I am so angry...

[mamajumps 0]

Last night I agreed to let my oldest son have one of his friends over. I had previously decided I didnt like this kid, becuase anytime my son was in trouble at school, this kid was apart of it. I really didnt know tho who was the instigator, so I let the kid come over to spend the night and give him a chance. About 11p, my husband called ( he is working out of state for the next four months) and he wanted to talk to our son. I took the phone outside to the band room where he and his friend were hanging out only to find that my son had spray painted the outside of the band room door (its actually a mother-in-law house). It looked like bridge graffitti. I was so mad I was shaking. My husband talked to him for awhile and our son had to stay up last night scrubbing the paint off with mineral spirits. Today he has to repaint the door. This morning when I went into the garage, I see where his friend had spray painted two of the panels on the inside of the gargage. His dad told me last night that he would sleep on his punishment, but by the way he was acting last night, nothing will be done. He says its just something 11 yro boys do.... I see this as a really big deal. Our son has been getting into trouble since the 4th grade, this year he was kicked off the bus twice and had ISS and work detail numerous times and was expelled once for a day. And this is normal to my husband??? I was considered a bad kid, but I didnt start getting into trouble until 7th grade and even then, I didnt do anything near as bad as this. I don't know what to do. No kind of punishment really works with our son. The only thing that really gets his attention and then it isnt for long is a good butt whoopin. We have tried everything from grounding to good (big) rewards for good behavior. The next 4 months with my husband working out of state is gonna be hard enough with out having an 11 yro that I can't control. (He is also as big as me at 11).. thanks for reading my long rant...

[trob500 0]

hey at least he's not robbing people or killing puppies....kids are borderline retarded at that age. just keep doing what youre doing. the scrubbing the door and repainting was good enough. but kids that age are going to do stupid shit no matter what. something just doesn't click in their heads....i did a a LOT of crap when i was that age.....but they grow out of it

you're husbands got it right...mom's tend to overreact

[Richards 0]

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hey at least he's not robbing people or killing puppies....kids are borderline retarded at that age. just keep doing what youre doing. the scrubbing the door and repainting was good enough. but kids that age are going to do stupid shit no matter what. something just doesn't click in their heads....i did a a LOT of crap when i was that age.....but they grow out of it

you're husbands got it right...mom's tend to overreact

Uhm....spraypainting your parents house is not minor. If this is not stopped now it will only get worse.

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

[Richards 0]

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Last night I agreed to let my oldest son have one of his friends over. I had previously decided I didnt like this kid, becuase anytime my son was in trouble at school, this kid was apart of it. I really didnt know tho who was the instigator, so I let the kid come over to spend the night and give him a chance. About 11p, my husband called ( he is working out of state for the next four months) and he wanted to talk to our son. I took the phone outside to the band room where he and his friend were hanging out only to find that my son had spray painted the outside of the band room door (its actually a mother-in-law house). It looked like bridge graffitti. I was so mad I was shaking. My husband talked to him for awhile and our son had to stay up last night scrubbing the paint off with mineral spirits. Today he has to repaint the door. This morning when I went into the garage, I see where his friend had spray painted two of the panels on the inside of the gargage. His dad told me last night that he would sleep on his punishment, but by the way he was acting last night, nothing will be done. He says its just something 11 yro boys do.... I see this as a really big deal. Our son has been getting into trouble since the 4th grade, this year he was kicked off the bus twice and had ISS and work detail numerous times and was expelled once for a day. And this is normal to my husband??? I was considered a bad kid, but I didnt start getting into trouble until 7th grade and even then, I didnt do anything near as bad as this. I don't know what to do. No kind of punishment really works with our son. The only thing that really gets his attention and then it isnt for long is a good butt whoopin. We have tried everything from grounding to good (big) rewards for good behavior. The next 4 months with my husband working out of state is gonna be hard enough with out having an 11 yro that I can't control. (He is also as big as me at 11).. thanks for reading my long rant...

Sounds rough. Have you been working with his teachers regularly? Maybe constant communication and feedback between you and them might help. Also have you considered counselling? Sorry if you have already thought of this and my comments are redundant.

