Krip 2 #26 October 24, 2009 Quote Quote Didn't know the Air Force had ground troops... Just relating my experience in the Army. Had an AFB in my hometown and never seen a bigger bunch of wannabe posers in my life. If the kid wants to be a real soldier then he should join a real branch. If he wants to learn how to work on planes or keep his fingernails clean his odds are better in the AF. Cheers Birdshit I'll assume your not joking. My response is One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #27 October 24, 2009 Quote Just relating my experience in the Army. Had an AFB in my hometown and never seen a bigger bunch of wannabe posers in my life. If the kid wants to be a real soldier then he should join a real branch. If he wants to learn how to work on planes or keep his fingernails clean his odds are better in the AF. If the kid doesn't know what he wants to do, he's better off in a branch like the Navy or Air Force, where he won't get to choose his own job specialty and has a decent chance of the skill set he picks up being useful in the civilian world if he decides to not make a career out of the military. He'll get placed where his test scores and performance indicate he'll do well. Most people tend to enjoy activities in which they can perform well or excel. Looking back, the biggest mistake I made when I joined the military was to enlist in the US Army with a combat arms MOS (i.e. a real soldier). Oh boy, I can operate a howitzer; there's a marketable skill. I had the line scores on the ASVAB to qualify for pretty much any entry level job offered in the military and wasted the opportunity they provided. If I had it to do over again, I would probably select the Coast Guard, since they actually do what they're trained to do during war and peace alike. Also, the CG arguably do more to protect Americans than any other branch. After the Coast Guard, I would likely choose Air Force or Navy.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lost_n_confuzd 0 #28 October 24, 2009 All the branches offer great jobs in many technical fields. To say that one can only get technical experience in the AF or Navy is bullshit. If you are looking for the overall package; experience, techinical skills, travel, comradie, excitement, women, join the Marines. Bottom Line - It all comes down to what the individual makes of it and if they take advantage of the oppurtunities offered in their service. I know I did. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #29 October 24, 2009 QuoteTo say that one can only get technical experience in the AF or Navy is bullshit. That wasn't what I was saying. QuoteIt all comes down to what the individual makes of it and if they take advantage of the oppurtunities offered in their service. Agreed. However, some opportunities offer benefits that carry over into the civilian world better than others.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nataly 38 #30 October 24, 2009 Quote some opportunities offer benefits that carry over into the civilian world better than others. Yep.. Have to agree.. Can't imagine being a sniper converts too well!! "There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse." - Chris Hadfield « Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. » - my boss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #31 October 24, 2009 Quote Quote some opportunities offer benefits that carry over into the civilian world better than others. Yep.. Have to agree.. Can't imagine being a sniper converts too well!! To be fair, some police departments (in the US) have uses for snipers. I don't think many have jobs for cannon crewmembers.Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nataly 38 #32 October 24, 2009 Quote Quote Quote some opportunities offer benefits that carry over into the civilian world better than others. Yep.. Have to agree.. Can't imagine being a sniper converts too well!! To be fair, some police departments (in the US) have uses for snipers. I don't think many have jobs for cannon crewmembers. Hmm.. Yes - possibly.. But that's still pretty limiting.. And I imagine if you left an organisation like the military because you didn't like it, you might not be super keen on joining an organisation like the police force (because it's a bit too familiar).. But yeah.. Your example is a better one "There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse." - Chris Hadfield « Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. » - my boss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #33 October 24, 2009 Quote But that's still pretty limiting.. And I imagine if you left an organisation like the military because you didn't like it, you might not be super keen on joining an organisation like the police force (because it's a bit too familiar). Very good point. Quote Your example is a better one Unfortunately, it's mine in more ways than one. Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpwally 0 #34 October 24, 2009 Thanks for all the great info,,it really helps.smile, be nice, enjoy life FB # - 1083 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #35 October 24, 2009 Quote Quote Just relating my experience in the Army. Had an AFB in my hometown and never seen a bigger bunch of wannabe posers in my life. If the kid wants to be a real soldier then he should join a real branch. If he wants to learn how to work on planes or keep his fingernails clean his odds are better in the AF. If the kid doesn't know what he wants to do, he's better off in a branch like the Navy or Air Force, where he won't get to choose his own job specialty and has a decent chance of the skill set he picks up being useful in the civilian world if he decides to not make a career out of the military. He'll get placed where his test scores and performance indicate he'll do well. Most people tend to enjoy activities in which they can perform well or excel. Looking back, the biggest mistake I made when I joined the military was to enlist in the US Army with a combat arms MOS (i.e. a real soldier). Oh boy, I can operate a howitzer; there's a marketable skill. I had the line scores on the ASVAB to qualify for pretty much any entry level job offered in the military and wasted the opportunity they provided. If I had it to do over again, I would probably select the Coast Guard, since they actually do what they're trained to do during war and peace alike. Also, the CG arguably do more to protect Americans than any other branch. After the Coast Guard, I would likely choose Air Force or Navy. My son spent 8 years in the Army. He can drive a Stryker and is an expert with a mortar of any size. Other than that he learned no marketable skills. Oh, wait, there's no civilian market for those skills either!... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nataly 38 #36 October 24, 2009 QuoteMy son spent 8 years in the Army. He can drive a Stryker and is an expert with a mortar of any size. Other than that he learned no marketable skills. Oh, wait, there's no civilian market for those skills either! Well, I wouldn't agree with that entirely.. He probably learned a lot about leadership; working in teams; doing/managing "projects"; seeing things through.. He probably met people from all walks of life and is able to socialise with people at all levels (be that a poor private or a high-ranking officer, or someone from an entirely different country/culture).. I mean.. Those skills aren't "obvious", but I don't know many civilian jobs where people/leadership skills aren't an asset. Those shouldn't be underestimated, but they are often overlooked."There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse." - Chris Hadfield « Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. » - my boss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CDRINF 1 #37 October 24, 2009 Absolutely! I have many friends who have got out of the Army over the years. Without exception, they said that what got them hired was not their technical background and hard skills, even for the guys who had been in technical MOSs. The number one selling point from the military that got them hired was that at a compartively young age, they had supervised double and triple digit numbers of people. You might be in the corporate world for 10 years before you end up heading up a project team of 3 or 4 people, yet a 25 year old Infantry squad leader will be in charge of 8. and a 30 year old PSG will be in charge of 30 or 40. A high level of responsibility at a young age will trump technical skills on the resume. So, don't disdain service in the combat arms. Also, as I am currently in Afghanistan as an advisor to the Afghan Army (for 7 more days - woo-hoo! ), I can tell you that there are quite a lot of Air Force and Navy logistics and maintenance types helping the Army out with this job. The Army is out of people and the Blue Suiters are filling in traditionally Army jobs, especially when it comes to Afghan Army logistics. As for recruiters, I have never been one. In fairness to them, they are not liars, but face the fact that they are salesmen selling a product. They will pitch their product in the most attractive light possible. Bottom line: It's a volunteer military. Once you raise your right hand, you have volunteered for anything that may happen to you. Trying to game the system to figure out how to join and get the benefits, but avoid getting shot at is not a good approach. It will only lead to a disapointing, headlong crash into reality at some point. Best approach if he is serious is to get all of the facts, and understand fully what he is getting into. CDR 23 years in and still dodging IEDs. 7 days and a wake up! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Miami 0 #38 October 24, 2009 Excellent post! Be safe over there CDR, come home in one piece!Miami Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #39 October 24, 2009 Quote Quote some opportunities offer benefits that carry over into the civilian world better than others. Yep.. Have to agree.. Can't imagine being a sniper converts too well!! It does actually, contractors and instructors are paid very well. It also qualifies you for many law enforcement and government jobs. Snipers are not only shooter, but very good assets for surveillance and other skills. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Niki1 1 #40 October 24, 2009 QuoteQuoteMy son spent 8 years in the Army. He can drive a Stryker and is an expert with a mortar of any size. Other than that he learned no marketable skills. Oh, wait, there's no civilian market for those skills either! Well, I wouldn't agree with that entirely.. He probably learned a lot about leadership; working in teams; doing/managing "projects"; seeing things through.. He probably met people from all walks of life and is able to socialise with people at all levels (be that a poor private or a high-ranking officer, or someone from an entirely different country/culture).. I mean.. Those skills aren't "obvious", but I don't know many civilian jobs where people/leadership skills aren't an asset. Those shouldn't be underestimated, but they are often overlooked. Well said.Most of the things worth doing in the world had been declared impossilbe before they were done. Louis D Brandeis Where are we going and why are we in this basket? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #41 October 24, 2009 Someone is very demeaning of his own son.Shame people cannot let go of their shitty views and look at the bigger picture. