rob223 0 #1 March 22, 2009 ok. I have recently got my license and am loving this sport truly... But the one 'weak' part of my game is a feeling of mild instability at pull time. To clarify, I am totally stable in the air with regards to frontloops,backloops, tracking, turns etc and have a good arch. but I always feel a bit of a rock forwards when I go to pull and altho I have been practising it on recent solos, I dont seem to be 'getting it' as much as I would like. Im in a stable belly to earth position for deployment (or I wouldnt have passed aff!) but I seem to rush the waveoff, and although I extend my left arm out in front when initiating the pull, I feel myself dip forwards a bit and tend to rush the pull so I can return to my comfortable stable arch with two arms out!! Instructors worked with me to iron out this problem and on checkout jumps since Ive been spot on, but on solos Im not sure if I am looking at the ground and thats causing it? (instructor would mean I am making eye contact with them and therefore head up) This is my theory about what Im doing, and I am hoping that someone can give me some info on what to try and practice to iron this out,. I was thinking of the wind tunnel but havent been yet as its a long way aways from me. - Looking down at the ground when going to deploy - Bringing legs in a bit (I can feel when I have done this and dont need video to know!) - Not relaxing like on the rest of the dive. - Dont know what else?!! Has anyone got any tips on things to practice? I have done several solos just working on doing relaxed practices all the way down, and some of them are perfect and feel really natural, but sometimes, when it comes to pull time for real It feels like I am going to 'fall' forwards when I go to one arm out and one arm behind... do I need to use more pressure onto the relative wind? two instructors told me different things... one said straight arm all the way out and look over my hand (seems to work when I get it right) the other said bent arm and press down the relative wind.. Any tips> How to practice being stable with both arms behind my back? Do I use my legs to stabilise myself? (bring them in a bit>?) Sorry for the small essay... but this is really bugging me and I want to feel as comfortable with one arm out (and one behind ) as I do in the standard boxman! Thanks for your time Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rwieder 0 #2 March 22, 2009 Do you "Lock On" to your altimeter waiting for deployment altitude? If so, this would be one of the things that can cause you to dip head first before deployment. Do you have an audible? If not, get one. It's just a backup tool, so don't trust your life with it. I wear two of them, and an altimeter, well sometimes. The sympton you describe is nothing unusual, so don't let it make you too nervy. When you are get to your deployment altitude get that left arm out in front of your face (Don't look at the ground) to counteract your body position and "PULL" Nevermind what i've advised, it's nothing more than advice. Be sure to have your instructors at your DZ do a check dive with you, or one of your mentors, should you not be comfortable fixing it yourself. Take Care, Be Safe.-Richard- "You're Holding The Rope And I'm Taking The Fall" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rob223 0 #3 March 22, 2009 Quote Do you "Lock On" to your altimeter waiting for deployment altitude? If so, this would be one of the things that can cause you to dip head first before deployment. Do you have an audible? If not, get one. It's just a backup tool, so don't trust your life with it. I wear two of them, and an altimeter, well sometimes. The sympton you describe is nothing unusual, so don't let it make you too nervy. When you are get to your deployment altitude get that left arm out in front of your face (Don't look at the ground) to counteract your body position and "PULL" Nevermind what i've advised, it's nothing more than advice. Be sure to have your instructors at your DZ do a check dive with you, or one of your mentors, should you not be comfortable fixing it yourself. Take Care, Be Safe. Richard Thanks for your advice. I fully realise it is nothing more than that..and I am only seeking 'thoughts' from people on the matter!! and dont worry, I wont be doing anything I dont think is safe or feel comfortable with. On reflection, I do indeed 'clockwatch' my alti for the last couple of thousand feet down to my pull height. IF I am on a solo, with others around I seem to be less focused on it (still altitude aware, just not clockwatching) as I am getting ready to track off . It makes concrete sense as well because when practising I am not studying the alti as well.... I think this may be giving me an slight twist somewhere instead of remanining symmetrical. Im going to work on it over the next few jumps but its great to have some input on what could be causing it because I had run out of ideas and it is starting to really annoy me! Any other tips appreciated from people Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pontiacgtp00 0 #4 March 22, 2009 I used to have some small problems with stability when I was still on student status. So I started doing practice touches up high. Reach back and hold the pc handle for a few seconds. After a few jumps I was able to hold a stable heading when in the pull position. Might work for you too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chubba 0 #5 March 23, 2009 QuoteAfter a few jumps I was able to hold a stable heading when in the pull position. Might work for you too. +1 When you got some free time on a solo, fly the position for bit, it will click before too long. It should be a stable position that you don't have to rush, you can even turn/make heading corrections in this position. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
firstime 0 #6 March 23, 2009 try to work on it because you get good at bad habits. PLEASE read "lucky & stupid" in the incidents forum. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #7 March 23, 2009 Sounds like you're stable enough, just a little nervous.If you're face to Earth and pitch hard to the side, don't worry so much, It's probably going to open just fine. Trust me, I've seen worse. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #8 March 23, 2009 Quote Bringing legs in a bit (I can feel when I have done this and dont need video to know!) That's not your problem, that's your solution. If you're tipping forward when you reach for the pull it's because you have too much stuff sticking out on the lower half of your body, and not enough sticking out of the upper half. Moving your arm back takes away some of the drag from your upper half. You'll need to relax your legs a little to balance yourself out. You might not have to actually move your legs, just relax the pressure against the relative wind. The best advice is for you to practice falling the pull position. Not practice touches, but extended freefall in the pull position. Don't actually touch your hackey, or even get too close. Maybe just put your hand on the corner of your rig. Either way, get into the position, and see what happens. Intentionally add and remove pressure from your legs, and see what happens. Move your left arm around and see what that does. Once you're feeling stable, try some turns, and see how those go. The idea is to learn to fly in the pull position so you can control yourself during the pull sequence. This will help you greatly in both your confidence, and your ability to open from a stable position, which goes a long way toward getting a good opening. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #9 March 23, 2009 That's very good advice. The pull position is a stable position if flown correctly. You should be able to make an entire 60 second delay, level and on heading, in that position. I've made 10 second delays like that due to a floating handle behind me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tuna-Salad 0 #10 March 23, 2009 what others have said, fly in the deployment position. Just don't over think it. With practice you will be able to fly in almost any position. What I did when I got on my own after AFF, was line myself up with a street or a point of reference and pitch. Doing this (In my opinion) keeps your head up and will prevent you from going head low. Some people try and look for the handle.. that is a big no-no. You should know where stuff is on your rig with your eyes closed and by touch.Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rob223 0 #11 March 24, 2009 John, davelepka et all. Thanks for the tips That is some very useful advive there and I will indeed do some jumps testing and analysing the pull position. I hadnt really thought about easing off the pressure on my legs a little in the airflow and I can see how that would work... I will update this thread once Ive been to the DZ next Hopefully I will be solid as a rock and doing 360s with an arm behind my back using legs only... Thanks again. Appreciate the input Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
icevideot 0 #12 March 24, 2009 I read this kind of quickly but it seems you have gotten the right answers. One thing I didn't see is that the left hand should be palm toward the relative wind(toward earth) and not sideways or palm on the helmet or behind the head, etc. You are transtitioning from a mostly square body position to a triangle. The left hand tries to replace some of the drag lost by removing the right arm and a little less leg does the rest. Symmatry is stability."... this ain't a Nerf world." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
