Paracommander Packing Instructions?

[ripcord4 0]

I have been regularly jumping a MK I PC that I bought in 1967. It has never malfunctioned, blown up or any other non-desireable action. Conservatively, the canopy has 2,000 jumps on it and is limp as tissue paper (that's limp, not thin) but it works everytime the pilot chute hits the air.

There is nothing inherently unsafe about rounds - main or reserve. That said, I get any "old" gear rigger and strength checked before anything. If you pay attention to what you are doing (PLF's) you will enjoy your PC for years.

[steve1 5]

One of the bigger mistakes that I've made was selling my old P.C. and super pro harness and container. I loved that rig. Maybe part of me is still stuck in the 70's too, but then again nobody's perfect. I get a kick out of jumping old gear. I made a P.C. jump last summer. Stood it up at a boogie. Not bad for a fat old fart. It had been 25 years since I was under a para-commander and it felt great.

I'd like to jump a t-10 again if I could find one that was modified. A 9-TU T-10 isn't too bad to jump if you have a good spot and a big field. I've stood up a lot of them back in the good old days. A 28' round might be okay for a water jump.

My dream rig, would be an old B-12 container with shot and a half cape wells. A mark 1 P.C. or Papillion, and a belly reserve with a modified 26-coni in it. I know this probably seems like a death rig to some, but I'd have tons of fun with it. Right now about the only old gear I own is a pair of French jump boots and a motorcycle helmet....Steve1

[JerryBaumchen 1,364]

Stato,

Make sure you get some photos and publish them.

Jerry

[airtwardo 7]

the only old gear I own is a pair of French jump boots and a motorcycle helmet


***

Steve...That's what I started with...

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[ripcord4 0]

Steve,

Keep your eye on E-bay. There is occasionally an MC-1C (zero-P steerable T-10) listed for sale. The hard part will be to find a deployment sleeve - they are out there, but scarce.

[masterrigger1 2]

I've got templates for the sleeves, quarter bags and PODs.
Just in case some one needs one built!

I also have 4 complete airworthy PC MK1's
(1) green star system with curved chest mount
(3) mini systems

Whip and fold,
MEL

Skyworks Parachute Service, LLC
www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com

[poppenhager 1]

Stratostar,I concur, I have around 4000 jumps on PC's and still jump one 4-5 times a year (no wind hot days) so I can make a standing landing and I'm 72!!!
POP D47

[maggott 0]

I still jump a PC from time to time... (it was my first canopy). You will notice that there are a lot of "wussies" that tell you to run away from the PC, but I'm not one of them!
You can find great packing instructions in the Parachute Manual (Poynter's old black cover version). I also have a few copies of the Paracommander Handbook.
I can tell you the specifics of paking the PC if you'd like!
~Maggot

~Maggott
__________________________________________________________________________________
"Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone?"

[maggott 0]

YOU HAVE TEMPLATES for a SLEEVE!!!????
That's great! I have a Competition MOdel PC that needs a sleeve, and I was going to fake it, using an old sleeve to make a new one!
I'm interested!

~Maggott
__________________________________________________________________________________
"Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone?"

[maggott 0]

Dude! I'm right here WITH YOU!
I am a walking Air Museum! Last weekend I jumped my Dactyl and hit the peas! It's great how the folks on my DZ had never seen one before! They are fascinated, Thrilled and Amazed!
When I jumped my competition PC out there, they informed me that nobody had ever jumped a round at that DZ before! But none of them said a bad word about my old rig! They are supportive and respectful!
Hell! I HAD to make 100 jumps on a round before I was able to touch a square (strato star).
Funny how people attack things that they don't understand! Now I've got people at the DZ asking me to teach a seminar on rounds so we can have do an "all round load" I'll have to spot, of course, because that too seems to be a lost art! The pilot didn't even know what a WDI was! Oh! MY! Some days I feel so old!

~Maggott
__________________________________________________________________________________
"Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you've got till it's gone?"

[pchapman 279]

Any other tips on ParaCommander packing out there?
(I've checked other PC threads at dz.com too.)

I'm not in any huge need, but will gladly take suggestions. I have the Gary Lewis book and a couple friends with ParaCommander experience. (The book was available from ParaGear for a dollar a couple years ago but I think they're out of stock now.)

Some questions:

- Number of folds:
Just fold as appropriate for the size of the deployment device, eg a half fold, thirds, or quarter fold?

- Stabilizer folds:
The Lewis book suggested not folding the stabilizers across the air channel, to avoid stabilizer hangups. On the other hand, someone showed me a packjob with a trifold of everything (folding in thirds), which does put the stabs across the center.

- Bags:
How non-ideal are bags, as opposed to sleeves, in terms of malfunction risk? I have a bag to use, but at least will pack the canopy side to side which has been recommended for bags. (And I put elastics inside the top of the bag to stow the crown lines.)

It was also suggested to me that when using a bag, to try to hold the canopy together a bit more during opening by first doing a 90 degree fold of the bottom of the stabilizers and the bottom of the canopy, before doing the long folds. (I've also heard it called a 45 degree fold since the fold line is at that angle, while the skirt changes orientation by 90 degrees.)

- Slack in the center lines (the apex lines):
I think I have a Mk I PC to play with. When I first got it, it had a few inches of the center lines stowed in an elastic at each of the rear links, where the two center lines attach. Is it important to stow any slack at all in such an elastic? Or is a few inches no big deal?
The Lewis book only mentioned center line slack (I think) for the Russian PCs, and had the slack stowed in an elastic at the pulled down apex.

- Line lengths:
How even should the canopy skirt be, given that over time lines that get different loads get stretched different amounts? The factory specs would have the skirt all even, right? Tolerances on line lengths are quite generous?

