Size difference

[btvr 0]

Does anyone think that the size difference between a spectre 210 and 190 is a cause for concern? I currently jump a tri 210 and have over 90 jumps on it and fly it well. I'm considering a spectre. While I would like to get a 210, it seems that 190s are well in stock at PDs stock list(especially the colors I prefer). I currently load the tri at 1.0-1. What are some thoughts?
Thanks

[maurice1369 0]

Well to be honest I can't tell you if going from a 210 to 190 is the best choice for you but what I can tell you is that some factors that will decide it should be can you land the 210 safely, do you feel comfortable downsizing to a 190 and the instructors at your dropzone know how you fly your canopy so you should ask their opinions about downsizing. but the most important thing to remember is do you feel comfortable with the downsize If the answer is NO then you are not ready.

EXPECT THE WORST, HOPE FOR THE BEST!!!

[illusioneer 0]

Have you maxed out the performance of what you have been jumping? Why a new main?

[btvr 0]

Good Question! 2 reasons.. reason number one is that I never really cared for the colors of mine. It was a stock color pattern and my first canopy, reason number two... I tried a few jumps on a spectre 210 and loved the way it opened, flew, and flared!! I was hooked! now all I need to do is get one in the colors I really want.

[illusioneer 0]

Then I would tend to stay with the largest canopy that I liked...no matter what the color...you like the 210...get the 210.

Oh yeah, and all the girls tell me it not the color that matters it's how you fly with it

[DSE 5]

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Good Question! 2 reasons.. reason number one is that I never really cared for the colors of mine. It was a stock color pattern and my first canopy, reason number two... I tried a few jumps on a spectre 210 and loved the way it opened, flew, and flared!! I was hooked! now all I need to do is get one in the colors I really want.

"the colors I really want" are no reason to downsize.
At all.
Your profile doesn't list your wingloading.
At 135 jumps, you probably should seek some guidance from more experienced jumpers than paying too much attention to jumpers with less experience than you have.
Read this article for some additional information.
According to the chart for a Spectre, PD recommends that at your skill level you should exit weight not more than 171
Do you stand a 210 every time? Regardless of wind/no wind?
Can you maneuver with rear risers?
Can you land accurately on virtually every jump?
What about front riser inputs? Can you manage them?
Flat turns?
Land Xwind
Can you handle the 210 in all wind conditions?
Has anyone on your DZ commented about your landings, good or bad?

I like the Spectre, for the few jumps I demo'd one. I chose a Silhouette instead.
It's very much worth waiting for the canopy you'll be sticking with for a while, IMO. Colors be damned. I jumped nearly 100 jumps on a pink canopy, because it was the size that was appropriate for my wingloading/skill. Sucked, but that's how it was. Then bought my first 210, jumped it for 200 jumps, then downsized to a 190. While I can/am ready to go to a smaller canopy, I'm sticking with what I've got for at least the rest of the year, if not longer.
Jump the size/wingloading best for your skills, and worry about colors later. Talk to those that know you.

[btvr 0]

you make some good valid points, but the answers to your questions are yes, I have flown my 210 in all winds and have landed out a few times and I have confidence in my canopy skills, Stand up landings for the last 40 jumps and the last time I didn't stand it up was due to a down wind landing to avoid traffic and I did a PLF. When I was a student, my instructor downsized me from a 288 to a 220 after 14 jumps. Yes there was a considerable difference. But I wasn't intimidated by it. True, in hindsight it was aggressive but I followed my instructors advice. I'm just asking if 20 SF is that much of a difference. It's not like I'm making an aggressive downsize move. Thanks for your feed back!

[AggieDave 6]

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and the last time I didn't stand it up was due to a down wind landing to avoid traffic and I did a PLF

Why didn't you recognize a traffic issue before entering the pattern, or atleast before you were trying to turn on final? Or why not a flat turn to keep from landing opposite traffic?

Basically if you found yourself surprised by canopy traffic and it ended up with you having to land against traffic, you really want to think again about downsizing.

These are conversations you should be having with your S&TA and/or your old instructors. They're the guys and gals that watch you every weekend and see whats going on. They also have your intrest at heart if for no other reason they don't want to deal with an injury on the DZ.

If they're telling you no, then listen to them. If they're relatively indifferent, that's the same as no, but when answered for the 100th time. If they're telling you to go for it, then quit messing around with people on the internet that you don't know and go on with life.

