oldwomanc6 60
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jonstark 8
Call your state forester.
Do you have a survey?
Post the land ASAP!!!
Call the environmental police or Dept of Environmental Protection.
Call the police.
The damage has been done and you have a shitty neighbor who needs to be held accountable if in fact he is over the line. The authorities will have suggestions.
jon
Do you have a survey?
Post the land ASAP!!!
Call the environmental police or Dept of Environmental Protection.
Call the police.
The damage has been done and you have a shitty neighbor who needs to be held accountable if in fact he is over the line. The authorities will have suggestions.
jon
Krip 2
QuoteQuoteHire an attorney who deal with real estate. Sounds like you need immediate injunctive relief and have a good case for damages. Is your neighboor profiting from the clearing?
+1 and sooner rather than later. The longer a property-line dispute goes unchallenged, the harder it is to prove and the less likely it will go in the legal owner's favor. I've even heard where the property line has been changed on the books in favor of the offender, because the original owner didn't push back soon enough, and the fence/building had been standing there for many years before legal action was taken.
Don't delay, and good luck with this.
+3
Time is critical, Start a journal and take pic's of remaining tree stumps (to scale) and surrounding standing trees.
One Jump Wonder
We just closed on the 2 acres of raw woods, located just west of Hayward & south of Superior & @ 1000 miles round trip, from where we now live ( Fond du Lac), 09/16/11, so we only have had opportunity to get there 4x since.
We've obtained land use permits, etc., but had not started any physical changes.
It is primarly up scale vacation/ recreational property, but will be our permanent primary residence.
It's appreciated value & attraction is based on the aesthetics of the land.
Our intent was to clear only what needed to build & install well/septic & to keep raw, for maintaining it's current & potential appreciating land value and to preserve it's natural resources, beauty & wildlife habitat.
Since we plan to build a log home, any trees that needed clearing for the build site, would've been harvested for our personal use ( i.e cabin, gazebo, landscape, etc.)
We also felt the standing mature trees would be a natural weather barrier & anyone who spends any time in the wild, understands the tranquility & peace of mind amongst the presence of nature/ wild life !
Like I said, State owned ATV trails & State Forestry Land abutt our property.
The neighboring land owners purchased the adjoining land just 2 weeks before we did. Both are from out of state ( MN., & SD.), so when they are there, they make a dramatic sweep in clearing.
Their intended use: a shed to store their boat.
They've owned land/ cabin on lake property nearby, for a few years & indicated they removed a lot of the downed trees ( legally on our land), to use as firewood at the cabin property.
I'm not sure if that can be construed as profiting...but most definitely trespassing and destruction of real property.
I'm not sure if trees are considered personal property !?
The realtor who sold to us both, & who's daughter was the seller, informed me this am., a surveyor will be re-marking all lot lines, but asked us not to contact authorities, at this time.
The neighboring owners hung up on me, so it looks like getting an attorney, has to be done & now !
In the meantime, excavators were due to clear this week, so we can get electric service & a temporary camper ( during build next spring) can be done before the snow flies !
I'm not sure if we should hold up on that, at this point !
I've taken a lot of pictures the last time we were there 10/21, but we're going back this wkend, to see how much more damage has been since & take more photos.
The neighbor admitted to more clearing since we were there last, claiming he was going by view, not the certified plat !!! ![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
ryoder 1,590
Educate yourself on Adverse Possession: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adverse_possession
It is an asinine law that came of of the Middle Ages for a valid reason back then, but has no place in contemporary society, but yet it is still there.
In a nutshell, defend your property and file trespassing charges on every infraction, else you might "legally" lose it.
Don Kirlin learned this the hard way. (Google: Boulder adverse possession).
It is an asinine law that came of of the Middle Ages for a valid reason back then, but has no place in contemporary society, but yet it is still there.
In a nutshell, defend your property and file trespassing charges on every infraction, else you might "legally" lose it.
Don Kirlin learned this the hard way. (Google: Boulder adverse possession).
"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.
JohnMitchell 16
Holy Crap!
Makes you want to shoot trespassers.
ryoder 1,590
Almost forgot;
Here is a website that was tracking all the news stories on the Kirlin case: http://www.landgrabber.org/
Here is a website that was tracking all the news stories on the Kirlin case: http://www.landgrabber.org/
"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.
Fast 0
Quote
The realtor who sold to us both, & who's daughter was the seller, informed me this am., a surveyor will be re-marking all lot lines, but asked us not to contact authorities, at this time.
