Anyone jumping a Safire 109?

[Tonto 1]

What do you think of it?

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[vibeke 0]

I did for a while this summer.

At first I liked it - compared to my Sabre135 it was fun to fly. I liked the improved speed and surfs during landing. Loaded it 1.4 so I was able to get a nice little swoop out of it, with only little effort.
However I mainly did straight approach landings and a few soft carving toggle turns. Kept the frontriser turns up high, where I must say it responded well.

At a Brian Germain seminar I saw a lot of video of landings and Brian helped point out two cases where this Safire109 for no good reason dropped my out of my surf - just lost its speed before its time.
Another thing - and the main reason I did not keep it, is that its a bit slow / non responding to inputs that are given too quick. Small taps on the toggels seems to go by unnoticed...
We could see inputs on video, that did not effect the canopy the way it was supposed to. You had to work it hard and give it time to respond. I dont like this.

However, my current Spectre120 is not better in that regard. This time however I have decided that I am going to learn how to fly it! And its getting better too - just need a lot of speed and really aggressive inputs...
Im pretty sure its the pilot more than the canopy, but like I said Brian Germain and others have pointed out that this particular Safire109 did weird things!

_________________________________________________________
Your success and happiness, is in direct proportions to your commitment to excellence, regardless of your chosen field of endeavour.

[BIGUN 1,347]

I've been jumping Safire's for 5 years now. (albeit not a 109). As the thread above explains, it's really not designed to be an aggressive swooping canopy. If one desires a longer swoop, the carve has to be maintained thru the bottom end.

And, as said; it reacts to continuous toggle inputs as a docile canopy is designed and will not react to toggle bumps as the crossbraced canopies will. An inch or two bump will not do anything as a six or eight inch press will.

Hope that helps.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[GeeeeeeFly 0]

My girlfriend recently downsized from a sabre135 to a 109. It took her awhile o get used to the difference between the two canopies but she prefers it over the sabre now.

~G~

"The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over"

[Tonto 1]

How many dives does she have and what's she loading it at?

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[GeeeeeeFly 0]

She has over 400 jumps...

Wingloading is around 1.2

She could go smaller but she's not interested in the canopy flight as much as others...

~G~

"The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over"

[hookitt 1]

Depends on what you want to use it for. I liked the one I borrowed but for my usual flying style it's not the right canopy.

For wingsuit flying, it could be rather nice though.

Does it fly straight?

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[billvon 3,033]

I have a safire 119 (with the brake line mod) and I liked it a lot - at least until I got my nitro 108. Great landings, decent openings. The openings seemed to go downhill as the lines wore (which isn't supposed to happen, I know) and so I relined it. Now the openings aren't _quite_ as good.

[eUrNiCc 0]

I just recently got a 119 with about 350 jumps on it, and pretty ugly lines. It's got a bit of a left turn which will hopefully be cured when I get some new lines on it. The openings have always been awesome, and i really like it for wingsuit and camera jumps.

Egad, A BASE life defiles a bad age.

[skycat 0]

You may want to PM Brit17 she has a lot of jumps on a Safire1 109

Fly it like you stole it!

[brits17 0]

It was the perfect canopy for me to significantly improve my learning curve as far as canopy flight is concerned. Jumped a Safire 109 from jumps 100-500.

I jumped the original trim until I had around 300 jumps on the canopy, then Derek asked if he could modify the upper control lines. I agreed and I noticed a couple significant differences. The first being the openings. Whereas I had to roll the nose to slow it down, now I left the nose exposed and it consistently had a nice long ~800 ft snivel. Secondly I realized the response to toggle inputs weren't as noticeable. A little disappointed that I may now be lacking performance, upon more experimentation I found that this didn't make a difference on anything I considered important, like swooping distance. When it came time to land, the canopy seemed to generate more lift. I'm sure this is due to Derek lengthening the outer cascade, making the tail 'flare' evenly versus having the outside corners only cave in.

Overall I loved the canopy. Toward the end of my experience with it, I could really dial in the front riser carves which led to great distance results. I loaded it at 1.2. The guy I sold it to a couple years ago loads it around 1.5-1.6. He's flown birdman in it many times and usually experiences good openings and great swoops (although it now needs a new line set).