As a side note, stand up landings or even landings without injury does not mean they were good landings or that someone is competent with their canopy. At the least it means they were lucky again, but the divot is still waiting for some. Not about the OP directly, since I don't know him, just a comment in general.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[DSE 5]

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you make some good valid points, but the answers to your questions are yes, I have flown my 210 in all winds and have landed out a few times and I have confidence in my canopy skills, Stand up landings for the last 40 jumps and the last time I didn't stand it up was due to a down wind landing to avoid traffic and I did a PLF. When I was a student, my instructor downsized me from a 288 to a 220 after 14 jumps. Yes there was a considerable difference. But I wasn't intimidated by it. True, in hindsight it was aggressive but I followed my instructors advice. I'm just asking if 20 SF is that much of a difference. It's not like I'm making an aggressive downsize move. Thanks for your feed back!

Don't for one second think that being downsized from a 288 to a 220 means squat. You were on a student canopy, and downsized to what is likely more suited for your weight. I learned on a 280 myself. And was moved to a 230 at jump 10. Doesn't mean much.
As suggested twice earlier, talk to those that can *see* you land. No one here can. And without wingloading information/weight from you, no one can provide much more than you've read in this thread.
However, if you're of the opinion that you can handle a 190 simply because you've got 100 jumps on a 210, you've downsized from a 288 to a 220, and the 190 comes in the colors you want...my immediate reaction is that you should likely stay with the 210 for a while.
20 square feet is a fairly large difference at your skill level. Also going to a ZP from F111 canopy is quite different. Finally, going from a full square to a slightly tapered canopy is also different.
Overall, the Spectre is a very forgiving canopy, but even forgiving canopies allow the pilot to get hurt, if they're not ready to manage the speed increase brought on by a smaller canopy.
Talk to those around you, and fill in your profile.

[BIGUN 1,406]

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When I was a student, my instructor downsized me from a 288 to a 220 after 14 jumps. Yes there was a considerable difference. But I wasn't intimidated by it. True, in hindsight it was aggressive but I followed my instructors advice. I'm just asking if 20 SF is that much of a difference.

Yes, 20 sq.ft. is that much of a difference. Believe it or not; the difference between going from the 288 to the 220 was not as significant as going from a 210 to a 190 will be. After awhile, 10 sq.ft. will be an exponential difference. There's been more than one experienced skydiver who've gone down 10 sq.ft. only to wind up injured or scared enough to sell their new canopy and upsize.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[Booster_MPS 0]

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When I was a student, my instructor downsized me from a 288 to a 220 after 14 jumps. Yes there was a considerable difference. But I wasn't intimidated by it. True, in hindsight it was aggressive but I followed my instructors advice. I'm just asking if 20 SF is that much of a difference.

Yes, 20 sq.ft. is that much of a difference. Believe it or not; the difference between going from the 288 to the 220 was not as significant as going from a 210 to a 190 will be. After awhile, 10 sq.ft. will be an exponential difference. There's been more than one experienced skydiver who've gone down 10 sq.ft. only to wind up injured or scared enough to sell their new canopy and upsize.

Good point.

Another consideration in selecting a smaller canopy is that the control lines will be shorter for the smaller canopy. The shorter control lines will provide VERY different (more responsive) inputs than the longer lines of a larger canopy. Size is not the only thing to consider.

[RafaelYP 0]

Y bought a spectre 210 with 100 jumps with w/l 1.17 by stock of PD. No problem with my landings but less time for fly the canopy.
But another options is choose your own design in a 210 feet and wait for it.

[btvr 0]

Thanks to all who replied. I will stay with the 210. If I could find the colors I like in a 230 that would be an option. I'm in no hurry to hurt myself! Once again.. thanks to all.

[kelpdiver 2]

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20 square feet is a fairly large difference at your skill level. Also going to a ZP from F111 canopy is quite different. Finally, going from a full square to a slightly tapered canopy is also different.

Triathlon is not F111. The newer ones are the same ZP, the older ones the stickier ZP.

But the spectre was definitely easier to put into a bad situation - grab too much toggle at the wrong time and I got it in a half twist dive. The triathlon can be spun up a couple times and it still seems to fly straight.

[DSE 5]

Thanks for the catch. I've only flown a Triathalon a couple times when I needed a second rig for a back to back. It was old enough, I just assumed it was F111. Sure felt like it.
So, to amend my previous comment, going from an old ZP to a new ZP does have some difference, but going from F111 to a ZP canopy has quite a diff.