The neighboring owners hung up on me, so it looks like getting an attorney, has to be done & now !
If you don't contact an attorney you're going to lose your property or money or both. Do this now. Stop messing around on the internet. Go see a lawyer now. It's quite sad, but it's the american way. I speak from the fact that I work in a lawfirm. I see how this stuff goes down.
~D
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka
Thanks to all for their feed back...I knew the intelligence & many diverse professions of most skydiver's would be beneficial 
So far I've found out some info concerning our situation & communicated with many to include an attorney & law enforcement in the area.
Since the surveyance & posted placements in 3 segments along all perimeters of both land parcels won't be completed till Friday, it's too premature for an official complaint, yadayada...
We are Lot 6.
Lot 7 has caused us the issues & destroyed our property.
However, the selling realtor did check out the properties today, as well as, 4 other properties:
Lot 8, 9, 10 & 11.
Lots 8-11 have been long time owned & developed...2 for over 30 years & obviously have not disputed any encroachments on their properties.
All land parcels per the certified plat map are surveyed in basically a straight rectangle from one another, despite the curves in the road.
However, these same 4 went against the grain of the plat, clearing & developing running straight back from the road even though their land description per metes & bounds & plat map, should have been measured at the time of there developing, running back from the curves & turns of the road.
Those that are located on the curve of the road, legally have shorter side lot lines then those that are on straight road side.
We actually have ( or should have had) the largest lot, & higher priced lot.
Therefore, they caused initial encroachment to the next down the domino line, tapering to the back of the lot lines, which caused a narrowing for the next.
Each owner made sure they had the width measurements, though they had shorter side lot lines running the length of their properties.
We were the last Lot purchased, with Lot 7 obtaining their's, 2 weeks before us.
It was explained to the realtor today, Lot 7 owners noted Lots 8-11 ran at an angle & he made sure he was getting his entitlement of land measurement.
In doing so he further tapered & narrowed the back of our lot, taking our's from our legal entitlement of 220' wide on back lot line to 100', the 490' along sides, & cutting into our front 220' width to @ 120'...
cutting & clearing trees throughout !
Krip 2
QuoteAlmost forgot;
Here is a website that was tracking all the news stories on the Kirlin case: http://www.landgrabber.org/
Took a quick look, of course the lawyer put a positive spin on it he got paid $400,000.
Without public opinion in favor of Don, no telling what would have happened in spite of the $400K.
R.
One Jump Wonder
It's mainly civil. Think trespass and conversion.
There may be some statutory things in Wisconsin.
If you really want to screw him, report him to every state, local and federal agency dealing with trees. Someone will bite. Hopefully many. That's how you destroy someone. Let the governments do it.
But sue him, too.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
There may be some statutory things in Wisconsin.
If you really want to screw him, report him to every state, local and federal agency dealing with trees. Someone will bite. Hopefully many. That's how you destroy someone. Let the governments do it.
But sue him, too.
My wife is hotter than your wife.
Since I can't do much till Friday, when we are able to go there to get a better idea of how much more cutting or our trees & tagging our property has occured, but sit on my hands & refrain from calling the a** holes that did this ( I don't need harassment brought down on me, as I can get very verbally aggressive )...
I did contact the DNR substation 3 miles down the road.
They are going to check into it, as well, or so they say...
as I'm growing more & more cynical of any entity or system being on the up & up...
Based on the State ATV trails, patroled & under DNR jurisdiction, abutting our back lot line & State & Fed. Forestry Dept., they may have violated criminal Forestry Dept. Reg's.
Though it is privately owned, any trees per the area cut without owners permission, may be a criminal offense.
Also, I did research WI. Stats.
Since we have already voiced & established concern of "aggravated possession" to many authoritive figures, when we initially observed the intrusion & cutting of our trees, & by physically establishing the log boundary markers & roping off our area, based on the plat & surveyed posts, it gave reasonable notice to anyone/ everyone, there was at a minimum...a potential discrepency in ownership rights, trespassing & incursion.
If they did begin to build, or have built a structure on any portion of our legal description of our land..encroachment violations, as well.
Even if this trespass & destruction was not done with intentional malice, they were bound to take reasonable precautions before making any physical changes.
They have appeared to have violated State laws.
Proof is not an issue, as by speaking directly with one of the owner's who admittedly stated, they are the one's who cleared & cut prior & since, & by admission of "removing the markers & by eyeballing & walking off their land width in determining the clearing they did do..."
