Zennie 0 #1 May 4, 2004 Just wanted to report back on the rig cleaning thread I posted earlier. Yesterday I had planned on making a jump off of a new B. I pulled my rig out of my stash bag and was hit with a smell that vaguely resembled sweat socks that had been tossed in a dark corner and forgotten about for a few weeks. Didn't give me warm fuzzies about the state of my gear, so I decided now was the time to clean it. I cut away the main, filled the tub with cold water and some Woolite. I let the lines soak and then worked them about 3 or 4 times. Then I threw in the rest of the canopy. I can't even begin to tell you how nasty the water was in the first couple of rinses, but about 4 rinses later the water finally went clear and I hung it up to dry. The container got a similar treatment. I checked both this morning and they're mostly dry and they look almost like new again. The lines still have a few mildew spots, but other than that, it looks 1000% better. - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #2 May 4, 2004 Oh and I'd like to add that my rig now smells springtime fresh. *sniff* MMMmmmmmmmmmmmmm..... - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ScottishJohn 25 #3 May 7, 2004 What is woolite ? Is there a similar product in the UK that can be used.---------------------------------------------------------------------- If you think my attitude stinks you should smell my fingers Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #4 May 7, 2004 Woolite is a non-detergent fabric wash. I'm sure there is a comparable UK product. If you ask a rigger, they might be able to tell you what it is. It's also the same stuff that climbers use to wash ropes, so a climbing shop might be able to point you in the right direction (just don't buy the super-expensive "rope wash" stuff, that's basically Woolite in a different bottle at ten times the price).-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brits17 0 #5 May 7, 2004 I would like to hear ideas on the affect of Woolite on the actual canopy. I use it always to clean containers, but have never 'washed' a canopy other than with a damp towel. _______________________ aerialkinetics.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #6 May 7, 2004 I've gotten reactions of "you did what?" to "no big deal" and everything in between. Among the appalled, the Woolite didn't seem to be as much of an issue as totally immersing my canopy. Yes the rule is don't get your canopy wet. But anyone who has jumped in our swamps (I know you have Brit ) knows that keeping your gear dry is pretty much unavoidable. Our rigs are going to get wet doing what we do. And look at swoopers. I don't think they go a weekend without getting their rig soaked at least once. I'm not advocating getting your canopy wet with reckless abandon, or washing your canopy every week, but I can't imagine that giving it a good cleaning every once in a while (once a year maybe?) can be THAT terrible. But then again, you're the rigger and I'm not. Also, can anyone comment on the difference in reaction to water that the varying fabric types might have? Does ZP or F-111 react differently? - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #7 May 7, 2004 Soap, detergent, whatever, breaks the surface tension of water allowing it to soak into the fabric and helps release the dirt from the fibers. Agitation will assist to "shake" the dirt away from the fibers and allow it too be rinsed away. Agitating a parachute in water is a bad Idea. Lets talk about calendaring. When the f-111 fabric is woven together, the strands are still round. (use any piece of thread as an example or a rope for an exaggerated example) Calendaring is the process of smashing the strands flat using heated rollers. Smashing the threads flat will reduce the permeability of the fabric. As the canopy ages, the threads will slowly round out a little from the shock of the canopy opening and spreading out the weave. Packing and crumpling a canopy has some affect as well. Dunking a parachute into water will increase the permeability. It soaks into the strands and just like a sponge it will swell. As it dries the threads are no longer smashed flat. Parachutes can take a water landing fairly well as many BASE jumpers have come to realize. Adding the Woolite… which as stated earlier breaks the surface tension of water, will increase the amount of water the strands can soak in therefore, rounding the threads out even more … which will increase the permeability. As it dries, the fabric and load tapes can shrink at different rates causing the canopy to be slightly distorted from original.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #8 May 7, 2004 I should have measured my lines before I washed to get a baseline, but I'll measure my lines (including the load tapes) this weekend and report back here. - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,442 #9 May 7, 2004 I'm not a BASE jumper (saw the pointer to this thread in G&R), but I have washed F111 canopies a couple of times, using Woolite and dishwashing liquid. I daisy-chained the lines loosely and tied them into a pillow case to avoid tangling and rubbing damage from the hardware. In the washing machine, on the gentlest cycle. It was loaded at about .7 (I'm from the past), and as far as I could tell it didn't affect the canopy. Of course, I was opening it from an airplane, and interested in landing on the DZ. Plus the Dacron lines come out all spiffy-looking... Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brits17 0 #10 May 7, 2004 Sensible explanation. Thanks. What about ZP material now? What is it that makes its air permeability 0, and F-111 0-3 cfm? Zero porosity fabric does not go through the calendering process correct? Will an applicant such as Woolite or any other H20 surface tension breaker affect the porosity level of the canopy as much as it affects F-111? I assume not, but cannot fingerpoint exactly why. Wow, lots of question marks in this post. _______________________ aerialkinetics.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #11 May 7, 2004 I have a Sharpchuter reserve that I'd be willing to donate to science. I can take some baseline measurements (load tape lengths, lengths to cascades, cascades to connectors... not sure how to measure the canopy itself or get porosity measurements) and then dunk-dry-measure repeatedly. The results should be interesting I'd think. - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brits17 0 #12 May 7, 2004 QuoteSensible explanation. Thanks. What about ZP material now? What is it that makes its air permeability 0, and F-111 0-3 cfm? Ok the coating. QuoteZero porosity fabric does not go through the calendering process correct? It does before the crispy creme coating covers the fabric. QuoteWill an applicant such as Woolite or any other H20 surface tension breaker affect the porosity level of the canopy as much as it affects F-111? I assume not, but cannot fingerpoint exactly why. So I guess this is my only question remaining. And what exactly is the 'coating' made from? Thanks to hookitt for the previous answers. _______________________ aerialkinetics.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggersam 1 #13 May 7, 2004 I believe that a layer of silicone is calendered into the material. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 0 #14 May 7, 2004 QuoteI have a Sharpchuter reserve that I'd be willing to donate to science. I can take some baseline measurements (load tape lengths, lengths to cascades, cascades to connectors... not sure how to measure the canopy itself or get porosity measurements) and then dunk-dry-measure repeatedly. The results should be interesting I'd think. You have been hanging out with Derek to much, maybe you need to freeze it also...you know for the sake of science.Fly it like you stole it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 1 #15 May 7, 2004 QuoteI believe that a layer of silicone is calendered into the material.Let's see if we can persuade groundzero or briangermain to answer this. I was under the impression it was done after the fact but you may very well be correct. I'm sending a PM to both of them. It's friday afternoon in their neck of the woods so it may take a while to get a response.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrianSGermain 1 #16 May 7, 2004 I recommend high pressure water for containers, as found at the car wash (those big water guns). It works great, and doesn't require and detergents at all. As for soaking a canopy, try not to do it if you can avoid it. It won't weaken the canopy, but may change the opening or flight chaacteristics. I think you should jump the canopy out of an airplane a few times before using it for base again. Pull high and make sure it is OK. Smells will go away on their own.Instructional Videos:www.AdventureWisdom.com Keynote Speaking:www.TranscendingFEAR.com Canopies and Courses:www.BIGAIRSPORTZ.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zennie 0 #17 May 8, 2004 Hey Brian, thanks for chiming in. I was hoping someone like you would throw in their $0.02. - Z "Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
