riggersam 1 #1 December 19, 2003 I was surprised to see a manufacturer still selling Type-17 risers for BASE: Relax BASE Container Are many people still using them? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #2 December 19, 2003 Nobody uses type 17 risers. What you see on that site is what happens when a skydiving manufaturer decides to start making base rigs, without a fucking clue as to what they are doing. I hope nobody ever buys one of these rigs from such an obvious group of market oportunists. BASE610 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base428 1 #3 December 19, 2003 This is incredible. Type 17 risers don't belong on a base rig, let along in skydiving. Risers take up minimal space on a rig, so I could never understand why anyone would want to purchase the SMALLEST, WEAKEST riser available. Common sense should tell us to use products (skydiving or BASE) that have high breaking strengths. If you break a riser, you will probably end your reign on earth, unless the water below saves you. What's next? Microlined BASE canopies with BASE slinks? Merry Christmas everyone!(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faber 0 #4 December 19, 2003 QuoteWhat's next? Microlined BASE canopies with BASE slinks? along whith pc and slider colaps merry xmas to you aswell wooohoo im off work for 16 days... Stay safe Stefan Faber Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base698 14 #5 December 19, 2003 I have to use Mini Risers with my current canopy to pull the slider down behind me. As for BASE its a silly thing to offer and I don't see the point. I do know people who use PD Reserve slinks for BASE. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
czechbase 0 #6 December 19, 2003 Can slinks handle the shock on opening??? Man, if you lost a riser......www.motavi.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
narcimund 0 #7 December 19, 2003 Has a riser ever broken on a jump? First Class Citizen Twice Over Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Faber 0 #8 December 19, 2003 i think i saw a video once were somting like that happened,the guy/gal(i dunno) were saved by a slider that kept it together and water to a BIG splas landing i Think Tom talked about it here some time ago i cant rember were.And sorry i cant rember which video it were(a Aussie video comes to mind?) Stay safe Stefan Faber Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base428 1 #9 December 19, 2003 "The Pick" broke a Type 17 riser off a very tall cliff in California many years back.(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base704 0 #10 December 19, 2003 I know the guy that 698 is talkin' about, and he's been jumpin' slinks for a good while. He also pops in here, so I'm thinkin' that he'll probably stop by and share his thoughts.You can get a lot more done with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blair700 0 #11 December 19, 2003 Slink Post Later Blair Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Treejumps 0 #12 December 19, 2003 Easy there on mini risers for skydiving. When you are swooping at 60+ mph, mini risers are half the surface area, plus they allow for dropping the slider. But for base, well I've said my piece on that. Cya. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites base428 1 #13 December 19, 2003 I guess I think a little differently than some. I think along the lines of material size, strength, and history. Mini-risers serve no purpose to me in BASE or skydiving, as they are more susceptible to breakage and I'm not pulling my slider down behind me. Let's look at the numbers: Type 8 = 1.719" wide. Tensile Strength: 4000 lbs. Type 17 = 1.000" wide. Tensile Strength: 2500 lbs. There is only a 0.719" width difference between the two, but a considerable difference in tensile strength. It's up to everyone to make their own gear decisions. -Slinks or connector links. -Mesh slider tied down or removed. -Type 8 or Type 17 risers. -Collapsible versus standard BASE pilot chutes. -Large 3-rings or small 3-rings -Quick release toggles or standard toggles. -Slider bumpers secured or not secured to connector link. For me, I use connector links, mesh slider tied town, Type 8 risers, standard PC's, large 3-rings, quick release toggles, and slider bumpers secured.(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites link1 0 #14 December 19, 2003 My last jump on my Stiletto opened VERY hard and broke 4 lines. When I was packing it up to send to PD I noticed that the Type 17 riser was almost severed at the point of contact with the large ring...doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TomAiello 26 #15 December 19, 2003 I know of three very experienced (1000+ jumps) jumpers (I was one of them) who have emailed the manufacturer pointing out that the design is flawed. None of us has received any response from the manufacturer. I started asking about the risers in 2001, when I spotted a newbie jumper (who apparently didn't know any better) jumping them in Italy. I emailed his mentor, who straightened him out (and made him a new set of risers). I wouldn't jump any gear from a manufacturer who seems so unconcerned about obviously substandard equipment.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites robibird 3 #16 December 19, 2003 Guys, As I said....ONE DAY!!! Materials getting better and better every day and we are here to explore the way how to apply new technology to our lovely activity . I hope most of you will agree w me. regards and happy holidays to all Robi side note: I am jumping with permanent conected risers . No 3-ring , no D link = no fear to lose the canopy Robert Pecnik robert@phoenix-fly.com www.phoenix-fly.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TomAiello 26 #17 December 19, 2003 QuoteI was surprised to see a manufacturer still selling Type-17 risers for BASE. It's not "still". They introduced the rig well after the practice was abandoned in the general BASE community. As several people have pointed out, I think just didn't know better, having failed to research the standard gear conventions for the sport.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites czechbase 0 #18 December 19, 2003 Which manufacturer/s offer permanently connected risers? What if you have a tree/water landing and you need to cut away the canopy??www.motavi.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TomAiello 26 #19 December 19, 2003 QuoteWhich manufacturer/s offer permanently connected risers? I'm pretty sure that they'll all build such a system on request. QuoteWhat if you have a tree/water landing and you need to cut away the canopy?? Then you're hosed. Since Robert can pretty much deploy directly over his landing area on a wingsuit jump, I bet that's a non-issue for him.