What's inside of Monkey Fist handle?

[skydiverek 63]

What's inside? Does the handle consist of the same cord that we see on the inside, woven down to the very center on top of itself? Or, is the cord woven on top of ping-pong ball or sometinng similar? Basically, does Monkey Fist include anything else apart from the visible cord?

I am asking cause I have seen a pramature deployment on my friend's skydive. In a video, you can see him sit-flying, facing the camera, and the hackey is oscilating very rapidly in the wind, extracting the PC inch by inch. After about 5 seconds of "extracting" he gets a premature opening! Since he was still in sit-flying, the bag lifted staraight up, against his reserve wall and literally ripped the reserve container from the tray! He got smacked in the head by the part of container where the reserve pin sits!

The problem was tracked to loose BOC, but it made me thinking. The havier the hackey or Monkey Fist is, the more "pulling" it does on the PC when it is oscilating/flipping in the freefall wind.

RWS makes their hacky's with the lightweight cotton inside, but what's inside of Monkey Fists??? Could you build Monkey Fist handle with one of these yellow soft-foam-practice-golfballs inside (that are very, very lightweight)?

[Hooknswoop 19]

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Could you build Monkey Fist handle with one of these yellow soft-foam-practice-golfballs inside (that are very, very lightweight)?

Bingo.

Derek

[skycat 0]

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Monkey Fist handle with one of these yellow soft-foam-practice-golfballs inside (that are very, very lightweight)?

That is what I just finished making Morgan's with, and it's 3mm climbing accessory cord on the outside. In this case purple to match her rig.

Fly it like you stole it!

[hookitt 1]

That's the very reason I don't jump a hackey handle. I've seen that very same thing happen. I'm glad to hear your friend wasn't hurt.

If you're jumping a BOC(Bottom Of Container.... not ... Brush Off Chicken), the best design is a pull out looking handle with tab that fits nicely under the flap used to hide the bridle.

I've see monkey fists made with nothing inside or a wad of cotton. Skycat knows how to make them so I suspect she'll answer better than I can.

Edit: Told ya skycat would answer that ;)

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[skydiverek 63]

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That's the very reason I don't jump a hackey handle. I've seen that very same thing happen. I'm glad to hear your friend wasn't hurt.

If you're jumping a BOC (Bottom Of Container.... not ... Brush Off Chicken), the best design is a pull out looking handle with tab that fits nicely under the flap used to hide the bridle.

I know the design you are talking about - many manufacturers refer to it as "Freefly handle", right? One question about this setup: would it somehow interfere in clearing the horseshoe when using Brian Germain's way of packing the main PC (http://www.bigairsportz.com/art-pilotchute.php)?

I mean, in this method the pulling on the bridle should extract the PC and clear the horseshoe. But wouldn't the tab you mentioned add some friction to the PC (and now tab) extraction (meaning, would the tab be still sitting under the flap when the container is open?)? I assume there is not much pulling on the bridle during the horseshoe anyways, so every additional amount of friction may make a difference, right?

[Jeffrey 1]

Looks like no one has seen a free fly hack? Popular with bird man and cold weather jumpers. A very secure yet easy to pull alternative to the free fly handle.

In my initial ground testing, it didn't appear to effect a bridle line pilot chute extraction. But any thing is possible in the real world.

Jeff

[skydiver30960 0]

I have always used the little PVC pipe thingys because I felt I could seat them at the mouth of the pouch better, and because I felt a hackey blowing in the wind wasn't something I was interested in. Plus, the PVC was what I learned with, and haven't ever felt the need to move away from it.

As an aside, does the weight of the hackey/monkey fist matter? In freefall, I figure surface area would be more than an issue of weight, especially when we consider that for the most part the relative wind is acting to push the hackey/monkey fist UP, which would be the exact opposite of the force of gravity. Maybe?

Elvisio "arguing useless details" rodriguez

[hookitt 1]

I know what you're saying and it shouldn't be a factor. You can "what if" every thing like crazy but a premature pilot chute deployment is much more likely than a premature container opening.

A heavy handle is more likely to escape and is also more likely to cause a pilot chute malfunction as well. A hacky sack was the cause of one BASE fatality. A standard pilot chute was being used on a wingsuit dive and the bridle wrapped the hacky sack leaving nothing to deploy the canopy.

If I were to suggest a handle here's my choices.
-Pull Out
-The "Freefly" handle which is very difficult to have a bridle wrap the handle and very secure.
PVC attached by webbing that travels through the ends of the handle so the bridle can't get under the PVC.

That hacky handle pictured 2 posts up looks pretty good but the bridle can still get around the handle. (edit... It looks like the tab could could actually help prevent the bridle from wrapping the handle if it tried to)

Hackey handles and "Monkey Fists" have worked for a LOT of deployments but they are certainly more likely to cause a PC malfunction than the other types.

Ok, my break time is over... back to the garage... :)

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[skydiverek 63]

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A heavy handle is more likely to escape and is also more likely to cause a pilot chute malfunction as well. A hacky sack was the cause of one BASE fatality. A standard pilot chute was being used on a wingsuit dive and the bridle wrapped the hacky sack leaving nothing to deploy the canopy.

From the wingsuit thread forum (not the same accident, but similar situation). PICTURES:

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=40325;

and

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=40326;