Anyway, good luck.

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

[SkydiveStMarys 0]

Totally agree. If it was my son I would be totally pissed! He would be cleaning it up, repainting, and grounded for quite some time (even at 11 he would probably get his butt whooped!). Shows total disregard for someone elses property. The other child, would not be allowed back in any shape or form.

Bobbi

A miracle is not defined by an event. A miracle is defined by gratitude.

[Gawain 0]

Something akin to "total control" sounds necessary. Like, nothing but School, homework, chores, etc, for about two or three months.

I don't know if you work or not, but have you thought about home-schooling? A lot of home-school programs involve some measure of "group" time with other home-school kids once or twice per week (like labs, etc).

Tagging the house at 11 isn't normal, but I would remove that other kid from the equation immediately to see where the trouble truly resides. While I understand your husband's point, I think he's taking it a little too lax, as these aren't pranks your kid is getting in trouble for (that's something to be "understood" -- like if they took a paper backing and covered the door, and "pretended" to tag the door), it's actual belligerent behavior.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[BillyVance 34]

A few years ago my parents were having major renovation work done on their house, and they were out of town this one day. The contractors were working in the house. The kids across the street are known brats and they have paintball guns. One of the contractors saw them playing in their yard that day. Maybe 30 minutes later he came outside to get something from his truck and noticed a big splotch of paint on the front door. He knew who was responsible right off the bat, and marched right over to the kids' house and rang the bell. Their mom answered. He explained the situation and she yelled at her boy to come front and center. He did. She told him to do whatever the man tells him to do to get that paint cleaned off, or else.

Back in my day, those words "or else" struck fear in our minds. I dunno about that kid, but he sulked off with the contractor and cleaned the paint off, and seemed to hate every bit of it. At least we haven't seen any more problems from that kid since.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[Beerlight 0]

Do what my dad did, whipped my ass until it was blue......worked like a charm. (although that needs to be instilled from an early age)

I think my last ass beating was when I was 14. Most people these days are too politically correct to actually discipline their children. Many years later, I thanked my father for being tough on us boys. It set me on a course of success later in life.....

Thank you Dad!

[Nightingale 0]

The "Band room"? Is he in a band? If so, I kinda understand why he'd want to decorate. If it was someplace that was pretty much exclusively his, he might not have thought twice about it. But, if it was something that wasn't really treated as his, he shouldn't have been painting it, and knows it.

Forbidding your kid to hang out with someone is a pretty much a guarantee that that person is now their new best friend.

If your kid has been this much trouble, have you looked into counseling? There may be something going on that you don't know about.

[tigra 0]

OK, I hate to be blunt but based on everything you have posted over the past several months, I would say you are essentially a single parent with a husband who is gone more than he is at home. Its not his place to decide on the punishment especially since he won't be around to enforce it and I think that's the root of the problem. Either your son is screaming out for attention or he knows he can get away with whatever he wants to do. He's obviously testing you both.

And just because he's big on the outside doesn't mean he isn't still a little boy in the inside. You're going to have a lot more luck trying to get him under control at 11 than you will be at 14 or 16.

[BillyVance 34]

There's something to be said about having a strong hand at home, namely fathers who are around to discipline their kids. I have a cousin who served several tours in Vietnam in the US Army. He had a wife and three boys on base somewhere. Although life on a military base was somewhat structured, those boys soon started getting in trouble when the father was gone. Although he did everything he possibly could do to be a good father, it just wasn't good enough. Those boys grew up as trouble-makers. One died in a car wreck. Another one killed the ex-boyfriend of his wife-to-be (in self defense, he claimed). And the third one is actually a little better person, but still easily gets riled up when the "killer" brother instigates things. You know how you follow the oldest brother? Their dad and step-mom (real mom died of cancer) are scared of their two boys (now in their 40s) and have set up their wills that if anything happens to them and the boys are responsible, they get nothing. The boys have had "inheritance" ingrained in their minds for a long while now, as neither of them can manage money properly.