Therefore, we do have a claim for damages, but the kicker....
To bring cause of action against them, it has to be done in the jurisdiction of primary residency of both Parties, since neither Party has a habitable dwelling established on the land(s).
We live on the other side of the State of WI.
The jerk owners are brother in laws; 1 living in MN., 1 in SD.
The other issues that was presented to me by a real estate atty consult & is foreseeable, if they Quit Claim the Title of Warranty of Ownership before action is bought against them, we are screwed.
Also, if the Realtor who's daughter owned the land at the time of the sale is liable for any misappropriation & knowledge of encroachment & is causable, we could bring action against him/her.
Unfortunately, as pointed out to me in a pm by one thread poster, be aware of the good ol' boys syndrome...the Realtor is also the County Appraiser & Township Council President
Our dream of a little cabin in the woods & getting away from the jerks of society has quickly become a nightmare
Thanks to you & all that have taken the time to comment.
It is appreciated all the input & feed back!
You wouldn't happen to be available, would you ?
~ You all have yourselves a BlueSkies & Safe landings kind of day
'Gypsie ~
oldwomanc6 60
"I slept like a LOG ... whoops sorry (Hope you get your property issue sorted really soon)
-----------------------------------------------------------
Glad you did ...
Property issue...bad, bad, bad !
We went up today to see just how bad.
It was worse then we could've imagined.
The dumb a$$, a$$ hole actually took out more than 1/2 the entire 2 acres, completely cleared.
Fortunately the re-survey w/ postings throughout, was done this a.m, before we got there & gave clear evidence of the wrongdoing !
We had the County Sheriff's Dept. come out & take a look.
They were there 3 hours gathering photos,
videotaped both properties & measured & counted trunks & limb girths & dimensions...
one deputy saying it was the worst case like this, seen in his 17 years on the department.
It is estimated well over 200 fully grown & healthy trees ranging 20' -50' high were taken down
Also, too many new growth stubs, to even count.
They are recommending multiple felony charges due to guess'itmated costs of just the property damage & loss' alone .
The US. Forestry Dept. & DNR will also be involved because some of the trees 'harvested' were downed & fell across State ATV trails & natural wild life habitat...& just left
We're just sick about it !!!
It made for a very long & exhausting 1000+ mile round trip drive, today ...
as far as getting it worked out real soon...not thinking so
I do appreciate your thoughtful comment, though!
I hope you have another good night's sleep...rather not use the phrase: " like a log" ...
given our logging trauma "
Wow, the more you report, the worse it becomes. I hope you can get justice, because that is the least you deserve. A good settlement wouldn't hurt, either. The gaul of some people.
lisa
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9
Krip 2
To OP
Sounds like a Mcnasty that I wouldn't want to live next to.
With a lawyer and in the spirit of cooperation could you let Mcnasty buy the lot from you at a "fair "price before they ruined it, plus legal fee's, pain and suffering etc .
Does Mcnasty have any $$$$
Then let Mcnasty deal with the regulator's & you can find another piece of heaven. Before you get to old to enjoy it.
FWIW Not a lawyer
R.
As far as letting McNasty buy it, we don't know what to do at this point !
We put every penny we had into the purchase, fees & signed a $20,000 contract to have the septic/sewer & foundation in, & put a required down payment of $ 10,000 down.
The soil test, land permit, driveway permit, building permit & already paid excavator has already cost us @ $4000.
We were thinking "obtaining" Nasty McA$$ Holes parcel, would be a start to a resolve, but replacing the trees is impossible.
He ( they, 4 Titled owners on their Deed), do appear to have $.
He owns lakefront property @ 4 miles away.
After looking up the records at the County Court House, Fair Market value for that property: $198,000.
Both couples are out of staters..MN., & SD. & planned intended use for our property they attempted to adopt plus the one they bought next to us: a garage for their boat
At 1st, the Sheriff's Deputys told us upon arrival...this would probably be handled as a civil matter.
From the front at the road, it was not visible to the degree of damage, as they saved us the front 220'x 200' of trees, from our original 220'x 490'.
That was until we took them for a walk & they observed the 16 survey posts, flagged in pink & stacks & stacks of freshly cut logs logs, downed trees, totally cleared land & debris throughout.
We also showed them the dated pictures we'd taken each time we were there, showing the condition of the land at the time we bought it a month ago, & the dramatic changes taking place each week since.
