Rolling the chute (like a sleeping bag)

[mjosparky 4]

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A subconscious habit that I had gotten into is to pick a reference point as I'm deploying and verify that I'm seeing that reference point when the canopy has fully inflated.

This probably has a lot to do with your on heading openings. You are flat with shoulders square with the horizon. Many if not most off heading openings can be traced to one shoulder being low at line stretch.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[riggerrob 643]

Re-read what NickDG said about roll-packing.
Roll-packing is a truly ancient technique that I used to soften openings on my Strato-Cloud.

Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?

I have about 1000 jumps on first-generation Strong tandem mains that were roll-packed or flop-packed (a minor variation or roll-packing). They rarely opened softly or on-heading. Nor did they load the harness evenly. TIs had to decide whether they preferred getting punched in the left shoulder or the right shoulder.
Another disadvantage to roll/flop packing is that one side of the canopy always opens a second before the other side, ergo lines and fabric - on the "open first" side - wear out prematurely.
These days, the only canopies that I still flop pack are Strong tandem reserves because that is the only way we know to make them open softly.

On the other hand,y-packing. I actually learned the "sleeping bag roll" a several years before i learned how to do a complete psycho pack.
"Sleeping bag rolling" is a great way to stuff slippery new ZP canopies into their deployment bags.
Bridle extensions are nice, but not mandatory for "sleeping bag rolling."

[matthewcline 0]

Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?

Ouch, I do!

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[wmw999 2,446]

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Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?

Toggle pressure like a Mack truck, sized about like a jumbo PC or something like that.

I liked the Viking Superlite a whole lot better .

That said, I do sleeping-bag pack my current main (actually, I full-up psycho pack it), and like the openings just fine. Otherwise I pack to open as quickly as possible -- the rolling just keeps it to where the shock is spread a little bit more. And yes, it's on-heading.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[JohnGraham 0]

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On the other hand,y-packing. I actually learned the "sleeping bag roll" a several years before i learned how to do a complete psycho pack.
"Sleeping bag rolling" is a great way to stuff slippery new ZP canopies into their deployment bags.
Bridle extensions are nice, but not mandatory for "sleeping bag rolling."

So what's the difference between just a "sleeping bag roll" and a complete psycho pack?

[mnealtx 0]

I'm getting a bit confused myself.... what I've heard of as "psycho packing" is the canopy being worked as a normal pro pack until it's time to get it bagged, then the cocoon is rolled like a sleeping bag rather than s-folded.

What NickDG and riggerrob seem to be talking about is flat packing the canopy, then rolling instead of s-folding.

Nick/Rob, am I correct in this?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[skymama 37]

Evelyn, are you flipping the canopy over before you start rolling it up? That's what I consider a psycho pack, and it's the only way I've packed my Sabre 2. I talked to Scott Miller about it one day because it's not the "preferred" PD method and he said as long as it's working for me and I'm happy with the openings that I should just keep on doing it.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[LittleOne 0]

Don't worry about packing a new Pilot. I just got one too and I have no problem whatsoever. And I have never been accused of being a packing wiz. I was informed that Aerodyne's zp is easier to pack when new than PD's zp.

[ncfitzge 0]

Thats good news

#148 Sonic Scrat
"Have you ever kissed a rabbit between the eyes?" Woodpecker pulling out his pants pockets to the waitress

[RossDagley 0]

Rob, would you be kind enough to explain this a little more for me? I'm still struggling a little to get it in the bag - I propack with the usual s-fold at the moment.

Is this sleeping-bag method simply a matter of keeping the skin taught at the 'back' of the canopy as I pick it up and rolling it down towards my knees (still on the lines/slider presumably), or have I got the image wrong? Does this method require a bridle extension as mine is a pretty standard (short) length I think.

Thanks for taking the time to explain :)

Ross

[riggerrob 643]

Nick DG and riggerrob were talking about an ANCIENT, ANTIQUATED, OBSOLETE method known as "flop packing" or "roll-packing," that starts with laying the canopy on its side, then rolling or folding the canopy to shorten it nose-to tail. The rolls (or folds) are PARALLEL TO THE SUSPENSION LINES. When flop-packing all the folds are done towards the center (B and C lines) so that the nose and tail end up buried deep in the pack job. Delaying their exposure for an extra second slows openings a little, but forget about it opening on heading.
Hee!
Hee!
Then you still have to do some sort of s-fold to shorten it top-to-bottom before stuffing it in the d-bag.
I repeat that "flop packing" and "roll packing" are ANCIENT methods and these days I only "flop pack" Strong tandem reserves.