On the other hand, another cousin has three children (2 girls and a boy) and also served the US Army in Vietnam too, and all three kids grew up into awesome people you'd love, despite missing their father for long stretches at times. I suspect their mother had a strong hand as well, but yeah, they did get in their share of trouble. The worst incident was the youngest kid, a girl, got really pissed off at her oldest sibling, also the other girl, and started chasing her through the house. Fortunately their dad was home at the time. The younger one threw an object at her sister and missed, instead shattering the glass case holding antique chinaware. Dad grabbed his younger daughter and held her in a full nelson while she was screaming "I'll KILL her!!"

Boy was the mom PISSED about the china! Glad I wasn't in that house then!

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[tigra 0]

I agree about the firm hand, but I disagree that it needs to be the fathers. I don't really think its fair that the dads have to be the ones to dish out the punishments in general- not fair to the kids, not fair to the dads and not fair to the moms. That whole concept is dated and doesn't really work in today's society where families are a lot less traditional. (When I was growing up, I think I was a little more afraid of my mom than I was my dad. Mom was around a lot more and she did have a pretty firm hand.)

Plus that whole "Just wait until your father gets home" threat only works if Dad will be home in a few hours (not days or weeks) and will actually do something when he gets there.

[mamajumps 0]

I will try to answer everything that was brought up...

My son that did this is not my biological son, however I have been "mom" since he was 18M old. His birth mom chooses to not be around. My husband says I don't discipline the kids and this is why things are they way they are. Nothing could be further from the truth. I have spanked them all since they were old enough to get spanked and understand why, they all get grounded (from what and how long depends on their age). So if this isnt discipline, I have no clue what is. My son has issues with any female authority figure. The band room that I mentioned is where my son sleeps becuase dad thought it would be ok and it also gives him a place for his guitars and drums. There is no band yet, but he has been playing the guitar for going on two years and I must admit is quite good. We also only have a three bedroom home and he was previously sharing a bedroom with his two younger brothers and it was very crowded. This room is only maybe 1500 feet from the backdoor of our house. I was raised in a very strict "old-world" style home where my sister and I got knocked into next month for nearly everything. My dad was a bit overboard, but I would have never in a million years would have thought about spray painting my parents home. Even the friends I hung out (boys included) wouldnt have dreamed of doing this. When I took the friend home this morning, I spoke to his dad and all dad said to his son was "son a good rule of thumb is, if you didnt buy it, dont try it". No apology, no nothing. My husband has backed me on the decision I made to forbid our son from associating with this kid. Thanks for all of the feedback so far... I really helps me to see the broad picture by hearing others opinions.

I must give dad kudos tho, he currently has our son out in the horse pasture picking up all the poop, and well we have two horses and a pony, so there is a lot of poop.

On the home-schooling thing, I would love to be able to homeschool all of our kids, however, I work fulltime, and have an amazing job that pays really well working for The Methodist Conference. And as far as counseling goes, I have wanted to get him counseling for sometime, for two reason one to help me and him have a better relationship and two to help him work thru any issues he may have from his birth mom not being around. However, dad I can't say doesnt support the idea, but isnt totally into it. Maybe with him gone for 4 months I can get some counseling done. I love this child as if I had given birth to him, but he aggrevates the ever loving dog crap right outta me...

[misskriss 0]

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We also only have a three bedroom home and he was previously sharing a bedroom with his two younger brothers and it was very crowded. This room is only maybe 1500 feet from the backdoor of our house.

If you and your husband have one room and the boys have the other room then who is in the third room? I think eleven is a bit too young to be out in the M-I-L house. I say make him move back inside where he can be monitored. I think taking away priviledges works very good with kids. What's his favorite thing?? His guitar. Take it away for awhile and tell him that when he can prove to you that he cares about his property he can have it back.

[Richards 0]

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Totally agree. If it was my son I would be totally pissed! He would be cleaning it up, repainting, and grounded for quite some time (even at 11 he would probably get his butt whooped!). Shows total disregard for someone elses property. The other child, would not be allowed back in any shape or form.

