kallend 2,027 #1 June 8, 2010 Four fatalities in the last week attributed to canopy collisions on opening. Both is small group FS (RW) skydives. Maybe it's time to revisit breakoff and tracking procedures.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy_Copland 0 #2 June 8, 2010 Safety Rule #1 - Pull low. If you are lower than anyone on the jump it doesn't matter if they can track or not. Now, the only problem with this is if you let the word spread we might have more people who can't track pulling low putting us in even more danger. A bad tracker is a bad skydiver, so they probably pull high anyway. So now you'll only have the awesome skydivers at the bottom who have now got vast separation. Remember, with low pulls comes less time to react to a malfunction, so be sure to be wearing one of those fancy skyclaws and turn the AAD off. Canopies to think about jumping while doing this: Sabre1, Monarch, Hornet..... I strongly advise against a Spectre or Velo. Happy landings.1338 People aint made of nothin' but water and shit. Until morale improves, the beatings will continue. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dgskydive 0 #3 June 8, 2010 didnt we talk about that last year. There is a long thread about it wit pics and the whole nine yards. Found it. I think this was after an incident at Zhills http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3441772;search_string=tracking%20on%20bigways;#3441772Dom Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jtnesbitt 0 #4 June 8, 2010 QuoteSafety Rule #1 - Pull low. If you are lower than anyone on the jump it doesn't matter if they can track or not. Now, the only problem with this is if you let the word spread we might have more people who can't track pulling low putting us in even more danger. A bad tracker is a bad skydiver, so they probably pull high anyway. So now you'll only have the awesome skydivers at the bottom who have now got vast separation. Remember, with low pulls comes less time to react to a malfunction, so be sure to be wearing one of those fancy skyclaws and turn the AAD off. Canopies to think about jumping while doing this: Sabre1, Monarch, Hornet..... I strongly advise against a Spectre or Velo. Happy landings. I agree, however, as you pointed out...you are trading one risk for another. Personally i trust myself more than others so yes, when i jump with others especially people i am dont normally jump with i keep that in mind. I tend to track on my back longer than anyone else so I can shoot for the most open space and I also tend to open lower than the rest of the group. One thing to keep in mind however is the other jumps on the rest of the load. If you're jumping with a bunch of dirty low pullers then you're just going to be in the same grouping as normal but now you're a bit further in the dive curve. This happened to me last weekend when we did a 22way tracking dive. I was a bit surprised when i pitched a touch below 3000 and 3 people still dumped lower than me. Motorcycle riders might understand this analogy. When i had my bike i liked to go just a little faster than everyone else on the highway. Why? It sounds dumb as speed is a determining factor in crashes. It's a trade off. The reason i like going a little bit faster is because i trust myself more than the other drivers. By going slightly faster i can make sure i am constantly passing people....which means I always know where they are and don't have to worry about people sneaking up behind me or beside me. It's a trade off."If this post needs to be moderated I would prefer it to be completly removed and not edited and butchered into a disney movie" - DorkZone Hero Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jtnesbitt 0 #5 June 8, 2010 You know what, i changed my mind, i dont want this to catch on and find my airspace crowded. You hear that everyone? The basement is MINE so stay away! "If this post needs to be moderated I would prefer it to be completly removed and not edited and butchered into a disney movie" - DorkZone Hero Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjumpenfool 2 #6 June 8, 2010 Quote Motorcycle riders might understand this analogy....which means I always know where they are and don't have to worry about people sneaking up behind me or beside me. Exept for those pesky squad cars! I'd agree with you on that. When on the bike I like to be a little aggressive. However, I would say that a GOOD track would trump a low pull.Birdshit & Fools Productions "Son, only two things fall from the sky." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #7 June 8, 2010 You don't have to track super good - just better than the others in your quadrant...... ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjumpenfool 2 #8 June 8, 2010 Quote You don't have to track super good - just better than the others in your quadrant...... Hee..... Heee....Birdshit & Fools Productions "Son, only two things fall from the sky." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
brettski74 0 #9 June 9, 2010 Quote I tend to track on my back longer than anyone else I'm assuming that you do that because you can't track very well. A good tracker will end up above and far ahead of the rest, so the bad trackers will be below and behind them. Tracking on your belly would make it easy to see them. Back tracking would only be good to watch for everyone else if you can't track very well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trig78 0 #10 June 9, 2010 I would bet there's a lot of inexperienced jumpers, like myself, that will want to go lower than they are supposed to as soon as they have a license in their hands. How low are actually talking about, 800 m, 600m...? I'm not being a smartass, just want to know. How low would you say is safe? As for a bike, i ride faster than most trafic but i'm equaly affraid of vehicles I'm passing as I am of the ones that are passing me. Too many drivers don't see us and are changing lanes with no warning.facebook.com/trig78 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DBCOOPER 5 #11 June 9, 2010 I find it increasingly hard to figure out whos trolling anymore....Replying to: Re: Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? by billvon If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Butters 0 #12 June 9, 2010 QuotePull low. Just pulling low doesn't help if the person pulling high has a cut-away. Track farther and pull lower for safety. QuoteI strongly advise against a Spectre ... Why?"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy_Copland 0 #13 June 9, 2010 QuoteQuotePull low. Just pulling low doesn't help if the person pulling high has a cut-away. Track farther and pull lower for safety. QuoteI strongly advise against a Spectre ... Why? Opens too slow for my liking, just personal choice. Also going low doesnt mean you just box man it down. You keep on tracking like a banshee.1338 People aint made of nothin' but water and shit. Until morale improves, the beatings will continue. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #14 June 9, 2010 QuoteQuote I tend to track on my back longer than anyone else I'm assuming that you do that because you can't track very well. I suspect he does that because he's freeflying and breakoff is usually safer to back track at first (avoids odd corks and keeps your eyes on the others). But at some point, a FF'er should roll to stomach track to finish that separation (and then the rest of your comment is absolutely true) at some point, staying on the back (longer than everyone else) just keeps you too steep and it's a bad track ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jtnesbitt 0 #15 June 9, 2010 QuoteQuote I tend to track on my back longer than anyone else I'm assuming that you do that because you can't track very well. A good tracker will end up above and far ahead of the rest, so the bad trackers will be below and behind them. Tracking on your belly would make it easy to see them. Back tracking would only be good to watch for everyone else if you can't track very well. Well you know what they say about assumptions... Do you freefly much? I am going to assume you dont, or if you do you must be pretty shitty at it since back tracking for the first few seconds is a great idea especially if you have a 4way+ and a cameraflyer..."If this post needs to be moderated I would prefer it to be completly removed and not edited and butchered into a disney movie" - DorkZone Hero Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
