VooDoo vs. Mirage

[BDashe 0]

Just looking ahead- Most people I jump with encourage mirage even though VooDoo claims to be the ultimate freefly rig. Much of a difference? any thoughts on either mirage or voodoo? ive jumped a bunch of mirages, never a voodoo. just looking for any thoughts from those with experience, thanks!!!

So there I was...

Making friends and playing nice since 1983

[RMURRAY 1]

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Just looking ahead- Most people I jump with encourage mirage even though VooDoo claims to be the ultimate freefly rig. Much of a difference? any thoughts on either mirage or voodoo? ive jumped a bunch of mirages, never a voodoo. just looking for any thoughts from those with experience, thanks!!!

if you are going to buy new, aren't all manufacturers equally freefly friendly? i.e. they are all excellent. To me, that is an old term that seems it will never go away.

rm

[Fast 0]

Thoughts: Test jump a voodoo. Then go and test jump a vector and a javelin and anything else you might be interseted in buying.

Any modern rig is going to be acceptable for freeflying. Most of the choice in what rig to buy has to do with comfort, what other jumpers on the DZ have, and minor differences in features.

If you ask someone what rig is the best they are going to tell you the rig that they fly. I will spare you my vector preaching. Bottom line is, try some rigs out, have someone explain the positives and negatives of each design to you (a rigger not a salesman) and go from there.

~D
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka

[GravityGirl 0]

The only problem with that theory is that many jumpers don't have the luxury of jumping at a big drop zone or close to one. So being able to jump several types of modern containers is not an option.

It is good advise. Just not always applicable.

That being said, both Mirage and Voodoo are excellent choices.

Some Similarities: Enclosed pop tops on the reserve. Main pin protection closes up. Great riser coverage. Solid reserve pilot chute springs.

Some Differences: Minor differences in packing methods. Ask your rigger if he has packed both. Asthetics. Which do you like the look of better? And yes, we can get that picky. Price breakdown. Voodoo is all inclusive with only a couple of cost options. Mirage has a lot of cost options. You can get as much or as little as you like.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace and Blue Skies!
Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear!

[BDashe 0]

Good deal. Thanks for the info. I realize that mirage, javelin and voodoo etc. are all freefly friendly, im happy with my wings right now :-) Thanks for all the rest of the info, i wasn't sure if there was some defining feature for function or comfort on the voodoo. I havent seen too many around, so hopefully ill come across one when it comes time and give it a try. Thanks again, clear skies.

So there I was...

Making friends and playing nice since 1983

[grasshopper 0]

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VooDoo claims to be the ultimate freefly rig.

It looks like you are buying into the manufacturers hype. Just because the people trying to sell you something say it, it doesn't make it true. I'd recommend you don't look at jump shacks website, because then you will believe all rigs other than a racer are unsafe.

To answer the question, I like Mirage a lot. I think Voodoos (doodoos) are adequate, but ugly (not just the design, but wrinkles when packed) and the riser covers have a nasty habit of opeing on many of them. I've heard rumor Sandy considers the voodoo a step in the evolution towards the Talon FS. I like the FS much more than the voodoo, even for freeflying.

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Abbie drove me to Idaho and all I got was this lousy sigline

[tso-d_chris 0]

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VooDoo claims to be the ultimate freefly rig.

It looks like you are buying into the manufacturers hype. Just because the people trying to sell you something say it, it doesn't make it true. I'd recommend you don't look at jump shacks website, because then you will believe all rigs other than a racer are unsafe.

The same could be said for the other manufacturers too, much more so than Jump Shack. A marketing department's job is to sell a product, not disseminate accurate information.

To the original poster:

Is there a reason you have narrowed your decision to these two containers? Either will be freefly friendly, as are pretty much all new containers, though the Voodoo is not available in large sizes, IIRC.

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[packing_jarrett 0]

dude you used to have a racer didn't you. I thought you were a racer buff. Remember me and my dad brett Martin from Taft. Didn't he sell you a racer. What happened to you

Na' Cho' Cheese

[grasshopper 0]

Whats up, Jarrett. Yes, I remember you and your dad (how could I forget someone who saved my life at least once, maybe twice?). I have had 2 racers, and while I liked jumping them, I never could recommend them to anyone else, due to higher maintanence and lack of resale value. I've also had problems with jump shack as a company.

My point wasn't to bash JS, but they have a lot of hypocrisy on their site (e.g. thier stance on tuck tabs) and some things I think are outright dangerous (rubber bands on reserves, non-reinforced mini-risers). Also thier position on "fail safe harness" is a joke.

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Abbie drove me to Idaho and all I got was this lousy sigline

[RMURRAY 1]

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while I liked jumping them, I never could recommend them to anyone else, due to higher maintanence...

get informed....JumpShack have a bullet proof freefly rig with no velcro and have for years.

rm

[RMURRAY 1]

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(e.g. thier stance on tuck tabs) and some things I think are outright dangerous (rubber bands on reserves, non-reinforced mini-risers). Also thier position on "fail safe harness" is a joke.

I will go with John Sherman's opinion before yours any day. Non reinforced risers - not sure what the hell you are talking about here. Bottom line is all the main manufacturers offer freefly friendly rigs. It comes down to personal preference. How's the pd126r I sold to you working out?

rm

[grasshopper 0]

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(e.g. thier stance on tuck tabs) and some things I think are outright dangerous (rubber bands on reserves, non-reinforced mini-risers). Also thier position on "fail safe harness" is a joke.

