smurf 0 #1 July 26, 2005 Has it been done? If so, was it successful? I'm wondering because it's rather expensive to buy and install a vectran lineset here in Norway(i've heard it will cost somewhere between 450 and 500$). With non-cascaded HMA at least i would be able to install the lines myself. I've heard PD only charges 125$ to reline a canopy, does anyone know what Icarus charges? Thanks in advance Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diablopilot 2 #2 July 26, 2005 It can be done, for a non cascaded lineset you'll have to recalculate the lengths of all the lines loosing their cascades. BTW PD charges between $120 and $140 for most of their linesets when shipped to you. The cost of instalation by your rigger or the factory will be more.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nicknitro71 0 #3 July 26, 2005 1. PD does not charge 125 bucks to reline a canopy! At least not 125 USD. 2. HMA is even more expensive than Vectran and on a non continuous set you need a bit more line, even if you do it yourself it’s not going to be cheep. 3. You gotta do the math right, you cannot use the same line set for the non-cascaded, it’s my advice to contact Icarus to see if they have the line spec for the continuous set. 4. Said that I am a big fan of HMA. I relined my Alpha with continuous HMA and I love it!Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites smurf 0 #4 July 26, 2005 Just out of couriousity, do you know what PD charges for a Vectran lineset? And what is the cost of a HMA line set? I'm not planning on making the line set myself so if I were to change to HMA I would have to receive the lines in the correct lengths. Connecting the finished lines should be an easy task though, since there are no cascades. I assume the Alpha doesn't originally come with HMA? Did you get the specs for continous HMA from Atair and then made them yourself? Did the characteristics of the canopy change? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites masterrigger1 2 #5 July 26, 2005 Yes it has been done. On one of my canopies. Although, I do not manufacture continious line sets as the norm. I have stated in another thread the reasons why, but basically it will add parastic drag by using more line in the line sets. I would have to check the thoughts of Icarus Canopies about publicly offering HMA to Individuals. We (Skyworks)have just finished working with the line manufacturer on our on version of Technora. That testing has been almost 3 years in the making. It is now readily available for most other canopies. The first of the line sets can be seen at the upcoming swoop meets in Georgia and North Carolina. There are many versions of Technora (HMA)out there, just be sure to use one that has some type of UV coating. As I predicted about 2 years ago, the uncoated lines will start breaking down. Ther is another ongoing thread about that now. Unless you are a swooping competitor, I still recommend Vectran for general jumping. Cheers, MELSkyworks Parachute Service, LLC www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks 0 #6 July 26, 2005 QuoteThe first of the line sets can be seen at the upcoming swoop meets in Georgia and North Carolina. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nicknitro71 0 #7 July 26, 2005 Quoteassume the Alpha doesn't originally come with HMA? Did you get the specs for continous HMA from Atair and then made them yourself? Did the characteristics of the canopy change? No the Alpha like the Viper and Cobalt comes with Spectra cascaded. I got the specs from Stane, I also calculated it on my own and I was double checking it once the As and Cs were in place. I also modified the line set quite a bit: lengthening the set by 15cm, making the canopy flatter by incrementally increasing the length span-wise, changing the brake setting, and putting a different slider. The lines were fingertraped with the Jump Shack method because I did not want to sew them: you can't do a bartack on them because they are too thin and even a straight stitch looks too big on them, that's how fine they are. I also did not want to damage them. By the way they are much thinner than what Precision and Hyper use. Of course there was some trial and error in the process. The original slider did not want to come all way down during opening. I had to pump the rears. That was due to the increased in line length. So I put a slider from a XF2 99 that is 2" shorter span-wise and 1" longer cord-wise. Then the brake setting was too shallow, now it's 2" deeper. Finally the outboard D lines were 2 cm too long so I shortened them up. Now it's all good! Yes the canopy flies quite differently: more consistent openings, faster flight, much longer recovery arc, slower toggle turns, faster front risers turn with lighter pressure, stronger flare and bottom end and it's more sensitive to harness turns. By the way the reduction in bulk from the Spectra set is 50% above the cascade and 25% below it, so it's quite impressive. The lower control lines are made of Dacron 400. I bet I can make between 500-1000 jumps on this line set, time will tell.Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. 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diablopilot 2 #2 July 26, 2005 It can be done, for a non cascaded lineset you'll have to recalculate the lengths of all the lines loosing their cascades. BTW PD charges between $120 and $140 for most of their linesets when shipped to you. The cost of instalation by your rigger or the factory will be more.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nicknitro71 0 #3 July 26, 2005 1. PD does not charge 125 bucks to reline a canopy! At least not 125 USD. 2. HMA is even more expensive than Vectran and on a non continuous set you need a bit more line, even if you do it yourself it’s not going to be cheep. 3. You gotta do the math right, you cannot use the same line set for the non-cascaded, it’s my advice to contact Icarus to see if they have the line spec for the continuous set. 4. Said that I am a big fan of HMA. I relined my Alpha with continuous HMA and I love it!Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smurf 0 #4 July 26, 2005 Just out of couriousity, do you know what PD charges for a Vectran lineset? And what is the cost of a HMA line set? I'm not planning on making the line set myself so if I were to change to HMA I would have to receive the lines in the correct lengths. Connecting the finished lines should be an easy task though, since there are no cascades. I assume the Alpha doesn't originally come with HMA? Did you get the specs for continous HMA from Atair and then made them yourself? Did the characteristics of the canopy change? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites masterrigger1 2 #5 July 26, 2005 Yes it has been done. On one of my canopies. Although, I do not manufacture continious line sets as the norm. I have stated in another thread the reasons why, but basically it will add parastic drag by using more line in the line sets. I would have to check the thoughts of Icarus Canopies about publicly offering HMA to Individuals. We (Skyworks)have just finished working with the line manufacturer on our on version of Technora. That testing has been almost 3 years in the making. It is now readily available for most other canopies. The first of the line sets can be seen at the upcoming swoop meets in Georgia and North Carolina. There are many versions of Technora (HMA)out there, just be sure to use one that has some type of UV coating. As I predicted about 2 years ago, the uncoated lines will start breaking down. Ther is another ongoing thread about that now. Unless you are a swooping competitor, I still recommend Vectran for general jumping. Cheers, MELSkyworks Parachute Service, LLC www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks 0 #6 July 26, 2005 QuoteThe first of the line sets can be seen at the upcoming swoop meets in Georgia and North Carolina. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nicknitro71 0 #7 July 26, 2005 Quoteassume the Alpha doesn't originally come with HMA? Did you get the specs for continous HMA from Atair and then made them yourself? Did the characteristics of the canopy change? No the Alpha like the Viper and Cobalt comes with Spectra cascaded. I got the specs from Stane, I also calculated it on my own and I was double checking it once the As and Cs were in place. I also modified the line set quite a bit: lengthening the set by 15cm, making the canopy flatter by incrementally increasing the length span-wise, changing the brake setting, and putting a different slider. The lines were fingertraped with the Jump Shack method because I did not want to sew them: you can't do a bartack on them because they are too thin and even a straight stitch looks too big on them, that's how fine they are. I also did not want to damage them. By the way they are much thinner than what Precision and Hyper use. Of course there was some trial and error in the process. The original slider did not want to come all way down during opening. I had to pump the rears. That was due to the increased in line length. So I put a slider from a XF2 99 that is 2" shorter span-wise and 1" longer cord-wise. Then the brake setting was too shallow, now it's 2" deeper. Finally the outboard D lines were 2 cm too long so I shortened them up. Now it's all good! Yes the canopy flies quite differently: more consistent openings, faster flight, much longer recovery arc, slower toggle turns, faster front risers turn with lighter pressure, stronger flare and bottom end and it's more sensitive to harness turns. By the way the reduction in bulk from the Spectra set is 50% above the cascade and 25% below it, so it's quite impressive. The lower control lines are made of Dacron 400. I bet I can make between 500-1000 jumps on this line set, time will tell.Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