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites riggersam 1 #20 December 19, 2003 The link I originally posted no longer works and the rig isn't visible on their website any more. I guess they got the message. Mark BASE 346 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites base428 1 #21 December 19, 2003 Robert, You are correct that every year, we come up with new ideas, concepts, materials, and toys to expand the sport of BASE and skydiving. If it wasn't for your creative mind, where would the wingsuit be today, if at all? There is a big difference between function and performance. Type 8 risers just need to function on a BASE jump, while on a skydive, others may need the performance aspect of a Type 17 riser. For connector links, performance is not really a requirement in my opinion, therefore the standard connector links work fine. And just so you don't think I'm old school and resistant to change, I'm currently working on the construction of a slider that can quickly transform from large hole mesh, to small hole mesh, and then to a sail slider.....all in about 20 seconds. No need to swap out sliders. The design is finished and I just need to build one. I've also got a nice 3-ring modification that would eliminate hard pulls during line twists, but that design is still being worked on in CAD. I also have a 3-ringless rig and I love it. Have a good one!!!(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites TomAiello 26 #22 December 19, 2003 Sigh... I was trying to create a separate discussion about the advancement of the gear. I think I'll cut and paste BASE428's comments into that thread...-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 0
base428 1 #13 December 19, 2003 I guess I think a little differently than some. I think along the lines of material size, strength, and history. Mini-risers serve no purpose to me in BASE or skydiving, as they are more susceptible to breakage and I'm not pulling my slider down behind me. Let's look at the numbers: Type 8 = 1.719" wide. Tensile Strength: 4000 lbs. Type 17 = 1.000" wide. Tensile Strength: 2500 lbs. There is only a 0.719" width difference between the two, but a considerable difference in tensile strength. It's up to everyone to make their own gear decisions. -Slinks or connector links. -Mesh slider tied down or removed. -Type 8 or Type 17 risers. -Collapsible versus standard BASE pilot chutes. -Large 3-rings or small 3-rings -Quick release toggles or standard toggles. -Slider bumpers secured or not secured to connector link. For me, I use connector links, mesh slider tied town, Type 8 risers, standard PC's, large 3-rings, quick release toggles, and slider bumpers secured.(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
link1 0 #14 December 19, 2003 My last jump on my Stiletto opened VERY hard and broke 4 lines. When I was packing it up to send to PD I noticed that the Type 17 riser was almost severed at the point of contact with the large ring...doesn't make me feel warm and fuzzy!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #15 December 19, 2003 I know of three very experienced (1000+ jumps) jumpers (I was one of them) who have emailed the manufacturer pointing out that the design is flawed. None of us has received any response from the manufacturer. I started asking about the risers in 2001, when I spotted a newbie jumper (who apparently didn't know any better) jumping them in Italy. I emailed his mentor, who straightened him out (and made him a new set of risers). I wouldn't jump any gear from a manufacturer who seems so unconcerned about obviously substandard equipment.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
robibird 3 #16 December 19, 2003 Guys, As I said....ONE DAY!!! Materials getting better and better every day and we are here to explore the way how to apply new technology to our lovely activity . I hope most of you will agree w me. regards and happy holidays to all Robi side note: I am jumping with permanent conected risers . No 3-ring , no D link = no fear to lose the canopy Robert Pecnik robert@phoenix-fly.com www.phoenix-fly.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #17 December 19, 2003 QuoteI was surprised to see a manufacturer still selling Type-17 risers for BASE. It's not "still". They introduced the rig well after the practice was abandoned in the general BASE community. As several people have pointed out, I think just didn't know better, having failed to research the standard gear conventions for the sport.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
czechbase 0 #18 December 19, 2003 Which manufacturer/s offer permanently connected risers? What if you have a tree/water landing and you need to cut away the canopy??www.motavi.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #19 December 19, 2003 QuoteWhich manufacturer/s offer permanently connected risers? I'm pretty sure that they'll all build such a system on request. QuoteWhat if you have a tree/water landing and you need to cut away the canopy?? Then you're hosed. Since Robert can pretty much deploy directly over his landing area on a wingsuit jump, I bet that's a non-issue for him.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggersam 1 #20 December 19, 2003 The link I originally posted no longer works and the rig isn't visible on their website any more. I guess they got the message. Mark BASE 346 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base428 1 #21 December 19, 2003 Robert, You are correct that every year, we come up with new ideas, concepts, materials, and toys to expand the sport of BASE and skydiving. If it wasn't for your creative mind, where would the wingsuit be today, if at all? There is a big difference between function and performance. Type 8 risers just need to function on a BASE jump, while on a skydive, others may need the performance aspect of a Type 17 riser. For connector links, performance is not really a requirement in my opinion, therefore the standard connector links work fine. And just so you don't think I'm old school and resistant to change, I'm currently working on the construction of a slider that can quickly transform from large hole mesh, to small hole mesh, and then to a sail slider.....all in about 20 seconds. No need to swap out sliders. The design is finished and I just need to build one. I've also got a nice 3-ring modification that would eliminate hard pulls during line twists, but that design is still being worked on in CAD. I also have a 3-ringless rig and I love it. Have a good one!!!(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #22 December 19, 2003 Sigh... I was trying to create a separate discussion about the advancement of the gear. I think I'll cut and paste BASE428's comments into that thread...-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