Agreed. I would make sure that there was no uncertainty that there are consequenses of such actions. While I may not have the stomach to carry out an actual butt-whipping, my wife would be more than pleased to be "bad cop" on that one. The nintendo/tv (and related mind numbing entertainment) would disappear until about a months worth of chores were completed. He would also be under a strict supervision regime, where he would come straight home from school, do homework, only attend organised extra-curricular activities (scouts, hockey, piano lessons etc) until he convinced me that he could be trusted.

My biggest handicap is that sometimes the hole in the front of my head operates a tad bit faster than the grey matter contained within.

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[Nightingale 0]

So why can't he paint his own room? It's his space. He should've asked, of course... I'm just saying that his actions might not've been malicious, just a desire to decorate his space that might be able to be channeled into a more appropriate outlet.

[skydiverbry 0]

Hey,You sure that my son and your are not the sme person?

--------------------------------------------------
Growing old is mandatory.Growing up is optional!!

D.S.#13(Dudeist Skdiver)

[airtwardo 7]

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So why can't he paint his own room? It's his space. He should've asked, of course... I'm just saying that his actions might not've been malicious, just a desire to decorate his space that might be able to be channeled into a more appropriate outlet.

"...my son had spray painted the outside of the band room door (its actually a mother-in-law house)."

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Nightingale 0]

My brother drew all over his door when he was a pre-teen. My parents figured that it was his door, and he had to live with it until he asked for help to re-paint it. It stayed until he got embarrassed about always having to explain it to his friends, and it was a better lesson that way than if my parents had been screaming at him.

All I'm saying is that
1. while it may be outside, it is the door to his room
2. there may not be any malice or mischief, just a desire for individuality that could be better channeled.

[mamajumps 0]

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We also only have a three bedroom home and he was previously sharing a bedroom with his two younger brothers and it was very crowded. This room is only maybe 1500 feet from the backdoor of our house.

If you and your husband have one room and the boys have the other room then who is in the third room? I think eleven is a bit too young to be out in the M-I-L house. I say make him move back inside where he can be monitored. I think taking away priviledges works very good with kids. What's his favorite thing?? His guitar. Take it away for awhile and tell him that when he can prove to you that he cares about his property he can have it back.

Our daughter is in the third room. He is however moving back inside for the summer, b/c our middle son is spending the summer in TX with his grandparents so one of the bunks is open.

[mamajumps 0]

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So why can't he paint his own room? It's his space. He should've asked, of course... I'm just saying that his actions might not've been malicious, just a desire to decorate his space that might be able to be channeled into a more appropriate outlet.

He caint paint it, one on the outside at all, because he isnt paying the rent right now which will become a mortgage in september. And he was told that he can do anything to the inside with supervison. I am all about posters and black lights and even painting the walls with designs in woolight (it glows in black lights). However I will not have graffitti type destruction on the outside where the whole world can see it. Yes its his room, but its my property,(that I'm paying 200,000 dollars for) that I will be living in long after he has flown the coop. Its a respect thing...

[Nightingale 0]

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And he was told that he can do anything to the inside with supervison. I am all about posters and black lights and even painting the walls with designs in woolight (it glows in black lights). However I will not have graffitti type destruction on the outside where the whole world can see it.

Cool. Was he told that before or after he painted the door?

[Nightingale 0]

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Our daughter is in the third room. He is however moving back inside for the summer, b/c our middle son is spending the summer in TX with his grandparents so one of the bunks is open.

Was this his idea, or is he being forced to move out of what he considers "his space" and into his brother's room? Just thinking this might be a reason for the acting out.

[Keith 0]

What difference does it make? I would have never, in a million years, ever considered painting the outside of my parents house unless I was willing to suffer terrible consequences.

Keith

Don't Fuck with me Keith - J. Mandeville

[Nightingale 0]

All I'm saying is that because it was separate from the house, he may have seen it as his space rather than "their" space, and was just being stupid, not malicious. For kids, the punishment should take their intent into account. If they were doing it to be mean, they probably deserve a lot more punishment than a kid that just wasn't really thinking.