masterrigger1 2 #5 July 26, 2005 Yes it has been done. On one of my canopies. Although, I do not manufacture continious line sets as the norm. I have stated in another thread the reasons why, but basically it will add parastic drag by using more line in the line sets. I would have to check the thoughts of Icarus Canopies about publicly offering HMA to Individuals. We (Skyworks)have just finished working with the line manufacturer on our on version of Technora. That testing has been almost 3 years in the making. It is now readily available for most other canopies. The first of the line sets can be seen at the upcoming swoop meets in Georgia and North Carolina. There are many versions of Technora (HMA)out there, just be sure to use one that has some type of UV coating. As I predicted about 2 years ago, the uncoated lines will start breaking down. Ther is another ongoing thread about that now. Unless you are a swooping competitor, I still recommend Vectran for general jumping. Cheers, MELSkyworks Parachute Service, LLC www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #6 July 26, 2005 QuoteThe first of the line sets can be seen at the upcoming swoop meets in Georgia and North Carolina. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nicknitro71 0 #7 July 26, 2005 Quoteassume the Alpha doesn't originally come with HMA? Did you get the specs for continous HMA from Atair and then made them yourself? Did the characteristics of the canopy change? No the Alpha like the Viper and Cobalt comes with Spectra cascaded. I got the specs from Stane, I also calculated it on my own and I was double checking it once the As and Cs were in place. I also modified the line set quite a bit: lengthening the set by 15cm, making the canopy flatter by incrementally increasing the length span-wise, changing the brake setting, and putting a different slider. The lines were fingertraped with the Jump Shack method because I did not want to sew them: you can't do a bartack on them because they are too thin and even a straight stitch looks too big on them, that's how fine they are. I also did not want to damage them. By the way they are much thinner than what Precision and Hyper use. Of course there was some trial and error in the process. The original slider did not want to come all way down during opening. I had to pump the rears. That was due to the increased in line length. So I put a slider from a XF2 99 that is 2" shorter span-wise and 1" longer cord-wise. Then the brake setting was too shallow, now it's 2" deeper. Finally the outboard D lines were 2 cm too long so I shortened them up. Now it's all good! Yes the canopy flies quite differently: more consistent openings, faster flight, much longer recovery arc, slower toggle turns, faster front risers turn with lighter pressure, stronger flare and bottom end and it's more sensitive to harness turns. By the way the reduction in bulk from the Spectra set is 50% above the cascade and 25% below it, so it's quite impressive. The lower control lines are made of Dacron 400. I bet I can make between 500-1000 jumps on this line set, time will tell.Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
nicknitro71 0 #7 July 26, 2005 Quoteassume the Alpha doesn't originally come with HMA? Did you get the specs for continous HMA from Atair and then made them yourself? Did the characteristics of the canopy change? No the Alpha like the Viper and Cobalt comes with Spectra cascaded. I got the specs from Stane, I also calculated it on my own and I was double checking it once the As and Cs were in place. I also modified the line set quite a bit: lengthening the set by 15cm, making the canopy flatter by incrementally increasing the length span-wise, changing the brake setting, and putting a different slider. The lines were fingertraped with the Jump Shack method because I did not want to sew them: you can't do a bartack on them because they are too thin and even a straight stitch looks too big on them, that's how fine they are. I also did not want to damage them. By the way they are much thinner than what Precision and Hyper use. Of course there was some trial and error in the process. The original slider did not want to come all way down during opening. I had to pump the rears. That was due to the increased in line length. So I put a slider from a XF2 99 that is 2" shorter span-wise and 1" longer cord-wise. Then the brake setting was too shallow, now it's 2" deeper. Finally the outboard D lines were 2 cm too long so I shortened them up. Now it's all good! Yes the canopy flies quite differently: more consistent openings, faster flight, much longer recovery arc, slower toggle turns, faster front risers turn with lighter pressure, stronger flare and bottom end and it's more sensitive to harness turns. By the way the reduction in bulk from the Spectra set is 50% above the cascade and 25% below it, so it's quite impressive. The lower control lines are made of Dacron 400. I bet I can make between 500-1000 jumps on this line set, time will tell.Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
