After spending over $7000 is it unreasonable to ask for a free reserve pack?

[Nerra 0]

  GooniesKid

***Just how many purchases need to be made in order to be considered a "loyal" customer?

For me, it's not about the number of purchases but about building a rapport with a local business

But what can I do as a 'customer' to build rapport other than purchase goods and smile?

[Nerra 0]

  normiss

No, it's an exact comparison.

You purchased an expensive item and now are required to pay a fee for a person to perform work to make the item legal to use.

Then you go to the internet to bitch about it.

I'm sure future riggers in your path are appreciative of that effort though.

SMH... read the original post.

[normiss 848]

Yeah..so..it would be unreasonable to even ask a stealership to cover the cost of making my vehicle legal.
Just like the rig I bought.
That I paid to have assembled.
As well as made legal.


Good luck with riggers and packers buddy.

[quade 4]

  Nerra

But what can I do as a 'customer' to build rapport other than purchase goods and smile?

Metaphorically put yourself in their position and attempt to see things from their point of view before complaining too hard.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Nataly 38]

Here is the key: *after* spending $7000, you have no negotiating power left. You should have requested a discount *before* spending that kind of money.

Also, unless I misunderstood you, I get that it's not that you wanted a free pack-job specifically, but rather there was a cost left of $60 and that you consider a $60 discount to be perfectly reasonable considering a total purchase of $7000. However, aside from it being "too late," there is the added problem that "$60 discount" sounds reasonable, but "free reserve repack" does not. Yes, technically $60 is $60, but associating a discount with the reserve repack was the wrong approach. In my opinion.

So the problems were: 1 - timing, 2 - perception/justification.

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[Nerra 0]

  normiss

Yeah..so..it would be unreasonable to even ask a stealership to cover the cost of making my vehicle legal.
Just like the rig I bought.
That I paid to have assembled.
As well as made legal.


Good luck with riggers and packers buddy.

You're missing the original point because you keep going on about the riggers.

No rigger is being short changed.

No rigger is expected to do the work for free.

No one thinks the rigger is charging too much.

No one questions the value of a rigger.

This is not about the rigger. This is about asking a company who has just received over $7000 in business to comp a service charge of $60.

What that service is is completely irrelevant. The person performing that service will still get paid.

[PLFXpert 0]

What about free shipping?

Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back.

[GooniesKid 0]

  Nerra

******Just how many purchases need to be made in order to be considered a "loyal" customer?

For me, it's not about the number of purchases but about building a rapport with a local business

But what can I do as a 'customer' to build rapport other than purchase goods and smile?

There are many ways actually.
The local gear store at my home DZ is staff by a wide range of jumpers; from straight from aff to local bad-ass sky gods. So what I do is i'd ask about the sport, ask if i can get on some jumps, who to contact for various disciplines, offer to split tunnel time, or just offer to buy beer at the end of the day.
Note: this is over a period of time not just in 1 day. also, you have to go into this genuinely and not expecting any kickback. Do it cuz you are really interested and want to be part of the community.

[normiss 848]

Yeah. I'm the one missing the point.


I paid for my first reserve pack job.
Without bitching about it.
Or going on the internet an whining about it.

I'm glad I missed the point come to think of it.

[rwieder 0]

  Quote

Yeah. I'm the one missing the point. I paid for my first reserve pack job. Without bitching about it.
Or going on the internet an whining about it. I'm glad I missed the point come to think of it.

This is good! At last we're in total agreement about something!!

[Nataly 38]

  Nerra

This is not about the rigger. This is about asking a company who has just received over $7000 in business to comp a service charge of $60.

What that service is is completely irrelevant. The person performing that service will still get paid.

You're missing the point. Timing and perception are everything.

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[Nerra 0]

  quade

***But what can I do as a 'customer' to build rapport other than purchase goods and smile?

Metaphorically put yourself in their position and attempt to see things from their point of view before complaining too hard.

Okay...

There is a customer in front of me who has happily spent over $7000 with me in the last couple of months and hasn't requested any form of discount. He has come back to purchase an item to the value of $1500. He is requesting a $60 discount. What a self-centered individual trying to take the food out of my mouth. Be gone fool!!


Well I completely understand where you're coming from now. I should have done that before, put myself in the shoes of that poor business owner.

[normiss 848]

Bound to happen, likely over a number of subjects.

[rwieder 0]

  Quote

Bound to happen, likely over a number of subjects.

That's a good thing Mark!

-Richard-
"You're Holding The Rope And I'm Taking The Fall"

[Nerra 0]

  Nataly

Here is the key: *after* spending $7000, you have no negotiating power left. You should have requested a discount *before* spending that kind of money.

Also, unless I misunderstood you, I get that it's not that you wanted a free pack-job specifically, but rather there was a cost left of $60 and that you consider a $60 discount to be perfectly reasonable considering a total purchase of $7000. However, aside from it being "too late," there is the added problem that "$60 discount" sounds reasonable, but "free reserve repack" does not. Yes, technically $60 is $60, but associating a discount with the reserve repack was the wrong approach. In my opinion.

So the problems were: 1 - timing, 2 - perception/justification.

Thanks Nataly, this is actually a good point and you're right, timing and perception are important.

As a business though, I would expect them to make the link and not see this as an insult to one of their riggers.

It would have been completely different if I had approached one of the riggers directly and been like, "Hey buddy, pack my reserve for free because I just spent a lot of money at the shop you work at".