I will go with John Sherman's opinion before yours any day. Non reinforced risers - not sure what the hell you are talking about here. Bottom line is all the main manufacturers offer freefly friendly rigs. It comes down to personal preference. How's the pd126r I sold to you working out?

rm

And I will go with people like Bill Booth, and the majority of manufacturers who don't use rubber bands on freebags. I know a lot of people like to quote MIL spec rubber bands are designed to break, but when I read the spec's I couldn't find anywhere that said breaking strength (feel free to point it out if I am wrong). http://www.keenerrubber.com/mil_specs_.htm

As for reinforced mini-risers, you know that piece of red webbing sandwiched in the riser where the larger ring sits? Last I checked, JS doesn't use that, claiming their risers don't need it. Also, at least 2 sets of risers I own were deemed bad based on the Relative Workshops standards.

I never said Racers were not freefly friendly, but many others will. Like I said, I liked my racers. To be honest, the only reason I sold them was because I had a hard time finding local riggers who made them look good on R&Is.

I was happy with the 126, never deployed it, and I have since sold it.

Then again, this whole post was a waste because the original poster only asked about voodoos and mirages, not racers.

________________________________________________________
Abbie drove me to Idaho and all I got was this lousy sigline

[BDashe 0]

I like the look of the mirages and have jumped em a bunch. I see mostly javelin and mirage at my dz, just curious about the other stuff i ahvent seen but read about. As for voodoo, i was just lookin to see if it was a marketing ploy or if i was over looking some super progressive freefly mod. Thanks for the comments, feel free to add. being a student i have practically no money, so when i buy skydiving stuff, or any expensive stuff, i like to research a bunch first and get opinions from the field.

So there I was...

Making friends and playing nice since 1983

[Guest 1010]

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just curious about the other stuff

lots of Infinity rigs by Velocity Sports Equipment here in the NW, I'm a newb but the way they do their risers seems the best for FF, totally enclosed. Take a look at one when you get a chance.

You can have it good, fast, or cheap: pick two.

[RMURRAY 1]

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As for reinforced mini-risers, you know that piece of red webbing sandwiched in the riser where the larger ring sits? Last I checked, JS doesn't use that, claiming their risers don't need it. Also, at least 2 sets of risers I own were deemed bad based on the Relative Workshops standards.

You must be looking at OLD risers. The last couple of sets I have ordered have the red webbing. I replace them at 500 jumps, maybe yours were well used.


As for the posters question, ask Riggerrob about Voo Doos I think he worked at RI and knows alot about the history of the Talon, Flexon etc.

rm

[LearningTOfly 0]

I remember hearing once that voodoos tend to wiggle around in a sitfly. Just to say...

[riggerrob 643]

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I remember hearing once that voodoos tend to wiggle around in a sitfly. Just to say...

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I will bet that most of that grumbling came from second owners. For example, I am currently re-sizing a Talon 2 for a guy who is 2 inches shorter and 40 pounds lighter than the original owner.
Hee!
Hee!
I used to be the guy who fixed all the ill-fitting harnesses that got returned to R.I. Only about five percent of new production didn't fit. Half of those problems were caused by skydivers "inventing" new measuring methods, while measuring themselves. The other half of the ill-fitting harnesses ... R.I. "goofed." Half of those "goofs", the customer was on the dividing line between medium and large ...
You will hear similar stories from other factories.

[riggerrob 643]

I much prefer packing Voodoo reserves.
Given the 2004 Service Bulletin and the ongoing problems with loops, I wonder if Mirage is pushing the edge of the envelope on enclosed reserve pilot chutes.
For example, it took me two tries to close the Mirage G4 - currently in my shop - but when I finished, the loop was frayed, so I have to re-open the F*&^%$#@~! thing and replace the loop.
Did I tell you how much I enjoy the overly-tight side flaps on Mirage reserves?????

[tso-d_chris 0]

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My point wasn't to bash JS, but they have a lot of hypocrisy on their site (e.g. thier stance on tuck tabs) and some things I think are outright dangerous (rubber bands on reserves, non-reinforced mini-risers). Also thier position on "fail safe harness" is a joke.

There is a reason other major h/c manufacturers are looking for ways to modify or eliminate tuck tabs.

Racer's speed bag has support among other h/c manufacturers.

Although you would be hard pressed to find a (new) poorly designed harness/container these days, you would also be hard pressed to find a design superior to the Racer.

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[tso-d_chris 0]

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And I will go with people like Bill Booth, and the majority of manufacturers who don't use rubber bands on freebags. I know a lot of people like to quote MIL spec rubber bands are designed to break, but when I read the spec's I couldn't find anywhere that said breaking strength (feel free to point it out if I am wrong). http://www.keenerrubber.com/mil_specs_.htm

Out of curiosity, why would you trust one veteran h/c manufacturer, and not another?

IMO, John Sherman is just as qualified to accurately comment on gear as is Bill Booth. I speak with JS often about gear, and I can tell you, he is very fond of the scientific method.

Don't get me wrong, Bill Booth deserves respect; he has made great contributions to the sport. However, like everyone else, he is not infallible. It is best to listen to other viewpoints as well in order to make an informed decision.

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[darnknit 0]

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Racer's speed bag has support among other h/c manufacturers.

which ones?

pulling is cool. keep it in the skin

[tso-d_chris 0]

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Racer's speed bag has support among other h/c manufacturers.

which ones?

At least one of RWS's engineers has publicly supported the design, to name one.

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[darnknit 0]

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At least one of RWS's engineers has publicly supported the design, to name one.

who?

pulling is cool. keep it in the skin

[tso-d_chris 0]

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who?

Do a search!

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[darnknit 0]

didn't find any people claiming to work for other manufacturers that support the speedbag. since you don't seem to want to supply any names yourself, it looks like you may have been mistaken.

i even dedicated an entire thread to your claim that other manufacturers support the speedbag. twenty-eight posts later i still haven't been able to verify your claim.

pulling is cool. keep it in the skin