Base canopy? Skydiving canopy? (7cell v 9cell)

[andy2 0]

Bear with this newbieish post if you can to help me clarify a few things...

I recently started skydiving with the intent to rapidly progress through and move onto BASE. I thought that skydiving would be fun but that the experience that I needed for BASE would be the most important. Now, I realize I won't be able to BASE jump as soon as I thought, and that skydiving in itself is amazing. I still want to BASE jump though within a hundred or so jumps. I am a poor college student, and was wondering why for skydiving everyone uses a 9 cell canopy, and BASE uses a 7 cell. I was wondering if using a 7 cell canopy for skydiving to get used to how it handled and flew in preparation for BASE was done? Also, I keep hearing that for BASE you need these incredibly big canopies, like 220-240 ft2. I'm a light guy and could easily see progressing to a 190-170 for skydiving within a matter of jumps. Do people use small canopies for BASE? Why not if not? I would think the smaller the canopy in the hands of someone who has experience flying it, would make for a more precision landing. I guess my main question is can I buy my canopy once I get off student rental rigs for skydiving but with the intention of switching it over to a dedicated BASE rig?

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let my inspiration flow,
in token rhyme suggesting rhythm...

[Faber 0]

well as im still a newbie i think you should waut and see what other means but heres my oppinion.

7 cell are used as reserves and pressisions canopies in skyworld.They are becours then are slow,and acurate.

We use bigger canopies to BASE so the canopiride get less stressfull.think of the situration were the canopi makes a 180 in opening(last killed by this were the 5.thApril,find it other place on this forum).Think if he had a 150sqft racer canopi,he wouldnt have any chances at all.He did but failed

I wouldnt recomend to buy a skydive canopi to convert when you will start.Buy a BASE canopi just before you is starting and then make some skydives(whit reserve and AAD).Rember different jobs,different gear.

Stay safe
Stefan Faber

[DexterBase 1]

I think it it going to become more and more common to see newbie skydivers coming out to the DZ saying, "I want to BASE jump so I'm here to get a few skydives".

BASE is growing and there are many people noticing the sport. When I witnessed my first BASE jump in 1997 under a bridge, (we were there for a different but equally sinister purpose) it was terribly hard to find out anything about this sport. But it was exciting so I searched on...

Showing up to a DZ with an attitude of only using skydiving as a necessary evil is usually met with a poor attitude from non BASE jumpers. But like I said, it's going to become more common. Skydiving is a blast and extremely rewarding. Many people who start skydiving as a means to one day BASE jump, never actually start BASE. They get caught up in RW or Freeflying. They lose sight of what attracted them to the sport in the first place, for the better usually. A few however, see it through and gather the tools they will need to start BASE as safely as is currently possible.

(stay with me this IS going somewhere)

If you're a new skydiver, my opinion is forget about BASE. Concentrate on being a good skydiver. You will have more fun and none of your jumps will seem like you're spinning your wheels because you only want to BASE jump. Establish goals within skydiving and your need to BASE jump will either dissolve, or burn stronger. Then buy BASE gear and find a mentor and learn your ass off!

If you're dead set on being a BASE jumper (and you're a poor college student) then I would suggest a different approach. Don't buy a 9 cell canopy. Resist the temptation to start swooping. Buy a BASE specific canopy (Fox, Mojo, ACE, etc...) and jump that. Most people at the DZ won't understand why you're doing it and will talk a lot of smack about BASE jumpers. I've been called a "damn rock hopper" on several occasions. (But then again I've also caught myself trying to land a 9 cell sabre like a Fox.)

Anyway, I guess I've been long winded but basically, If you're intending to only be a BASE jumper, then there is no harm in skydiving a BASE specific canopy from the early days of your jumping. And get used to people not understanding why you're doing it, you're gonna get the same reactions as a BASE jumper anyway.

Sorry if I didn't get into the differences between 7 and 9 cell canopies. Theres a TON of information here as well as Blinc. Read my friend, read.

Stay safe out there! ---Dex

[andy2 0]

cool, I was definitely looking for someone to say yeah save your bones and go right for a BASE specific canopy. I can't be dishing out hundreds of dollars for gear that I want to use. I would if I could, but...

That said, I recognize the fact that I very well might get distracted with how much fucking fun jumping from airplanes is, but even after my first few initial jumps I still have burning in the back of my mind how cool it would be to hike out in the woods, alone, and jump off shit...

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let my inspiration flow,
in token rhyme suggesting rhythm...

[Faber 0]

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Buy a BASE specific canopy (Fox, Mojo, ACE, etc...) and jump that. Most people at the DZ won't understand why you're doing it and will talk a lot of smack about BASE jumpers

Is that alowed in US?Its not in DK while we need papers from the manufactor which we dont get at BASE canopies..Thats why we here have to jump our BASE canopies at skydives when theres no instructors and so on...

Just a Q...

Stay safe
Stefan Faber

[Dd0g 0]

I think Dexter is referring to packing a BASE canopy into a skydiving container complete with reserve, Cypres, etc. That is legal in the US, and is a great way to learn the ins and outs of flying and landing a BASE canopy without doing so from BASE objects.

I've never owned a skydiving rig, as I was one of those folks who showed up at the DZ with my goal being BASE, not skydiving. And now look at me! I'm the poster canine for why the DZ should have turned me away and blackisted me for good

Peace,

D-d0g

+~+~+~+~
But this, surely, was the glory that no spirits, canine or human, had ever clearly seen, the light that never was on land or sea, and yet is glimpsed by the quickened mind everywhere.