[LuckyMcSwervy 0]

  Conundrum

Just how many purchases need to be made in order to be considered a "loyal" customer?

I don't have a good answer for that. I've been to a place (a dive shop) where I've been treated very well, haven't spent a dime, received excellent, knowledgeable and friendly service for what I've inquired about and I've sent people their way just on that alone. I don't think money always has to be exchanged in order to be loyal.

I know what I mean but I don't know if it's coming across as I'm intending...

Always be kinder than you feel.

[normiss 848]

You're missing the DZ to rigger relationship and agreements as well.
Which is why so many of us feel this would equate to asking a rigger to work for free.

[Nataly 38]

  Nerra

******But what can I do as a 'customer' to build rapport other than purchase goods and smile?

Metaphorically put yourself in their position and attempt to see things from their point of view before complaining too hard.

Okay...

There is a customer in front of me who has happily spent over $7000 with me in the last couple of months and hasn't requested any form of discount. He has come back to purchase an item to the value of $1500. He is requesting a $60 discount. What a self-centered individual trying to take the food out of my mouth. Be gone fool!!


Well I completely understand where you're coming from now. I should have done that before, put myself in the shoes of that poor business owner.


"$60 discount" = reasonable request
"Free reserve repack" = unreasonable request

Same thing, different reactions.

Asking before = more negotiating power
Asking after = zero negotiating power

Timing and perception... Timing and perception...

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[Nerra 0]

  normiss

Yeah. I'm the one missing the point.


I paid for my first reserve pack job.
Without bitching about it.
Or going on the internet an whining about it.

I'm glad I missed the point come to think of it.

19000+ posts. You win buddy!

[normiss 848]

Zero jumps.
You lose.

[Nataly 38]

  Nerra

As a business though, I would expect them to make the link and not see this as an insult to one of their riggers.

But you are the one who made the link between "discount" and "reserve repack"... Put the two together, and I get "free reserve repack." And that sounds like you are asking the rigger to work for free.

This is what the lady thought, this is what a lot of posters here thought, this is even what I thought initially. Plus you immediately start the thread with "free reserve repack" right in the title!! No matter how many times you explain it, the first reaction sticks. And the first reaction is that it is not reasonable to ask for a free reserve repack.

So again, your approach was flawed. In my opinion. You would have had a better reaction had *you* approached the matter differently. Again, just my opinion.

"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse."
- Chris Hadfield
« Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. »
- my boss

[LuckyMcSwervy 0]

Are you worried about the gear store reading what you've posted here and not wanting to do business with you any longer? What about the rigger(s)?

Just curious.

Always be kinder than you feel.

[Nerra 0]

  Nataly

***As a business though, I would expect them to make the link and not see this as an insult to one of their riggers.

But you are the one who made the link between "discount" and "reserve repack"... Put the two together, and I get "free reserve repack." And that sounds like you are asking the rigger to work for free.

This is what the lady thought, this is what a lot of posters here thought, this is even what I thought initially. Plus you immediately start the thread with "free reserve repack" right in the title!! No matter how many times you explain it, the first reaction sticks. And the first reaction is that it is not reasonable to ask for a free reserve repack.

So again, your approach was flawed. In my opinion. You would have had a better reaction had *you* approached the matter differently. Again, just my opinion.

I get what you're saying and in this case you're right judging by the replies.

I do think that in any other industry, it would be a non-issue. In snowboarding you get wax jobs, biking you get services, cars you get you oil changes. All of these are performed by hard working people that deserve to get paid. They still get paid... the company that is operating at a profit swallows the cost.

Someone mentioned free shipping... how is that any different to asking the company to cover the cost of a reserve pack? judging by the logic in this thread we're now saying it's okay for the UPS guy not to get paid. But we wouldn't think that because we assume he will still get paid and that it is the shop that swallows the cost of the shipping.

[GooniesKid 0]

  LuckyMcSwervy

***Just how many purchases need to be made in order to be considered a "loyal" customer?

I don't have a good answer for that. I've been to a place (a dive shop) where I've been treated very well, haven't spent a dime, received excellent, knowledgeable and friendly service for what I've inquired about and I've sent people their way just on that alone. I don't think money always has to be exchanged in order to be loyal.

I know what I mean but I don't know if it's coming across as I'm intending...

I get what you are saying. there's a local bar I frequent every Wednesday (when i'm in town). So it's gotten to the point where the bartenders, hostess, staff know my name. I would get 2 - 3 drinks, sliders, fries, or lobster rolls and call it a night. I'd also tip the final bill 30%. And I would do this for weeks, expecting no kickback or even asking for something extra. Then it happened, one day, the bartender would give me a complementary drink or complementary slider set. I don't always get free food or drinks but i built that rapport; know most of the veteran staff by first name, what they do after work, etc.

[Nerra 0]

  LuckyMcSwervy

Are you worried about the gear store reading what you've posted here and not wanting to do business with you any longer? What about the rigger(s)?

Just curious.

I presume this is in reference to me not naming the establishment?

I'm sure if they were to read this they could work out very quickly who I am.

I started the thread not to name and shame but to see if I was being unreasonable in the eyes of other skydivers.

It seems that I am.

Things I have learned from this thread:

1) It is completely unreasonable to ask for discount ever.

2) It is up to the customer to build trust and rapport with the retailer, not the other way round.

3) Large groups of people easily become single tracked about an issue taken completely out of context which would explain how someone like Bush was re-elected or even elected in the first place.

4) There is some underlying sore issue between riggers and retailers that I'm obviously unaware of.