Problems standing it up

[base736 0]

I've done my best to hide it for years, but I'm finally ready to admit it... I have problems standing it up.

I fly a Fox 245 VTec (no valves) loaded at very nearly 0.7:1. My landing areas tend to be at 3,000-4,000 feet MSL in dry air. I consider myself a good 7-cell canopy pilot -- I've been jumping this setup for better than 80 jumps (over four years), and competed in CRW for a couple of years before I started into BASE.

In moderate (say, coming up on 5 mph) and better winds, I can stand up my landings without a problem, consistently. I can sink it in, I can come in out of a turn... It's all good. No wind, though, and I'm useless -- I either come skidding in on my hands and knees (three cheers for the guy who invented gloves and armour, by the way) or drop out of the sky unceremoniously to a nearly ankle-breaking stop.

... Which seems odd to me, since I should (in theory) be able to execute the same landing I do in higher winds, and walk it out. But anyway...

I was hoping somebody here could offer a little advice on landing this sort of configuration in no winds. Failing that, perhaps you might enjoy a chuckle at my expense?

[Zennie 0]

I was taught pretty early on that stand-up landings in the BASE environment can be somewhat dicey. You can easily land on uneven ground, hit a rock or divot and twist the heck out of your ankle.

Plus it's a great excuse for ugly landings... "Hey man, I'm just being SAFE!"

- Z
"Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon

[basehoundsam 0]

Demo another canopy...... and even in a larger size......... I own 3 seperate sized canopies for "Optimal" landings(which don't exist always!!). I personally like Daggers...... they feel a bit sexy(speedy)..... but land with the strongest flare of all.(just my .02)

Jay Epstein Ramirez
www.adrenalineexploits.com

[JaapSuter 0]

I'm assuming you did, but I'll ask anyway; did you tune the position of your toggles?

Have you done any rear riser landings in zero winds? Oddly enough I have found rear riser landings to be softer than some of my flared landings, until I properly tuned my toggle setting. I'm not sure what that means, but it surprised me.

[Faber 0]

did youconsidder the 5th line mod on your fox? i didnt liked it but it gives you a more powerfull flare.

If you dont want that then try "hitting the brakes" at the last moment(dont hook in),and you might even get a slight swoop..

Ive had the same problem on my Fox but after practice im getting better..

And as Blair said its safe to PLF(when your foot aint getting caught or snag somthing)

Stay safe
Stefan Faber

[PerFlare 0]

Hi,

I have the same problem. I have about 400 jumps on my v-tec without valves ... I actually send in back after the 20-30 first jumps on it, but it is a feature *smile*

Zero winds and landing on payment, ouch!

You can ad a extra breakline or the better alternative, put valves in it. Apex and other manufactures retrofit valves.

I have more rigs and my v-tec is old so for me it is questionable if it is worth it but if you have a "newer" canopy ... get the money and do it

PerFlare

[FIREFLYR 0]

I've made 54 BASE jumps and stood up all but 3.
I have short arms (im 5'8") and attatch mt toggles about 6"up the lines from where suggesyed. so far so good.
-J

"One flew East,and one flew West..............one flew over the cuckoo's nest"
"There's absolutely no excuse for the way I'm about to act"

[Bryguy1224 12]

Jamie,
That's because you got the Mojo flowing. Hope you have a good time in Europe, I plan on making the trip next year.

[FIREFLYR 0]

I did my first BASE jump a year ago today. It's been an interesting year huh Ody?
Got the Black Jack flowing too now
I'll make a few for you this Mem day.
~J

"One flew East,and one flew West..............one flew over the cuckoo's nest"
"There's absolutely no excuse for the way I'm about to act"

[Bryguy1224 12]

I still remember " I'm Rick James Bitch" How about that top shelf "El Presidente' Margarita. Its only lunch time.
I got a black jack also. Havn't jumped it yet. Ill get around to it come december when I get back.

