g2gjump 0 #1 October 27, 2006 I was reading another post and the S.O.S reserve system was brought up. My question is what is it and how does it work? Is it similar to an RSL? Pics Would be Great Thanks, Kurtis Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #2 October 27, 2006 Single operation system, ie, pulling one handle will cutaway your main canopy and also pull the pin on the reserve, look just like a regular reserve ripcord, but will do both jobs as long as you pull it all the way. No it's not the same as a RSL.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
g2gjump 0 #3 October 27, 2006 Thank you very much. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #4 October 27, 2006 Your welcome.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #5 October 27, 2006 S.O.S. rigs have no cutaway handle on the right side of the harness, instead, all three cables (ripcord and both cutaway) are attached to a single handle on the left side of the harness. Most S.O.S. rigs use a silver reserve ripcord handle, but a few use specialized cloth loops. S.O.S. used to be popular with schools that trained large numbers of static-line students. Emergency procedures are easier to teach with S.O.S. "If you don't like your main parachute, just look at the silver handle. Pull it and throw it away." Mind you, I have seen a student mess up a procedure ... even that simple! The disadvantage with S.O.S. is that sometime in the future, students have to be re-trained on two-handle systems and it takes hundreds of repetitions to break early habits. The other disadvantage with S.O.S. is that there are some complex dimensions relating the length of cutaway cables to riser channels and ripcord lengths, etc. S.O.S. retrofits are best left to factories. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrianM 1 #6 October 27, 2006 QuoteS.O.S. used to be popular with schools that trained large numbers of static-line students. Emergency procedures are easier to teach with S.O.S. QuoteThe disadvantage with S.O.S. is that sometime in the future, students have to be re-trained on two-handle systems and it takes hundreds of repetitions to break early habits. Our DZ (just across the pond from you actually) has student rigs with a red cutaway pillow on the right, and a silver SOS handle on the left. Students are trained as if it were a normal TAS. This means no retraining, but is much more forgiving of incorrect EPs. With the RSL, pulling only one handle - either one - will cutaway and deploy the reserve (except for a total or PCIT), and pulling handles out of order doesn't matter."It's amazing what you can learn while you're not talking." - Skydivesg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
g2gjump 0 #7 October 27, 2006 Thaks alot i can see very well the advantages as well the disadvantages. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Froggy 0 #8 October 28, 2006 QuoteWith the RSL, pulling only one handle - either one - will cutaway and deploy the reserve (except for a total or PCIT), and pulling handles out of order doesn't matter. Emphasis is mine Uhh... Unless I'm grossly confused about the subject, I don't see how that works... Can you tell me just how pulling silver will cut away your main on an RSL-equipped rig?!? The other way around is perfectly clear, of course.-------------- We were not born to fly. And all we can do is to try not to fall... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Joellercoaster 6 #9 October 28, 2006 Because the silver handle is an SOS - as long as it is done correctly (ie., pulled all the way out) it wil first cutaway, then deploy the reserve (does this also interact wih the RSL, giving, like, triple-protection?). This sounds like a neat idea, but sounds very complicated gear too. Two handles, each of which do the same thing different way. Are many places doing that? [edit: speling]-- "I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan "You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #10 October 28, 2006 QuoteBecause the silver handle is an SOS - as long as it is done correctly (ie., pulled all the way out) it will first cutaway, then deploy the reserve (does this also interact with the RSL, giving, like, triple-protection?). This sounds like a neat idea, but sounds very complicated gear too. Two handles, each of which do the same thing different way. Are many places doing that? [edit: speling] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dual action systems are very complicated. When (mid 1990s) Parachutes Australia sent their first prototype (a Talon to dual action) to Rigging Innovations for approval, my first response was "too many moving parts."P.A.'s prototype had three cables attached to each handle (IOW 2 cutaway and 1 ripcord cable per handle). Sure factories can install a quality control system to handle anything, but field riggers might have 5% of the background knowledge and jump-masters might have 1% of the background knowledge. Since your average jump-master is too lazy to read a manual, he is more likely to depend upon rumors or superstition for guidance when assembling a dual-action system. Relying on rumors or superstition is a recipe for disaster! Last year I had to assemble and pack 20 Javelins with dual-action handles and was mentally exhausted by the end of the project. Ten years after seeing the prototype, I still believe that dual-action systems have too many moving parts. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Froggy 0 #11 October 28, 2006 QuoteBecause the silver handle is an SOS - as long as it is done correctly (ie., pulled all the way out) it wil first cutaway, then deploy the reserve (does this also interact wih the RSL, giving, like, triple-protection?). QuoteDual action systems are very complicated. Ahhh... My bad -- I didn't read the original post correctly... I was thinking about the standard dual-action system with an RSL, and didn't realize in the second paragraph BrianM also meant the SOS system and an RSL. OK, I get it now...-------------- We were not born to fly. And all we can do is to try not to fall... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrianM 1 #12 October 28, 2006 QuoteDual action systems are very complicated. QuoteP.A.'s prototype had three cables attached to each handle (IOW 2 cutaway and 1 ripcord cable per handle). That's not the setup we are using. We have a SOS handle on the left, and a plain old cutaway handle on the right. There are 3 cables to the left handle (ripcord and 2 cutaway), and 2 cables (cutaway only, no ripcord) to the right handle. The only extra compllication this entails is to have two cutaway cables to each riser, with two grommets through the riser, and a loop that is not sewn to the riser but that goes through both grommets and has a cutaway cable through each end. Seems simple enough to me. Having a ripcord going to the right handle also does seem like it would be more complicated depending on how it was set up, but I think it could be done fairly simply. In any case the RSL provides the same functionality in most cases, and the AAD should cover most of the other cases."It's amazing what you can learn while you're not talking." - Skydivesg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NickDG 23 #13 October 28, 2006 >>(does this also interact with the RSL, giving, like, triple-protection?). << You still want a RSL attached in case the student pulls far enough to cutaway, but not far enough to pull the reserve pin . . . The only advantage to a SOS system is it's easier to teach to first jump students and it eliminates out of sequence handle pulls. But, in essence a two handled system, with a RSL, "is" essentially a SOS system. A student who follows through with a reserve pull are usually already sitting under a reserve canopy. NickD BASE 194 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
recovercrachead 0 #14 October 28, 2006 SAVE OUR SOULSTrack high, Pull LOW!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BrianM 1 #15 October 28, 2006 QuoteSAVE OUR SOULS Contrary to common belief, the distress signal SOS does not stand for "save our souls". It doesn't stand for anything. In fact the signal is not actually SOS, it is a prosign (procedural signal) that is sent as one long morse code character (which just happens, by pure coincidence, to be the same as the letters SOS run together). SOS is sent as dididit dadadah dididit, while the distress signal is sent as didididadadadididit. SOS was chosen because the morse code sound was easy to remember and easy to recognize - much easier than the prosign CQD which it replaced (dadidadidadadidadadidit). CQD also carried the risk of being mistaken for CQ, which is a prosign for "calling any station". Apologies for the off-topic rambling, one of my hobbies is amateur radio (a.k.a. ham radio), and I am a proficient morse code operator. Yeah, I know, I'm a geek..."It's amazing what you can learn while you're not talking." - Skydivesg Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