Who knows how long any justice or settlement will take.
This was our piece of heaven...before too old to enjoy...
55 in a week, & w/ cancer diagnosis
It 's intent was for a few years peace & enjoyment in my favorite envirnonment, then for my husband, then promised to my son & ultimately my grandson as:" Nonny & Brad's Cabin"
He's already wood burned us our the shingle to hang, there !
This isn't a case of time is money.
Time is everything...
I never realized how the loss of trees could generate so many tears... 50/50 anger & disgust !
I DO NOT COMPREHEND SOME PEOPLE, THESE DAYS
wmw999 2,534
Keep the law on it; the more they take care of it, the more you can focus on actually enjoying what you have, rather than on what you've lost.
It's still lost, but don't let that part take over your life if law enforcement can take some of that burden.
Good luck
Wendy P.
It's still lost, but don't let that part take over your life if law enforcement can take some of that burden.
Good luck
Wendy P.
There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)
JSE 1
If they are still cutting trees on your land you need to have an attorney file for a temporary restraining order and injunction against them first thing.
I received a call this am., from one of the sheriff's deputys that responded yesterday.
Contact was made with the @$$ bite that did all the damage, informing him ( them) our proerty is posted in multiple places " No Trespassing" & the entire lot has been legally marked & roped off.
Any further invasion on to the land &/or removing or relocating surveyed posts are criminal & will be arrested immediately.
Further processing of incident reports, photos & other evidence taken will be turned over to the DA. w/ in the week.
He ( they) were advised to seek remedy w/ us before charges were filed, but evidently he's balking & resisting resolution.
Also, the area US. Forestry Rangers Station & DNR Station is located 4 miles away.
We were told they & county deputys will be monitoring & patroling frequently, since we live so far away & can't !
It would appear this will continue to grow into an expensive, dragged out big deal
Thanks & BlueSkies to you all for comments, advice & input ...
SKYDIVERS ROCK
Krip 2
Hello Nice Lady.
I'm not a lawyer But
QuoteHe ( they) were advised to seek remedy w/ us before charges were filed, but evidently he's balking & resisting resolution.
I've watched a lot of TV cop shows and news. The first time a person gets busted and they have to enter a plea in front of the judge.
QuoteNot guilty your honor
IMO Mcnasty will consult a lawyer.
Mcnasty will end up paying twice. Once to you, (it will never be enough)
and once to his lawyer Sorry for your loss
K-RIP
Law enforcement who's filing complaint & pursuing charges & prosecution, passed on to me he intends to go 'observe' what exact damages he did create per new survey posts, today.
No doubt he has already contacted an attorney for the what if's, he's possibly looking at.
With just a rough minimal estimate of our losses for a number of grievances, we're seeing close to $50,000 in actual & other damages.
The area forest ranger & DNR have the expertice to determine actual value of trees lost & loss to wild life habitat conditions due to adjoinment to US Forestry land & ATV trails.
We may be willing to settle for 1/2, just to keep from a long dragged out process & costly out of pocket expenses, to us as well...just to get on with our plans & build!
It's probably unlikely he, nor the other 3 Deeded owners will resolve to any amount close to that & will take their chances with the judge.
Tomorrow I'm scheduling an attorney consult.
In the mean time, the other enforcement agencies
( DNR, & U.S. Forestry Dept) are now involved to help ascertain actual damages, losses & violations per their departments & Federal & State Codes.
I doubt they will resolve to anything remotely close & will take chances with the judge.
If it were me, I'd choose to settle 1st, but then again...
if it were me, it'd never had occured
I'm so dumb founded as to how this sort of thing could possibly go on, or to how dumb f*@#s think it'd go without consequences
Thanks to all for your positive comments & opinions for remedy...it does help w/ the anger
johndh1 0
I've been reading this and it just makes me want to scream. The people who did this have both an entitled and bullying mentality, and work on "forgiveness is easier than permission." I doubt this is the first time they've done this. Don't let the jerks get off easy.
Roll Tide Roll
+1 and sooner rather than later. The longer a property-line dispute goes unchallenged, the harder it is to prove and the less likely it will go in the legal owner's favor. I've even heard where the property line has been changed on the books in favor of the offender, because the original owner didn't push back soon enough, and the fence/building had been standing there for many years before legal action was taken.
Don't delay, and good luck with this.
WSCR 594
FB 1023
CBDB 9
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