alain 0 #1 November 17, 2004 I've allready found a lot of stuff in this forum but I still have one question pending... my concerns are 1 safety 2 durability 3 price 4 re-sale value look and fashion are not a concern options I've allready chosen are: hip articulated harness standart backpack (not quilted) standart hardware (no stainless or deluxe) large ring type 8 22" risers with inserts type 8 chest strap no cut-in laterals cardura BOC freestyle handle collapsible ZP PC wingsuit friendly options (9' bridle & opened bottom container) can someone explain what are the thread-thru and B-12 leg starp hardware ? pro and con of those ? any comments on my choices are welcome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mr2mk1g 10 #2 November 17, 2004 Virtually evenyone has thread-through leg straps these days. I bet they're what you are jumping now. B-12 snaps are those clip together leg straps you get on some student rigs or on very old rigs. They are very uncommon on modern rigs. I probably don't need to answer the rest of your questions if you know what B-12's are... I bet you don't want them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites alain 0 #3 November 17, 2004 ok, thanks ! 'just found a pic of those B12 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bigway 4 #4 November 17, 2004 I think you are missing the 2 important and excellent designs of the wings........that is the cut in laterals, they may even be free this month, i dont know. and the quited backpad, add extra comfort. The but in laterals are an excellent feature, i do not know about flying it with a birdman suit though. thread through is good but i am thinking that b-12 is like a hooh snap on, i am not sure though. Cut in laterals though and backpad, they offer something free every month so check there web site. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelpdiver 2 #5 November 17, 2004 QuoteI think you are missing the 2 important and excellent designs of the wings........that is the cut in laterals, they may even be free this month They were free last month. This month is lots of free pinstripe options. I think a lot of people jumped on the free laterals late - the wait time went from 4-5 weeks in early october when I ordered mine up to 8-9 weeks now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bigway 4 #6 November 17, 2004 they told me 12-weeks, and it took 12 weeks, fine by me. the laterals are worth the 150 dollars, i think it is a great part of wings. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites MrHixxx 0 #7 November 17, 2004 I noticed swooping in your profile. You should strongly consider stainless steel for your hardware if you are going to be pond swooping or if you are jumping in a moist environment. The cadmium wears off of the hardware in time and it is susceptable to corrosion if moisture often present. -Jondeath,as men call him, ends what they call men -but beauty is more now than dying’s when Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites riggerrob 643 #8 November 17, 2004 QuoteI noticed swooping in your profile. You should strongly consider stainless steel for your hardware if you are going to be pond swooping or if you are jumping in a moist environment. The cadmium wears off of the hardware in time and it is susceptable to corrosion if moisture often present. -Jon >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stainless steel hardware definitely improves resale value. And if wingsuit sales continue as we hope, the 9 foot bridle will also improve resale value. However, I would not worry too much about resale value, as parachutes depreciate rapidly in the first year, then hold their value for 5-8 years before falling out of fashion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Remster 30 #9 November 17, 2004 I tried a rig with cut-in lats, and hatted it. It cuts into my sides. I would guess that its a great option for smaller jumpers, but may be questionable for the bigger ones. YMMV PS: I'm not that big at 6'2" and 210 lbs.Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkymonkeyONE 4 #10 November 17, 2004 Cut in laterals are great on rigs if you have the right body type. I like them (and have them on both rigs), but I absolutely don't need them because my rigs are so tiny and they are a bit of a nuisance with wingsuit fitting. Still, cut in laterals really do make your rig stick to your body and that is generally a good thing. Also, like someone else said, stainless not only holds up better, it has better resale value. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Deuce 1 #11 November 17, 2004 I think the cut in laterals are a must-have. Like the Monkey says, though, they are not necessary if you have a very narrow rig. I had Wings rigs without them, and my new ones do have them, and I love the difference in fit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites larsrulz 0 #12 November 17, 2004 Just for reference, cut-in laterals have been known to bruise kidneys because of how they push into the sides of your back. Not that I have more experience then all the guys here, but my rig is moderate size (holds a 150) without cut-in laterals and my rig fits great. I got a strong urge to fly, but I got no where to fly to. -PF Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bigway 4 #13 November 17, 2004 can you show me references to what you are saying or links to where you have read about cut in laterals bruising kidneys? it sound to me that if this could happen that people did not have their rig on properly. I would like to read more on this as i have never heard it and have read up a lot about wings containers. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyangel2 2 #14 November 17, 2004 Drop Ankie an e-mail at ankie@skydivewings.com She will help you with any questions. Cut ins are great.