hawkflight 0 #1 December 23, 2005 I'm building a rig and have decided on a 190 main based on my exit weight and experience. Trouble is there are so many options as to which 190 to buy. I have only jumped a Sabre 2 and a Triathlon and I like the 9 cell better but there are many other 9 cells available. I'm not sure, due to my in-experience, which would be the right choice for me. And quite honestly I don't know the difference between a Diablo and a Stilletto. At this point in my skydiving career I am ready to get an education on the pros and cons of the various 190 canopies available today. I would like to make an informed, wise purchase rather then just grabbing the best deal out there. Would anybody be interested in giving me a quick synopsis of how to make the RIGHT choice. Thanks ~Tattoo Tom............................... "Any fool can learn for his own mistakes, a wise man learns from anothers." Mark Twain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
artistcalledian 0 #2 December 23, 2005 pilot________________________________________ drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hawkflight 0 #3 December 23, 2005 What in the world is that supossed to mean.....that's why I hate posting questions on this site ....most of you guys make me feel stupid for asking a simple question ...how are you supposed to learn if you do not ask....sorry I was not born with a cypress up my ass......but racial slurs should not be allowed on this site.....anyway thanks for nothin'............................... "Any fool can learn for his own mistakes, a wise man learns from anothers." Mark Twain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevebabin 0 #4 December 23, 2005 The Pilot is a main from Aerodyne. The racial slur is his signature line. It's on all of his posts..... SabreII I think would be an excellent choice. I would not recommend buying (or even jumping, for that matter) an original Sabre. Triathalon is a solid canopy, Jack of all trades, but master of none. Fairly old technology, by todays standards. I've had no personal experience with the Pilot. Blues! Steve Babin"Science, logic and reason will fly you to the moon. Religion will fly you into buildings." "Because figuring things out is always better than making shit up." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlindBrick 0 #5 December 23, 2005 To the list that's been started, I'd add the Safire II and the Fusion. -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #6 December 23, 2005 He's known to be confrontational around here. I'd say ignore him completely, however, the Pilot is a good canopy to check out. You might also look at the articles section I've linked below, particularly the articles by Lisa Briggs. There's lots of great info on good canopies for newer skydivers. Demoing canopies can be a good way to learn what you like and don't like. Larger boogies will have reps from the manufacturers there; if not, larger DZs often have demo canopies available. Lastly, if neither is feasible for you, contact the manufacturers about demo canopies. Generally they will allow you to demo for a weekend or two for just the cost of shipping it to you. http://www.dropzone.com/safety/Gear_and_Equipment/index.shtml"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yamtx73 0 #7 December 23, 2005 QuoteYou might also look at the articles section I've linked below, particularly the articles by Lisa Briggs. There's lots of great info on good canopies for newer skydivers. I've read her articles and found them to be fairly helpful.The only naturals in this sport shit thru feathers... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GQ_jumper 4 #8 December 23, 2005 The Pilot is an awesome beginnner canopy, its a 9-cell semi elliptical ZP canopy, has great openings, is really easy to pack(once you break it in), and very forgiving should you make a mistake. I'll also add this since no one else has yet, talk to your instructors about what you are looking for, they know your canopy skills and can best tell you what would work for you and what size.History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or the timid. --Dwight D. Eisenhower Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
micro 0 #9 December 23, 2005 QuoteWhat in the world is that supossed to mean.....that's why I hate posting questions on this site ....most of you guys make me feel stupid for asking a simple question ...how are you supposed to learn if you do not ask....sorry I was not born with a cypress up my ass......but racial slurs should not be allowed on this site.....anyway thanks for nothin' i'm personally going with a fusion. seems to be up there w/ the pilot, sabre2, safireII, etc. as a somewhat "beginner" canopy w/ lots of room to grow in. i chose the fusion instead of one of the others in this general category more for personal reasons... chris martin, who used to work at precision aerodynamics, was one of my AFF instructors who died last year. our last conversation was about the fusion and how much he thought i'd like it. so, jumping it, when it finally gets here, will sort of be a remembrance of chris. I miss Lee. And JP. And Chris. And... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob.dino 1 #10 December 23, 2005 The most popular 9-cells for junior jumpers: Sabre2 Safire2 Pilot The most popular 7-cells for junior jumpers: Spectre Triathlon Any of these will serve you well. If possible, rent or demo before you buy to see which you like most. Stilettos and Diablos are not suitable canopies for less-experienced jumpers; they're fully elliptical. There's a huge amount of information on this site about all the canopies listed above. Get yourself a coffee/cold beer, use the Search Posts link near the top of the page, and settle down for a lot of reading . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #11 December 23, 2005 I'll mention the Silhouette. It's not a very popular canopy, but I love mine. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nate_1979 9 #12 December 23, 2005 QuoteI'll mention the Silhouette. It's not a very popular canopy, but I love mine. Yes, an excellent canopy (atleast at light loadings) ... FGF #??? I miss the sky... There are 10 types of people in the world... those who understand binary and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tso-d_chris 0 #13 December 23, 2005 For nine cell canopies, try the Aerodyne Pilot, PD Sabre 2, and the Icarus Safire2. All have good reputations of nice openings and landings, while being fairly easy to fly. The PD Silhouette is also a nice choice, although it is not as popular because it is not made entirely of zero porosity fabric. This has the benefit of making the canopy easy to pack. Any of these canopies, sized appropriately, are well suited to newer (and experienced) jumpers. If you are considering a used canopy, you can add the Safire (original) and the Sabre (original) to the list. Both are nine cell canopies made of Zero P fabric. The Sabre is a rectangular nine cell that has a reputation for brisk openings and easy landings. The Safire is a tapered canopy that opens and lands nicely. I would also suggest trying a Spectre, from Performance Designs. While it is a seven cell like a Triathlon, it is also tapered, compared to the rectangular Triathlon. Brian Germain with Big Air Sportz markets the Lotus as a good canopy for newer jumpers if sized appropriately. It is also a tapered seven cell. Canopies not well suited for newer jumpers include the Stiletto, Crossfire (original or 2), Katana, Mamba, Extreme VX and FX, Velocity, Vengeance, Samurai. Neither the list of suitable canopies, nor the list of unsuitable canopies should be considered complete. Seek the advice of instructors before purchasing. I highly recommend demoing potential choices prior to purchase. Most manufacturers have good demo programs that allow you to try before you buy. BTW what reserve have you chosen? Good luck! chris@tso-d.com The Skydiving Outlet - Deland For Great Deals on Gear Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #14 December 23, 2005 QuoteI'll mention the Silhouette. It's not a very popular canopy, but I love mine. One of the best kept secrets in skydiving. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,075 #15 December 23, 2005 > And quite honestly I don't know the difference between a Diablo and a Stilletto. Diablo - elliptical 7 cell. I don't like them; not stable with brakes stowed at mid to high loadings. Some people do. Stiletto - elliptical 9 cell. Fairly high performance. Not very safe (IMO) at lighter loadings. I once jumped a Stiletto 190 at about 1:1 and was worried at how much it was waffling and breathing. >Would anybody be interested in giving me a quick synopsis of how to >make the RIGHT choice. I would demo a: Pilot 188 (9 cell) Silhouette 190 (9 cell, half F111 so it's easy to pack) Spectre 190 (7 cell) Safire-2 190 (9 cell) avoid the Safire 1 Those are all similar performance. The Spectre is a very slow opening canopy, but doesn't glide quite as well as the 9 cells. I really like the Pilot series; between Amy and I we have 3 of them because of their good behavior during opening, good glide and strong flare. The Silhouette is a decent canopy that is easier to pack than most 9 cells. Silhouettes tend to fly like a 'smaller' canopy - if you demo a Spectre 190, then a Silhouette 190, the Silhouette will seem like a smaller, faster canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 102 #16 December 23, 2005 Precision's Fusion should be considered for a docile 9 cell, and is going for really cheap ($1195 for a 190). http://www.skydivestore.com/english.cgi?&12152005190847People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hexadecimal 0 #17 December 23, 2005 I'm partial to the Safire and Safire2... Soft, usually on heading openings, and lots of fun to fly in general. I'd suggest demoing a few of your potential choices and deciding what you like that way, though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
micro 0 #18 December 23, 2005 why did you not mention the fusion? you're someone whose opinion I respect and I wonder if there's something about it you don't like... I'd like to hear what you have to say. PM if you'd rather. I miss Lee. And JP. And Chris. And... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plutoniumsalmon 0 #19 December 23, 2005 I jumped a fusion 170 at about 1.24 wing loading and found it to be very nice. Nice openings and good flare. I was thinking about buying it but could not as I ordered all my gear from zoodive on the evolution program and they only carry Icarus and PD. I went with the sabre 2 as it was recomended by my DZO and instructors for better resale value (just incase I end up not using the evolution program) and similar performance to a fusion.Pointy birds Oh pointy pointy Anoint my head Anointy nointy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
micro 0 #20 December 23, 2005 thanks for the info! I miss Lee. And JP. And Chris. And... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #21 December 23, 2005 I thought the Lotus has 9 cells? That might explain why my jump on one didn't open the way I wanted it to - if I packed it like it had two extra cells, then who knows what pieces of nylon I was grabbing and moving around. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #22 December 23, 2005 Hawk, You will find that when some posters come out of SC they don't know how to behave in polite company. Good luck on your choice of canopies. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Joellercoaster 6 #23 December 23, 2005 Silhouettes do seem to get great reviews but there seem to be none around. Well-kept secret? Some lesser-known mains I wish I'd been able to try (and will when I'm next shopping for a canopy, even if it means I'm shopping for a long time): Lotus Silhouette Firebolt Then I will probably buy another Pilot I guess those three are sort of "oddball" canopies in their different ways. One is airlocked, the other two are hybrid ZP/F-111... perhaps this accounts for their left-field status in the present market?-- "I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan "You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RossDagley 0 #24 December 23, 2005 I jump a Pilot 188 and a Smart 190 reserve. Even with my man-does-christmas-present-wrapping packing technique, its always soft, on heading, and smooth. Flare is easy light and progressive. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kolla 0 #25 December 23, 2005 QuoteOne of the best kept secrets in skydiving. - completely agree there Sparky!! I did a portion of Scott Miller's canopy course under a Silhouette 170 (normally fly a Katana 107) and I was just blown away with the whole experience. I know some people are turned off by the fact that it is not a fully zero p canopy, but for a young jumper just mastering packing the ease of packing hybrids is just what the doctor ordered Blue ones!! KollaBlue Skies Magazine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
