Dual riser turns

[donkeyboy 0]

After reading the post on toggles vs. risers and then Tom's post with DW's techniques on both rears then on both front and rear I was wondering if anyone has ever gone for both front and rear (same side) right off the bat and how the canopy turned ? This is how the 2 line foil stunt kites turn.

[mdbase 0]

Going along with this idea. Would a piece of riser material connected between the rear and front risers make a convenient single-point and fast way to pull both at the same time with the same hand.

You heard it here first - unless I'm way late with a tired and useless idea. Make sure if you put this on your rig you call it the MDBASE mod or like the b-mod or something cool.

-Bryan

-Bryan

I love base like a fat kid loves cake

[TomAiello 26]

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Going along with this idea. Would a piece of riser material connected between the rear and front risers make a convenient single-point and fast way to pull both at the same time with the same hand.

I wonder if you could just grab the slider and have the same effect?

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[The111 1]

You've probably already thought of this, but the connecting piece would have to be long enough that it was still slack when doing "single" (front or rear only) riser turns.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[TomAiello 26]

I've done test jumps (without a wall in front of me) like that. Vented canopies turned fairly well. Unvented canopies had lots of trouble (I think they need to get flying more before you can get them to turn that way). They just tended to waffle there until I let up and allowed them to inflate, then pulled down again to turn.

Still, I've never tried it with a direct frame of reference in front of me. Every time that happens, I'm too scared to mess around, and just grab both rears.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TomAiello 26]

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You've probably already thought of this, but the connecting piece would have to be long enough that it was still slack when doing "single" (front or rear only) riser turns.

Why? If a single piece gave significant speed gains in initiating the turn, it would be far more valuable than maintaining the ability to do a front (very rare) or rear (the place of which would be taken by the Bryan cord--my new name for this device) riser turn.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[mdbase 0]

Yo Tree,

Order the appropriate shit. Can you do the mod for me. I'll be the test dummy.

-Bryan

I love base like a fat kid loves cake

[Treejumps 0]

Yo B,

Get back to work. When you turn with a rear riser you slow down the side you pull while the other side keeps going, thus a turn is initiated. When you turn with front riser you accelerate that side of the cnaopy while the other side stays constant thus initiating a turn. If you pull both the front and the rear riser, you are merely changing the the yad of the canopy similar to a harness turn on a high perf. canopy. I would not expect much responsiveness out aof a giant BASE canopy in this fashion. I once tried to swoop the landing area at Kjerag on my mojo 310 by pulling my front riser to my chest (like a HP turn). My canopy did nothing and kept going straight and I had to toggle hook just to save my ass. The moral of the story is that base canopies are not very responsive thoses type of inputs.
Cya.

[mdbase 0]

edited because I did indeed misunderstand an important detail. And, I'm an idiot.

-Bryan

I love base like a fat kid loves cake

[Skinflicka 0]

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The moral of the story is that base canopies are not very responsive thoses type of inputs.
Cya.

Especially with a 16 foot tall lug hanging underneath.

I believe that's 5 separate beatings I've earned now.
One day Tree's gonna catch up with me and I'll get swatted.

You know I'm only funnin', right Tree? A gentle pounding should be enough.

$kin.

Prizes to anyone who gets to read my posts before Mr Aiello's son, Tom deletes them.

[chuckbrown 0]

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Going along with this idea. Would a piece of riser material connected between the rear and front risers make a convenient single-point and fast way to pull both at the same time with the same hand.

You heard it here first - unless I'm way late with a tired and useless idea. Make sure if you put this on your rig you call it the MDBASE mod or like the b-mod or something cool.

-Bryan

CReW Dawgs call this piece of material a "cross connector." Sorry. Seriously though, it's not used to turn but to secure another jumper's feet when flying a "planed" formation. I'll see if it works for turns and let you know.

[mdbase 0]

[reply
CReW Dawgs call this piece of material a "cross connector." Sorry.

[chuckbrown 0]

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I was just informed that , in skydiving, this cross connector has caused fatalities - something regarding the snapping of necks.

Care to share some more information on this?

[The111 1]

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You've probably already thought of this, but the connecting piece would have to be long enough that it was still slack when doing "single" (front or rear only) riser turns.

Why? If a single piece gave significant speed gains in initiating the turn, it would be far more valuable than maintaining the ability to do a front (very rare) or rear (the place of which would be taken by the Bryan cord--my new name for this device) riser turn.

Well, I don't know the relative usefulness of rear-riser turns and "Bryan-cord" turns, but obviously my statement was based on the assumption that you'd still want to be able to do each unique turn in different situations. I was just pointing out the obvious - that if the cord is too short you are giving up single rear-riser turns. Whether or not that's a bad thing, I'm not qualified to answer, since I'm a shitty canopy pilot and not a BASE jumper. :)

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[mdbase 0]

[Treejumps 0]

Luv your work mate.

Tree

[Treejumps 0]

The cross connector was used by crew dogs as a place to lock their feet into. The design, a piece of webbing running from FL to RR and FR to RL creates an X between the risers. At least one person had a hard opening in which the connector hit him in the back of the head/neck and snapped his neck. I don't have details or dates as this was a while ago, but I'm sure you could research and find out more about it. THe bottom line is that cross connectors are a bad idea and not for base. Even in thory I don't see how the idea could possibly work.

Cya.

[councilman24 37]

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The design, a piece of webbing running from FL to RR and FR to RL creates an X between the risers.

Just lurking the base forum, but I've never seen cross connectors for CRW of this design. Long ago a cross connector was maditory on CHEST MOUNT reserves so that if one hook was left unsnaped the canopy wouldn't deflate. This was probably was applied to round mains but I honestly cann't remember, even though I had one. This idea became a front to front link connector for CRW so that tension on a planed CRW formation wouldn't cause the upper jumper to slid up pulling the slider and collapsing the canopy. It was realized that side to side probably wasn't a good idea, maybe because of a fatality. So now cross connectors are front to rear on each side, exactly like the idea above. Don't know whether they'll turn a Base canopy or not.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[chuckbrown 0]

Thanks. Cross connectors now run only from front to rear risers on the same side. No X between risers. If you're not doing CRW, I can see no value in cross connectors; as far as a control input, it seems that it would only cause air to spill out of the opposite side and only cause one to lose altitude. I doubt there would be any turn resulting, only a sideways slide.