- Canopy identification:
The one I have just says that it is a ParaCommander, and is from 1975. Since no model is listed, I assume it is a Mk I?


I borrowed the canopy from the back room of the DZ I instruct at, and have been getting it ready for flight. I think the DZ used PC's for students until '86 or so. The canopy is black & gold, has a US Army Parachute Team stamp inked out, and has stitch holes where lettering used to be on the canopy. Guess it was a Golden Knights canopy, something I didn't expect since the DZ that owns it is in Ontario, Canada.

[wmw999 2,452]

I jumped a Starlite (different high-performance round) for a long time. The biggest difference between it and the PC was that it didn't have separate stabilizers.

That said:

I used a bag, and had no real issues with it. I stowed the crown lines on the top, and the main lines on the bottom.

I folded the whole canopy across the channel, but then I didn't have separate stabilizers. I think most of the folks with PCs didn't fold the stabilizers across the channel.

Number of folds? Get it into the bag as cleanly as possible.

Line length? Just don't milk the lines in either direction. 550 isn't as bad as spectra for deforming. If some are a little longer, try to make those lines just a little longer on each stow, so that they all start out even, and all come out even on the end.

And have fun with it.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[DougH 270]

This thread makes me want to make a round jump once I have more time and experince in the sport.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[mjosparky 4]

Quote

This thread makes me want to make a round jump once I have more time and experince in the sport.

This thread makes me glad I no longer have to jump a round.

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[theduke 1]

Nothing wrong with PC's!!!

One of the best things with them is the silence after a free fall. (only roundy jumpers will know this feeling)

They still can be jumped safe.
I had one of mine setup in a old Talon container, 3 ring setup and a x228 reserve (Yes a square:))

Had to retire the container last year So now I got 2 pc's MKI that I can't jump

If any one knows any containers for sale, let me know.
I'm looking for a container with plenty of live left and a 300sqft main container.

These things are blody hard to find now days.

GO THE OLD STUFF!!!

And Maggot, thanks for the pc manual I bought of you from ebay. it has been a great help!!

[hackish 8]

I've wanted to jump a PC ever since I saw Crazy Larry jump one the end of last season. I even have a local rigger who has a complete rig to jump. I would like more experience first but should be getting started on learning to pack it in a few weeks. I've found some info in poynter but it's more of a historical reference sort of thing.

As for earlier posts about nylon rotting with age - this is untrue. Nylon degrades with exposure to some chemicals and mostly UV. Have your rigger do a pull test if you're unsure.

As for phantom oscillations close to the ground the drive vents in a PC or modifications in any round should prevent this sort of thing from happening. Oscillations are caused by the chute needing to spill air and the hole at the apex plus any drive vents are designed to vent enough air to prevent this oscillation. At least that's what the technical info says.

For those who have experience actually jumping these things - how do they behave in turbulence?

-Michael

[ripcord4 0]

My MK I will "bump" up and down a bit in heavy turbulence but that is all. It won't go out of control or collapse near the ground as a square will. It will not oscillate by itself - only while recovering from radical control inputs from me.

And you are correct about Nylon - age doesn't hurt it one bit. My PC is 43 years old and still going strong. Like anything else, take care of it and it will outlast you.

[skyjumpenfool 2]

I fondly remember the days when students looked forward to "upgrading" to a PC! I Made a lot of jumps on my old Green & White Checkerboard. I would be happy as a clam if that's the only canopy I owned. However, I know now what no one new then... Todays canopies are Waaaayy better. Enjoy the PC if you get a chance. Be ready to PLF and you'll do fine.
As for packing... Flake carefully and keep the lines neat and it'll open. Drop me a line if you have any questions... Mike

Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

[drjump 0]

Drive a stake in the ground to attach the crown lines to. Have someone, a good looking female Wuffo is the best choice, stand between the risers, lift the H&C up around their waist and lean back, i.e. "hold tension". Run a 4-line check, flake all the gores to one side, pull the deployment sleeve down over the flaked canopy and gently lie the canopy on the ground. Close the tounge of the sleeve, stow the suspension lines, fold sleeved canopy into container, collapse the pilot chute spring, close the container, and insert the ripcord pins into the cones. Attach the pack opening bands, close the pin protector flap and go jump.

[ripcord4 0]

If you have never stowed a canopy and lines into a sleeve, better get a good illustrated manual or some instruction as it is a bit more involved than the previous directions. While they are basically and generally correct there is a certain procedure and precedence for line stowage.

[jawbreaker 0]

I pulled mine out of moth balls last summer.It hadn't been jumped in 30 years.I jumped it once and my youngest son jumped it twice....too much fun.All stand-ups.I'm going to try to jump it every year as long as I can.PC's are great canopys!

[drjump 0]

Ripcord4 is right! Start at the top of the rubber bands and work towards the mouth of the sleeve. Don't forget to stow the crown lines and sleeve retainer line in the rubber bands at the top of the sleeve. This whole proceedure should not take more than two beers!!!!!!!LOL

[lilchief 1]

http://www.fallskjermhopp.no/vid/jubileum.mpg

Here's a clip for our national TV station in Norway. We did a history jump(or something like that) to celebrate that it was exactly 40years ago that the first civilian(ze germans had already done it military-style) skydive was done in our region.

And it was an PC from -74 i think

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[cwraith 0]

I concur. The floating bone chip in my left greater toe from a “high performance” land under a T-10 (with fun gear) migrates and reminds me every so often that I like landings - that I don’t have to PLF on.
I think everyone should “experience” it at least once.

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"People Sleep Peaceably In Their Beds At Night Only Because Rough Men Stand Ready To Do Violence On Their Behalf." - George Orwell