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkydiveNFlorida 0 #15 November 17, 2004 Quote4 re-sale value look and fashion are not a concern Which many times go hand in hand. Quote options I've allready chosen are: hip articulated harness standart backpack (not quilted) standart hardware (no stainless or deluxe) large ring type 8 22" risers with inserts type 8 chest strap no cut-in laterals cardura BOC freestyle handle collapsible ZP PC wingsuit friendly options (9' bridle & opened bottom container) I would not buy a rig with the large rings, personally, but for larger jumpers I hear they are a good idea. I pull my slider down and it sounds like it'd be a project with the larger webbing on the risers. I have heard some people say that the backpad doesn't make a difference, others argue that it does. I think it'd be nice to really try both before dishing out the $$, but if it truly is more comfy, i'd definitely get it! I also opted for SS on my new rig. Although my other non-stainless rig doesn't have any problem, I have seen some pix that made me choose ss... better safe than sorry on a new rig. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #16 November 17, 2004 QuoteI would not buy a rig with the large rings, personally Well, you can always put mini-risers on a rig setup for large rings, but you can't do the opposite. So all in all its not a bad choice really.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkydiveNFlorida 0 #17 November 17, 2004 QuoteQuoteI would not buy a rig with the large rings, personally Well, you can always put mini-risers on a rig setup for large rings, but you can't do the opposite. So all in all its not a bad choice really. That'd look funny, tho... and it's all about looking good hehe. Seriously, I hadn't thought about that, good call. -A Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skydiverek 63 #18 November 17, 2004 QuoteJust for reference, cut-in laterals have been known to bruise kidneys because of how they push into the sides of your back Here is alos a thread on cut-in laterals being a snag hazard: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=470356#470356 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites gjhdiver 0 #19 November 19, 2004 QuoteJust for reference, cut-in laterals have been known to bruise kidneys because of how they push into the sides of your back. Not that I have more experience then all the guys here, but my rig is moderate size (holds a 150) without cut-in laterals and my rig fits great. OK, I shall jump in here and try to make a general point without pimping the Wings too hard, although that is really my job. The cut-in laterals on the Wings are VERY unlikely to bruise you, because they are attached to the hip ring, and so can allow the harness to articulate upwards around that point. This translates to very small movements, if any at all, on the cut-in lateral. Other cut-in laterals are generally sewn directly to the main lift web, so any sudden upwards movement on the main lift web is carried into the lateral webbing, and may cause it to rise up your back. In the case of an improperly sized or fitted harness, this movement could causing bruising if the opening were hard enough to move that lateral quickly. Obviously, correct sizing and packing reduces this risk. I have them on both my rigs and really like them. YMMV etc. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. 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mr2mk1g 10 #2 November 17, 2004 Virtually evenyone has thread-through leg straps these days. I bet they're what you are jumping now. B-12 snaps are those clip together leg straps you get on some student rigs or on very old rigs. They are very uncommon on modern rigs. I probably don't need to answer the rest of your questions if you know what B-12's are... I bet you don't want them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alain 0 #3 November 17, 2004 ok, thanks ! 'just found a pic of those B12 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigway 4 #4 November 17, 2004 I think you are missing the 2 important and excellent designs of the wings........that is the cut in laterals, they may even be free this month, i dont know. and the quited backpad, add extra comfort. The but in laterals are an excellent feature, i do not know about flying it with a birdman suit though. thread through is good but i am thinking that b-12 is like a hooh snap on, i am not sure though. Cut in laterals though and backpad, they offer something free every month so check there web site. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #5 November 17, 2004 QuoteI think you are missing the 2 important and excellent designs of the wings........that is the cut in laterals, they may even be free this month They were free last month. This month is lots of free pinstripe options. I think a lot of people jumped on the free laterals late - the wait time went from 4-5 weeks in early october when I ordered mine up to 8-9 weeks now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigway 4 #6 November 17, 2004 they told me 12-weeks, and it took 12 weeks, fine by me. the laterals are worth the 150 dollars, i think it is a great part of wings. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MrHixxx 0 #7 November 17, 2004 I noticed swooping in your profile. You should strongly consider stainless steel for your hardware if you are going to be pond swooping or if you are jumping in a moist environment. The cadmium wears off of the hardware in time and it is susceptable to corrosion if moisture often present. -Jondeath,as men call him, ends what they call men -but beauty is more now than dying’s when Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #8 November 17, 2004 QuoteI noticed swooping in your profile. You should strongly consider stainless steel for your hardware if you are going to be pond swooping or if you are jumping in a moist environment. The cadmium wears off of the hardware in time and it is susceptable to corrosion if moisture often present. -Jon >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stainless steel hardware definitely improves resale value. And if wingsuit sales continue as we hope, the 9 foot bridle will also improve resale value. However, I would not worry too much about resale value, as parachutes depreciate rapidly in the first year, then hold their value for 5-8 years before falling out of fashion. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #9 November 17, 2004 I tried a rig with cut-in lats, and hatted it. It cuts into my sides. I would guess that its a great option for smaller jumpers, but may be questionable for the bigger ones. YMMV PS: I'm not that big at 6'2" and 210 lbs.Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 4 #10 November 17, 2004 Cut in laterals are great on rigs if you have the right body type. I like them (and have them on both rigs), but I absolutely don't need them because my rigs are so tiny and they are a bit of a nuisance with wingsuit fitting. Still, cut in laterals really do make your rig stick to your body and that is generally a good thing. Also, like someone else said, stainless not only holds up better, it has better resale value. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #11 November 17, 2004 I think the cut in laterals are a must-have. Like the Monkey says, though, they are not necessary if you have a very narrow rig. I had Wings rigs without them, and my new ones do have them, and I love the difference in fit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
larsrulz 0 #12 November 17, 2004 Just for reference, cut-in laterals have been known to bruise kidneys because of how they push into the sides of your back. Not that I have more experience then all the guys here, but my rig is moderate size (holds a 150) without cut-in laterals and my rig fits great. I got a strong urge to fly, but I got no where to fly to. -PF Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bigway 4 #13 November 17, 2004 can you show me references to what you are saying or links to where you have read about cut in laterals bruising kidneys? it sound to me that if this could happen that people did not have their rig on properly. I would like to read more on this as i have never heard it and have read up a lot about wings containers. .Karnage Krew Gear Store . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #14 November 17, 2004 Drop Ankie an e-mail at ankie@skydivewings.com She will help you with any questions. Cut ins are great.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #15 November 17, 2004 Quote4 re-sale value look and fashion are not a concern Which many times go hand in hand. Quote options I've allready chosen are: hip articulated harness standart backpack (not quilted) standart hardware (no stainless or deluxe) large ring type 8 22" risers with inserts type 8 chest strap no cut-in laterals cardura BOC freestyle handle collapsible ZP PC wingsuit friendly options (9' bridle & opened bottom container) I would not buy a rig with the large rings, personally, but for larger jumpers I hear they are a good idea. I pull my slider down and it sounds like it'd be a project with the larger webbing on the risers. I have heard some people say that the backpad doesn't make a difference, others argue that it does. I think it'd be nice to really try both before dishing out the $$, but if it truly is more comfy, i'd definitely get it! I also opted for SS on my new rig. Although my other non-stainless rig doesn't have any problem, I have seen some pix that made me choose ss... better safe than sorry on a new rig. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #16 November 17, 2004 QuoteI would not buy a rig with the large rings, personally Well, you can always put mini-risers on a rig setup for large rings, but you can't do the opposite. So all in all its not a bad choice really.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #17 November 17, 2004 QuoteQuoteI would not buy a rig with the large rings, personally Well, you can always put mini-risers on a rig setup for large rings, but you can't do the opposite. So all in all its not a bad choice really. That'd look funny, tho... and it's all about looking good hehe. Seriously, I hadn't thought about that, good call. -A Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydiverek 63 #18 November 17, 2004 QuoteJust for reference, cut-in laterals have been known to bruise kidneys because of how they push into the sides of your back Here is alos a thread on cut-in laterals being a snag hazard: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=470356#470356 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gjhdiver 0 #19 November 19, 2004 QuoteJust for reference, cut-in laterals have been known to bruise kidneys because of how they push into the sides of your back. Not that I have more experience then all the guys here, but my rig is moderate size (holds a 150) without cut-in laterals and my rig fits great. OK, I shall jump in here and try to make a general point without pimping the Wings too hard, although that is really my job. The cut-in laterals on the Wings are VERY unlikely to bruise you, because they are attached to the hip ring, and so can allow the harness to articulate upwards around that point. This translates to very small movements, if any at all, on the cut-in lateral. Other cut-in laterals are generally sewn directly to the main lift web, so any sudden upwards movement on the main lift web is carried into the lateral webbing, and may cause it to rise up your back. In the case of an improperly sized or fitted harness, this movement could causing bruising if the opening were hard enough to move that lateral quickly. Obviously, correct sizing and packing reduces this risk. I have them on both my rigs and really like them. YMMV etc. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