Gentle enough to bring it straight in and conservative, and enough versatility to surf some turf if so desired.

_______________________
aerialkinetics.com

[Tonto 1]

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(with the brake line mod)

Mmm. Any idea where I can get the specs for that mod?

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[brits17 0]

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(with the brake line mod)

Mmm. Any idea where I can get the specs for that mod?

See above and read my post. You'll see who did the mod. I know my canopy's only the second he'd done this for, not sure if the specs have changed since. Mind as well send him a PM.

_______________________
aerialkinetics.com

[PhreeZone 20]

>I know my canopy's only the second he'd done this for

I'm pretty sre that Hook has done this to more then a few canopies. Word is that Icarus sent the design he came up with out to their service centers to offer from there, but never gave him credit for it. PM Hooknswoop and talk to him about it.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[brits17 0]

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>I know my canopy's only the second he'd done this for

I'm pretty sre that Hook has done this to more then a few canopies. Word is that Icarus sent the design he came up with out to their service centers to offer from there, but never gave him credit for it. PM Hooknswoop and talk to him about it.

Whoops, misworded I meant mine was the 2nd canopy he tried this 'experiment' on.

_______________________
aerialkinetics.com

[flyana3 0]

If you are asking about the Safire1, it is completly different from the Safire2. I learned to swoop the shit out of my Safire2 109 (I received lots of canopy coaching). Super soft openings and lots of flare power. Sometimes I popped myself up TOO high, and in very light winds.

Diana

[Tonto 1]

Safire 1 comments only please.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[TALONSKY 0]

It is my understanding that with the Safire 1, there are two different types. The ones that open and have a ton of flare (these are generally ones built in Europe but some american built do fly well also). The other type are the ones that opened hard and did not have alot of flare( these were generally built in America). I had a Europe built one loaded 1.55 to one and loved it. I had great openings and nice swoops.
also some other info on the Safire 1,s
I e-mailed Icarus and explained that this had been talked about here and if they could give me a reply that I could post so here is Icarus's reply

The Safire-1 and the Omega are measured differently to PD canopies. As a rough guide a Safire-1 or Omega is about the same size as the next size down - eg A Safire 149 is about a 135. A Safire 119 is about a 109. Use an equation of 8%.
The Safire-2 and Omni (Omni supercedes Omega) are measured the same as
PD.

All other Icarus Canopies are measured the same as PD.

The reason for the difference is due to Precision measuring their canopies differently. Icarus have always measured the same as PD however when we originally commenced in the USA, Precision were building parachutes for us under license and were doing it using their size equations and not Icarus/PD's.

We have therefore had to wait to supercede these models to change the size equation.

Only the Safire and Omega were affected.

Blue skies
Simon

Icarus Canopies
USA: 1S671 Bender Lane, West Chicago, IL 60185, USA
Ph. (630) 562-2735, Fax (630) 231-4430
Europe: P.I. El Ramassar, c/ Vallés, s/n O8520,
Les Franqueses, Barcelona, SPAIN.
Ph. (34) 938 496 432, Fax (34) 938 497 971
www.icaruscanopies.com

[Danger 0]

I have about 900 jumps on my 109, loaded very high (1.9). At this loading the canopy swoops like a dream. Openings are good and predictable if I don't pack it.

What kind of specific info are you looking for?

[masterrigger1 2]

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>I know my canopy's only the second he'd done this for

I'm pretty sre that Hook has done this to more then a few canopies. Word is that Icarus sent the design he came up with out to their service centers to offer from there, but never gave him credit for it. PM Hooknswoop and talk to him about it.

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The Mod that Derek does is simply an offset of the upper control lines. In other words, they are all different lengths. The differental line lengths of upper controls is not new, Stilettos,Triathalons,Crossfires,among some others have offset uper control lines.The concept is not new nor Derek's.

On the Safire I the uppers are all the same length. The modification that the service center does is simply a percentage change with the exception of the # 3 line that stays the nominal length. #1 is 12% longer, #2 is 3.5% longer, and #5 is 10% longer. Derek uses a different format and concept to do his mod.

Blue Ones,
MEL

Skyworks Parachute Service, LLC
www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com

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