I only mentioned this old method for historical interest.
Sorry if I confused you young lads.

[justinb138 0]

I saw a guy packing a tiny Katana like that a few months ago.

[OATSF14 0]

My first square. Blue with red stripes.

[riggerrob 643]

Yes Ross,
You have the right idea.
A bridle extension helps, but if you gently pull the bridle attachment (the little strap sewn to the canopy) off to one side, it serves the same function.

[phoenixlpr 0]

It depends. Mine was slippery like a snail and its harder to pack if the air is dry (<60%).

[niu 0]

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Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?"

Used to own a heavyweight,freepacked in a Classiflyer.
The only advantage to that setup was that it had one single rubberband that could break.

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[tbrown 26]

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Don't worry about packing a new Pilot. I just got one too and I have no problem whatsoever. And I have never been accused of being a packing wiz. I was informed that Aerodyne's zp is easier to pack when new than PD's zp.

It is a lot easier. It's still a pain, but not hopeless like the slippery stuff PD or Icarus use.

Another nice thing about Psycho packing is that you can pick up your rolled canopy in one hand, like a football and just stuff it into the bag. You'll notice your pack volume is smaller, so you should adjust tension on your closing loop.

If you want to stick with Psycho packing longterm you should get the extension made for just a few bucks. But to try it out, all you need to do is turn twist the top of the canopy at the attachment point over 90 degrees, so that the attachment ring sticks out of the side of the roll. You should have enough material pulled out of the center to be able to bring the ring around theside of the roll when you're done (so you can see where the extension strap would help you do that). Openings are no different - nice, soft & on heading.

Nathan, this is the method that Precision preaches, not Icarus.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[airtwardo 7]

Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?


***

Rings & Ropes...

No bite on opening...and what a joy to pack!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[RossDagley 0]

Thanks Rob. Having looked at the video earlier this post combined with what you said I think its got a little clearer! I'll think about giving this a go the next time I pack but it'll be a nervous pull-time as no one I know of at my DZ packs like this so I cant see a 'real' example

Thanks again

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[phoenixlpr 0]

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Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?

I've jumped a Strato-Cloud Delta. Am I so old?

[riggerrob 643]

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Children, how many of you know what a Strato-Cloud is?

I've jumped a Strato-Cloud Delta. Am I so old?

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Naw!
You are still a young pup.
Real POPS jumped Strato-Clouds with ropes and rings: the only canopy that I enjoyed dumping in a track!
On the flip side, I hated doing hop-and-pops with ropes and rings.
OH! ... and if my fingers were not bleeding by the end of the pack job, something was missing!

[kenneth21441 0]

I have tried this some time ago back when I first started skydiving back in the early 90's. I will say this " that the opening was so so slow" that I had almost cutaway but when I looked up you could see the cells opening.

If you want to slow the openings try rolling the nose a few trurns but do not go past the B lines. I usually pack my mains with the shacle pack method. This is by rolling the nose and stacking the nose and tail into the center then stacking both groups in this middle... Results are a more slower opening and reduction in ware and tear on a faster opening canopy. Less ware means a little longer life cycle.

Just my two cents here and hope this helps..

thanks,

Ken.

Kenneth Potter
FAA Senior Parachute Rigger
Tactical Delivery Instructor (Jeddah, KSA)
FFL Gunsmith

[kleggo 145]

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That's how I pack my rig too. I don't do a psycho pack, but when it comes time to 's fold', I just put my knees where the label is, lift up the cocoon to my chest and roll on down. It works perfectly

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if so, what happens to the bridle attachment point?
does it not get swallowed up during the rolling
???????????????????


thanks

kleggo

[Chrissay 0]

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That's how I pack my rig too. I don't do a psycho pack, but when it comes time to 's fold', I just put my knees where the label is, lift up the cocoon to my chest and roll on down. It works perfectly

_______________________________________________________________

if so, what happens to the bridle attachment point?
does it not get swallowed up during the rolling
???????????????????


thanks

kleggo

It does get swallowed up by the rolling, but alls you do is pull it out of the roll until it is clear of the fabric and then you can put it in the bag.