[Treejumps 0]

At 250#, and upwards of 1:1 on my Fox 285, and only slightly better on my Mojo 310, I can standaup my landings about half of the time, but I only even try if the lz is clean and I know I have a good setup. Its just not worth the risk.

Remember, you don't have to stand up, you just have to (be able) get up.

[SafetyNate 0]

Ody,
I have your black jack! It lands great. You have done enough for us back home, you didnt have to go and give me your brand new Black Jack. I was surprised how strong it was, the barb wire only put six small holes in it when I ripped it off the fence.

Safety Nate

[Bryguy1224 12]

just doing what I can to help spread democracy.

[outrager 6]

  Quote

I fly a Fox 245 VTec (no valves) loaded at very nearly 0.7:1. My landing areas tend to be at 3,000-4,000 feet MSL in dry air.

That explains it

VTec without valves has a very poor flare, compared to a regular valved or non-vtec canopy. It sinks down better, but the price for that is inferior glide and flare.

I put V-Tec on one of my older Foxes, and the flare has suffered dramaticaly (i could directly compare it to my second non-vtec Fox).

bsbd!

Yuri.

[freakboy066 0]

It sounds like to me that you may have to take your toggle position up higher so that the tail comes down farther for flare.Have you had someone video your landings in these conditions and others.Video is a wonderful tool that should always be utilized.Sounds like you just need to readjust your toggle setting,or just take a rap.Hope this helps.

http://freakboy066.tripod.com/

[JohnnyUtah 0]

  Quote

I still remember " I'm Rick James Bitch" How about that top shelf "El Presidente' Margarita. Its only lunch time.
I got a black jack also. Havn't jumped it yet. Ill get around to it come december when I get back.

Ha ha that brings back good memories. That sure was a fun BASE Camp we had. Its good to see your still alive Bryan. When you coming home? Were going flickin when you do.

Have Fun, Don't Die!
Johnny Utah
My Website
email:johnny@johnnyutah.com

[ojf1982 0]

Bryan, are you back from Iraq?

The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over - Hunter S. Thompson

[BASE813 0]

I have found that most people with an unvalved canopy have problems standing it up in fast conditions..............

I thought this might be something to do with the air spilling from the vents on flaring and loosing a bit of performance............

but maybe my thinking is wrong?

Edit to add: I see someone else posted the same thought.............

[Bryguy1224 12]

No I'm still stuck in this shit hole of a country. I'll be home around Thanksgiving time. Probobly not soon enough for the turkey boogie. The family might get a little pissed if I get home and leave the next day to go BASE jump in Utah.

[chadkal 0]

I have an mdv troll, this canopy is also hard to stand up with no wind, it just seems to run out of flare long before I have stoped. I have actually flaredas far down as I could, then grabed both toggles in one hand, and reached back up for a handful of lines to flare some more. But with a little bit of wind it lands great

--------------------------------------------------
I am a greek midget

[BASE813 0]

mmmm............. my mdv lands just fine...

[TomAiello 26]

  Quote

I have actually flaredas far down as I could, then grabed both toggles in one hand, and reached back up for a handful of lines to flare some more.

I'd say you have the toggles set wrong. Have you tried moving them up the lines?

Toggle placement, like brake settings and tailgate location, ought to be customized for each jumper/canopy combination.

-- Tom Aiello

Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[Bryguy1224 12]

If you grind up a couple viagra and mix it in with your pack job your canopy will have no problem standing you up erect.

[John_Scher 0]

Toggle placement, like brake settings and tailgate location, ought to be customized for each jumper/canopy combination.

[gus 1]

  Quote

Is it not true that moving the toggles up more than two or so inches on a slider up configuration will prevent the canopy from flying on full drive as the toggles will hit the guide ring and the tail will be deflected downards?

Surely that depends on how much slack there is already in the braklines, before you move the toggles?

Gus

OutpatientsOnline.com