bluhdow 31]

nikejumper

Questions:
1. I have an another rig with a Sabre 2 150, will a 150 saber have less of a spinning chance then the 170 stiletto all else equal?
2. what size PCs are ppl with big suits jumping?
3. If I add a WS bridle will that effect openings when I FF? Does it help with line twist
4. I know squirrel makes the skySnatch. Has anyone jumped and FF'd with it?? (i'm assuming it works good with a WS)

1. Yes. If you're comfortable under that canopy then the Sabre2 is a better choice.
2. I jump a 28" ZP with all of my suits. Shadow, Havoc, Venom Power.
3. Get a 9' bridle. It's fine for any kind of jumping and much better for WS.
4. I think the skySnatch is a nice design but probably over-engineered for skydiving. Any normal PC is just fine. That said, less oscillation MIGHT help you with line twists. I think better body position and a longer bridle are more significant factors though.

On the Colugo work on flaring from full flight before pitching. A nice controlled dive followed by a smooth flare into your pitch will create some nice airflow over your back to feed the canopy. Smooth air makes for smooth openings.

Apex BASE
#1816

[dthames 0]

lyosha

I'm a big boy. I got some (like a second at times) hesitation out of an ~8' bridle + 28" zp PC, so I bought 10' bridle + 34" PC and stowless D-Bag. No more hesitation. F111 PCs apparently work even better.

Use same setup for freeflying. Length of bridle doesn't impact your openings, and neither does size of PC. At least that's what my experience has been.

I had no problem with my Rbird, 28" PC and 6' bridle. But when I started jumping a larger suit once in a while, I got a longer bridle (about 11' long). Not long after that on a specific trip, out of 41 jumps I had my bridle tied in a knot on 4 different jumps, once of which choked off the PC. All 4 of those knotted bridles were with my Rbird. Something was wrong. A lazy pitch might have been a factor, but this started with the longer bridle, so that is where I put the blame.

I had been folding the entire bridle up inside the PC. With some helpful advice, I started folding about half of the bridle inside the PC and about half of the bridle outside the PC. No more knots.

Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

[lyosha 50]

Interesting - what do you mean by "inside the PC" and "outside the PC"? Those could mean a few different things...

[Freeflaw 0]

This is what he means by bridle on the outside https://vimeo.com/26274995

[dthames 0]

lyosha

Interesting - what do you mean by "inside the PC" and "outside the PC"? Those could mean a few different things...

By "outside", I mean that I folded and rolled the PC, and then zigzag folded the bridle along the length of the rolled PC.

By "inside", I mean that I folded the PC, zigzag folded the bridle (on top of the PC) along the length of the folded PC, and then rolled the PC with the bridle inside the roll.

About half inside and about half outside is my current method.

Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”

[Anachronist 2]

26" collapsable ZP PC with 9' bridle, semi-stowless bag. Jumped with medium to big suits and several canopies 190-170. Deployments are clean and comfortable. Also works great for normal freefall.

I think with big suits, body position is most important, but the 9' bridal is a must have (my understanding is that anything over 9' isn't helping anymore). I've seen a (rear facing) video first hand of a ~5 second hesitation with a 6' bridle (Suit was an X-1), the pin was pulled the whole time the PC just couldn't get into clean air, it wasn't until the jumper looked over his shoulder that it extracted the bag from the container. (The canopy was an appropriate size for the container, btw).

As for the main, never jumped a Stiletto but I get the impression that it isn't a great choice (as mentioned already). I have wingsuited a Saber2 and it worked great, snivels a little more than I like but the openings were fine, 150 should still be ok if you are comfortable with the WL, starts getting iffy around 120/135 with huge suits from what I've observed.

The SkySnatch is of course a nice PC, but IMHO, a bit of overkill for skydiving, not to mention $$$.

[Lethal1ty17 0]

Anachronist

The SkySnatch is of course a nice PC, but IMHO, a bit of overkill for skydiving, not to mention $$$.

I spent $30 more to get my SkySnatch vs the cost of a brand new equivalent PC through UPT. $30 more for potentially better and more stable openings in my WS? Worth it 100%.

[IronEddie42 0]

I jump several big suits regularly (Jedei 2, Rebel, etc) and I've flown pretty much all of them out there. Nearly 1000 WS jumps so far and my current setup is a 12' bridle with a 30" F111 pilot chute and I have not had a single PC hesitation. As I've gone through the different iterations of suits (small, medium, big, huge) I've changed both my PC size and bridle length and I'd expect that most people do the same thing.

[phoenixlpr 0]

Lethal1ty17

***The SkySnatch is of course a nice PC, but IMHO, a bit of overkill for skydiving, not to mention $$$.

I spent $30 more to get my SkySnatch vs the cost of a brand new equivalent PC through UPT. $30 more for potentially better and more stable openings in my WS? Worth it 100%.

I had a couple severe line-twist, which I can not explain better than PC oscillation. The first third of my lines from the canopy was spoon up 2-3 times. I pulled high, but I could not resolve any of those other means than cutting away and landing with my reserve.

The price difference of a regular PC and a SkySnatch is about 2 reserve pack job. I'm considering to get one and try it.

[Lethal1ty17 0]

phoenixlpr

******The SkySnatch is of course a nice PC, but IMHO, a bit of overkill for skydiving, not to mention $$$.

I spent $30 more to get my SkySnatch vs the cost of a brand new equivalent PC through UPT. $30 more for potentially better and more stable openings in my WS? Worth it 100%.

I had a couple severe line-twist, which I can not explain better than PC oscillation. The first third of my lines from the canopy was spoon up 2-3 times. I pulled high, but I could not resolve any of those other means than cutting away and landing with my reserve.

The price difference of a regular PC and a SkySnatch is about 2 reserve pack job. I'm considering to get one and try it.

Where are you getting a $15 reserve pack job? It was $30 more for a SkySnatch vs the same sized bridle/PC from UPT.

[lyosha 50]

For what it's worth - if ordering a new container get an F111 pilot chute. A lot of the "stability" of the snatch is due to the fact that it is a vented pilot chute.

A little while ago I spoke to a UPT rep at a boogie who was jumping some crotch rocket swoop machine about his PC. I don't remember the exact size, but it was HUGE and F111. He said in PD's testing F111 PCs performed substantially better than ZP ones - much less oscillation.

[skow 6]

lyosha

For what it's worth - if ordering a new container get an F111 pilot chute. A lot of the "stability" of the snatch is due to the fact that it is a vented pilot chute.

A little while ago I spoke to a UPT rep at a boogie who was jumping some crotch rocket swoop machine about his PC. I don't remember the exact size, but it was HUGE and F111. He said in PD's testing F111 PCs performed substantially better than ZP ones - much less oscillation.

that's a known fact. That's why in base you see (almost) only F111 or vented ZP PCs (when we talk about terminal jumps)

[wasatchrider 0]

all my base pilot chutes for terminal are zp non vented my 32 that is now my skydive pc my, both 36 and my 38

BASE 1519