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nataly 38 #42 October 24, 2009 Well, it's like I said.. A lot of civilians don't understand it at all.. It's a question of relating your experience in a way where they can see that you *did* gain valuable kills.. Apart from anything else, there is a hell of a lot of jargon in the military - half the battle is explaining what you did in "plain English"!!! But some people don't want to hear it, unfortunately.. Just seems not to compute. It's their loss IMO. "There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse." - Chris Hadfield « Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. » - my boss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpwally 0 #43 October 24, 2009 Those skills may not transfer to much, but i'm sure he had money for school options after he got out, no ?smile, be nice, enjoy life FB # - 1083 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
warpedskydiver 0 #44 October 24, 2009 Needless to say but still worth it, he learned what surviving takes, how to lead, how to follow, and how to live as a Man (or a woman) in other people cases. It seems others could use that lesson. There is no way for someone to learn all that from attending a university. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nataly 38 #45 October 24, 2009 QuoteThose skills may not transfer to much, but i'm sure he had money for school options after he got out, no ? Good point. I spent 7 years in the military and also managed to graduate with First Class Honours at university (came out with ZERO debt). It's not like the forces will deplete your brain cells!!!"There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse." - Chris Hadfield « Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. » - my boss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,027 #46 October 24, 2009 QuoteThose skills may not transfer to much, but i'm sure he had money for school options after he got out, no ? Oh yes, he's back in school, learning marketable skills.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pcramil 0 #47 October 25, 2009 i enlisted into the Reserve...the only thing i regret was the decision-making method of enlisting. i was going to join the military anyway, but it was 3 days after my 18th birthday and i was laying in bed staring at the roof. suddenly, a BRIGHT idea hit me................... before the enlisting, i was a shy, quiet boy in a thick shell. since then i've come out of my shell (for the most part) and more talkative (unfortunately, for my friends ) chances of deploying in the reserve is still pretty high. you're guaranteed to deploy even in the reserve. whatever he decides, just make sure he thinks it out long and hard. the decision to join the military will affect 4+ years of someone's life, more if they get hurt, get into trouble, ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnDeere 0 #48 October 25, 2009 Quote Quote Those skills may not transfer to much, but i'm sure he had money for school options after he got out, no ? Oh yes, he's back in school, learning marketable skills. Im glad he's finally doing something to make you proudNothing opens like a Deere! You ignorant fool! Checks are for workers! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nataly 38 #49 October 25, 2009 Quote Quote Quote Those skills may not transfer to much, but i'm sure he had money for school options after he got out, no ? Oh yes, he's back in school, learning marketable skills. Im glad he's finally doing something to make you proud Yeah.. I was going to say the same thing.. Kallend doesn't seem to appreciate all the stuff one achieves in the military - sounds like a typical civvy. Education is great - don't get me wrong.. But it's no substitute for life experience."There is no problem so bad you can't make it worse." - Chris Hadfield « Sors le martinet et flagelle toi indigne contrôleuse de gestion. » - my boss Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krip 2 #50 October 25, 2009 Quote Quote Quote Quote Those skills may not transfer to much, but i'm sure he had money for school options after he got out, no ? Oh yes, he's back in school, learning marketable skills. Im glad he's finally doing something to make you proud Yeah.. I was going to say the same thing.. Kallend doesn't seem to appreciate all the stuff one achieves in the military - sounds like a typical civvy. Education is great - don't get me wrong.. But it's no substitute for life experience. Some jobs in the military just like in real world are dead end shit jobs. Don't like your shit job in the military OK want to quit and go home no problem take this DD with you. On the history channel theres a show about Aircraft carriers. I wasn't in the navy but based on my experience in the air force they shows gives a balanced explanation of a lot of the different jobs on the ship. From the top officer, flt crews, different enlisted from hi tech all the way down to the dudes that clean the toilets. Care to guess how many toilets are on a acft carrier? The toilet bowl sailor that was interviewed didn't appear to appreciate all the life experiences he was achieveing in the high tech navy.The kid had a dead end shit job. Some jobs in the real world are like that but in the military you sign a 4 yr contract. And in the middle of the ocean you can't blow off steam at night or weekends. I don't know what a sailor has to do to end up being a deck ape but OMFG in the middle of the ocean surrounded by all those toilets. thats a life experience I could do without. So many toilets, and so little timeI don't think the toilet sailors family was proud of what he achieved in the military.One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