[Faber 0]

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Dexter is referring to packing a BASE canopy into a skydiving container complete with reserve, Cypres, etc

same is i..In DK its ellegalI have only 1 skydive on the small of my BASE canopies
But will sure give my bigger one a shot before i go real jumping´again.

Stay safe
Stefan Faber

[covey 0]

I am just starting out in skydiving myself. I should finish up my jumps for my A license this weekend if the weather cooperates. I jump a PD230 for my AFF. then when down to a 220. Both are 9 cells. A friend at the DZ let me use there rig with a Spectre 190 in it. The Spectre is a 7 cell. This got me questioning the diffrerences between 9 and 7. Basically the answer I got was that a 9 has more forward drive hence shallower descent path. The 7 flies slower but come down steeper. I am currently demoing a Spectre 210 but only have one jump on it due to wx. I am going to try a 190 next then a Sabre2 190. The Sabre is a 9 so it will be interesting to actually see the difference. I would assume the reason you would stay big for BASE is to keep you forward speed down. That way it would be easier to get into short tight spots. Like I said total assumption since i am not a BASE jumper. You know what they say about assuming too. Good luck on your training progression. Perhaps you can find room in your heart for both sports.

Believe those who are seeking truth. Doubt those who find it. -Andre Gide

[TomAiello 26]

Most of my advice on starting into BASE is here.

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I was wondering if using a 7 cell canopy for skydiving to get used to how it handled and flew in preparation for BASE was done?

It is done. It is also definitely recommended.

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Also, I keep hearing that for BASE you need these incredibly big canopies, like 220-240 ft2.

I laughed when I read your idea of "incredibly big". I generally jump canopies in the 280-290 range, but I am considering upsizing to the 310-330 sizes.

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I'm a light guy and could easily see progressing to a 190-170 for skydiving within a matter of jumps. [emphasis added]

If BASE is really what you want to get into, you need to reverse your skydiving mindset. You seem to view downsizing as progress. Why? I bet it's because the guys at the DZ have told you something like "as you get better, you'll jump smaller canopies". In BASE, it's totally opposite. In general, the more experienced a BASE jumper is, the larger a canopy (and lighter a wingloading) they are jumping.
If you are intent on BASE, immediately say to yourself "downsizing is not progress...downsizing is not progress." Repeat as necessary, until you really feel it.

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Do people use small canopies for BASE?

Yep. I once met a tiny little girl who jumped canopies in the 190 range. In general, BASE wingloading is around .75 pounds of exit weight per square foot of canopy. That's just a generalization, though. How much do you weigh?

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Why not if not?

More heavily loaded canopies fly faster, land harder, and are more sensitive to minor changes in packing and body position in terms of opening heading.

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I would think the smaller the canopy in the hands of someone who has experience flying it, would make for a more precision landing.

This is totally wrong. Accuracy jumpers use big, BASE-sizeish canopies. More square footage over your head is always useful in hitting smaller, or rougher, landing areas. BASE canopies should fly slow and land soft--in other words, they should be big.

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I guess my main question is can I buy my canopy once I get off student rental rigs for skydiving but with the intention of switching it over to a dedicated BASE rig?

Certainly. If you buy a BASE canopy, and put it in a large skydiving rig, you can easily switch it over and use it for BASE. In fact, this is a very good idea. The extra practice you get on the canopy could be the difference between a broken leg and a landing you walk away from.
If you really want to focus on BASE, make your first canopy a real BASE canopy (Ace, Mojo, FOX, Troll, Dagger or Flik), sized appropriately for you in the BASE environment. You'll be far, far better prepared to BASE jump if you start learning the canopy now.
To re-iterate: in a BASE canopy, you want big, soft and slow.
Downsizing is only progress at the dropzone.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[motherhucker 0]

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If you're dead set on being a BASE jumper (and you're a poor college student) then I would suggest a different approach. Don't buy a 9 cell canopy. Resist the temptation to start swooping.

Good post.
with all due respect though, I disagree with the quote above. DON'T resist the temptation to learn everything there is to know about parachutes. This includes swooping. The more time under a parachute you have, the longer you will likely survive in BASE (and skydiving). If you're a poor college student (which I was when I started--and am...STILL) I hate to say it, but tough shit...If you want to be a poor BROKEN college student, fine. Otherwise I suggest you make your education pay for those expensive [parachute] habits you have. BE COOL--STAY IN SCHOOL.
but I digress...
Although BASE-specific canopies fly differently than a VX, or spectre, or whatever skydiving canopy you use, they still function based on the same principles of flight. Speed still equals lift, and your thousands of jumps will gain you the experience you need to know when and how to tell your canopy what to do when, in order to get you safely where you need to land.

Yes...I'm a canopy Nazi--
but I also hate seeing people bounce and/or break themselves whilst particioating in my favorite sport. Remember that every time someone goes in, we're one step closer to losing objects and being marginalized that much further.

OK, I'm a selfish Canopy Nazi. Sig Fuckin' Heil--Hook it.

[DexterBase 1]

oooooohhhh.... Good one. You got me. You make a good point here. Thanks for pointing this out. heh heh ---Dex

[skypuppy 1]

Question, Tom.

So would you suggest a vented or non-vented BASE canopy for skydiving with to gain experience??? Do vented and/or valved canopies open any harder on terminal openings? Are they going to undergo exorbitant wear during the learning phases of a students career (this could be a couple hundred skydives or more, don't you think?)

Or would it be a good idea to buy a non-vented BASE canopy at first and then get the vents or valves retro-fitted when you're ready to advance???

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone