The video in the General Skydiving Forum

[ccowden 0]

Well, I went from thinking dropzone.com was awesome because of all the great people I have met through it and coming off an absolutely wonderful weekend of meeting even more, to never wanting to post on here again.

We posted this video: http://www.sidsrigging.com/galleries/video_clips/waiting.wmv going on a year ago and it was just reposted a couple days ago. The first time we posted it, we did so in the Bonfire and I guess people saw it for what it was and thought it was funny. This time it got posted by someone in General Skydiving and now everything from my character and integrity as an instructor have come into question. Ah, the wonders of the internet!

Anyway, I am done defending myself in General over this and figured I at least had the right to explain myself here, since others seem to have the right to bash me for my actions to the point of questioning how safe I am and whether or not the USPA should have ever given me a instructor's rating. It pisses me off because the ONLY people who know the facts are the people who were there, yet others are allowed to speculate and come up with a million "what if" scenerios to make me look bad and read WAY more into it than there was.

These are the facts, and they are undisputed:

Cessna 207, 6 jumpers and a pilot on board.

4way RW going first before my 2way freefly.

GPS spot by the pilot.

Pilot told us to go, and to make it quick.

RW group began climb out and then sat in the door. From the "green light" to the time of the push was approx. 15 seconds.

Pilot was again emphatically telling us to go.

The RW group had forgotten to organize who was giving the count, so once in the door they were all just looking at each other and nodding with no one giving a count.

They were all experienced jumpers with no one being a student or someone that I could really endanger by "forcing" them to go before they were ready. They were all ready to exit.

I could clearly see that they were all in fact ready to go, they were all clear for exit, no one was saying they were not ready, no chest straps were undone, no 747s were flying below us, nobody was saying to wait, they were all looking at each other in agreement they were ready, and no one was giving a count.

The pilot was making it very clear we needed to go now.

This was NOT a case of them spotting or waiting because something was not right. They were in the door and ready to go. I was only a couple feet from them and could CLEARLY see what the situation was.

I made an assesment of the entire situation and gave the one guy a push. Not a shove to cause bodily injury, rip someones arm off, or in a manner that would put anyone's equipment in danger. It was more of a "Come on guys, get moving" push.

The guy I pushed then started to go on his own and the others saw him and went as well.

When I started to climb out, the pilot again said, "Get going!" and I ducked my head back in just a second to hear what he was saying. The mad look on my face was just coincidental and I was not mad at all at the RW group. I did not push them out of anger or in a way that was abrupt or that putthem in danger. The mad look just added to the humor, or what WE considered humor, of the video.

Everything was fine with both groups and we all had a good laugh about it. Everyone was in complete agreement that there was nothing dangerous about it and even found the push amusing. One jumper in the group even thanked me because he was having trouble hanging on and thought they might sit there forever if I hadn't pushed them.

So, you can watch the video and read the posts in General and form your own opinion, but there are the facts. I personally think that the video got blown WAY out of proportion this time around and it pisses me off that my character and integrity have even come under attack due to it. I have admitted that there could have been something I didn't see and maybe I should have thought of something different rather than a push, but I was right there and had assesed the situation for safety and did what I considered to be reasonable, and once on the ground, everything I had assesed was complete fact and everyone was in agreement about it and no one who was involved was upset or questioned my actions or character. It was not until the video was posted this time that people began to speculate and throw everything but the kitchen sink into to make me look bad and attack me for it on this website.

So I have said my piece. Agree or disagree, that is up to you. But I am not going to defend myself anymore about it. I am completely discouraged about this site right now.

Hugs to all my friends. I hope anyone who really knows me will be able to see it for what it was and realize that I would never do something that might put people at risk intentionally. If people want to slam me because they think I am being dramatic or whatever, that's fine. But I take it very seriously when people start to question me as a person and instructor in a public forum.

That's it. The End.

[JohnMitchell 16]

There's been a few groups I wanted to shove, too.

[davelepka 4]

Fuck those guys. I would have pushed them too.

[bmcd308 0]

Don't sweat it. People will bash you over the Internet who would be afraid to look you in the eye in real life.

----------------------------------
www.jumpelvis.com

[skymama 37]

The people who are questioning your actions have obviously never met you in person. You have more integrity and common sense than most people ever hope to have.

On one of our jumps over the weekend, you even pointed out to our group that the spot was getting long on the Casa and to be aware that we might have to pull a little higher. You saved Ian from potentially getting chopped up by a plane propeller. I heard multiple times at the boogie that you were the one person that many wanted to meet and I was constantly pointing you out to people.

You are NOT an unsafe skydiver. As with a lot of things around here, I think people are overreacting in this situation. Don't go away though, you're one of the people that make this site great.
Your(high comma)s truly.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[daniel_owen_uk 0]

Personally I don't think this video has done anything bad for your reputation, I thought you were and asshole before it
But joking aside, it is getting kinda out of proportion like you said you were there, you knew the situation and a lot of people of commented on it, without knowing the full situation.

__________________

BOOM Headshot

[Brains 2]

You know what, i saw that and suddenly i was reminded of a jump we did up in Penn. I am convinced now that you pushed me and that is why i flailed like a newbie on our jump.

Chris, many people who were not there can watch that video and be appalled. Having met you, i thought it was funny as hell and felt quite sure you knew the people in front of you. Would people on this site watch skreamers famous spot/exit video and say how terrible it was that someone "pushed" him?

FWIW, i would jump with you and hire you for coaching any day of the week.

Never look down on someone, unless they are going down on you.

[airtwardo 7]

Like with anything else...ya shouldn't made a value judgement on another person's actions if you don't know the whole story.

I don't know you...but from what I know about you, I for one didn't think you would be someone to 'endanger' another jumper...so I thought the video WAS kinda funny!

And in fact you reached around the inside most guy, because pushing 'him' may have cause an unstable exit...at least that's how "I" saw it.

Anyway..with the whole story as told here...it makes even more sense.

I'm sure many of us have done MUCH worse things to get bashed about!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[wingnut 0]

i still love ya man..... well sort of.. not like in prison though....

______________________________________
"i have no reader's digest version"

[peek 21]

Quote

We posted this video...

Chris,

If you tell us you had good reason to do that, I believe you, and if you tell us it did not cause any danger to the jumpers pushed, I believe you.

What I think people are bothered by is that it sends the message that it is "cool" to do that kind of thing, (which it usually is not.)

Having music in the background of the video, and a title at the end saying "Don't mess with Chris" or whatever it said makes it something a bit more than just a video of someone getting "encouraged" to go when they are taking too long.

Unfortunately we can't joke about some things because when seen or heard out of context, they may actually become unsafe if practice by others less knowledgable.

Hope this helps.

[simplyputsi 0]

I've seen people pushed out in a much worse fashion than that. I wouldn't even call what you did a push rather a hey you are still in the door guys you're supposed to let go.
I don't think I got to meet you at Dublin. I wanted to kick you in the nutz!! Just kidding.
That video made me laugh a little.

Skymama's #2 stalker -

[livendive 8]

There's a reason I keep my participation in the General and Safety & Training forums of this site to a minimum. They're usually not worth the headache to me. A couple people have the appropriate answers for the truly novice jumpers, and it seems that most of the rest of the jumpers are either looking for someone to give them a specific answer they're fishing for, or they're looking for someone to criticize.

If they're wrong, they're wrong. Dismiss 'em and move on.

Edit to add: Oh yeah, I have also "assisted" an exit or two. The best one was a friend making his 1000th jump. We'd intended to do a formation load but the pilots couldn't get their shit together so it was just our 206 jumping (our TwinBo landed full of jumpers). That mis-communication had us "spotting" for about a minute and a half, so I knew exactly where we were, that there were no traffic issues, and that while my friend was just kneeling in the door, he was also ready to skydive (albeit with no particular plan). The assistance myself and another jumper provided him afforded us the perfect look on the guy's face as he fell away realizing we'd just forced him into a solo on his 1000th...with a bad spot to boot.

A second later the rest of us piled out of the airplane, dove down and joined him, everybody smiled, and everybody made it back.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[Icon134 0]

I don't even know what was going on but it didn't even look as if you really pushed anyone... and I agree that they did seem to be stalled in the door.

To me the video seems to be light hearted ribbing between friends giving each other a hard time and nothing else should be read into it.

I'll have to go read the thread in GSD to see what people are saying but I'd try not to worry too much about it Chris... (even though I didn't get a chance to meet you last weekend you seem like a top notch guy...)

Scott

Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife...

[rehmwa 2]

Watched it. It was harmless. I'd even say it was great communication between friends at a small DZ.

Not a push, the person in green wanted to go. Looked more like a 'hey, you need to go' - equivalent to a shoulder tap.

I've seen rude and unwarranted pushing that deserves a strong response.

That wasn't it.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[sunshine 2]

I haven't seen the video or thread in General Skydiving, but who cares?! You don't have to defend your actions to a bunch of idiots on the internet. You know you're a good person and wouldn't endanger anyone so fuck anyone that says differently. I've pushed people out of the plane before just to be funny. It's all good Chris.

___________________________________________
meow

I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug!

[cocheese 0]

I don't care about any of that, but i do see a pattern of whinny posts and an over sensitivity of what others think about you. Much like what you see in the women's forum. But i'm trying to only say nice things in the bonfire. Maybe we should both try that.

[jtval 0]

to be honest with you I didnt even think you PUSHED him until i read your post. I thought you were making sure his rig didnt get stuck on exit.

i Don't really see a "Shove."

anyway, they were all out of the door etc and ready to jump....but SOMEBODY had to tell them when.

My photos

My Videos

[wildcard451 0]

Sweet. It's in the bonfire now. So I can finally call everyone that is bellyaching in that thread a bunch of pussies.



It was funny. The "push" wasn't hard enough to look like it even disrupted the exit. Now if someone forcably launched me from the door without me knowing it was coming, they'd at least get some light discussion on the ground.

Everyone in the plane there thought it was funny. Quit being a bunch of little bitches and enjoy the video, laugh at it, and move on.

[McDuck 0]

Quote

The people who are questioning your actions have obviously never met you in person. You have more integrity and common sense than most people ever hope to have.

On one of our jumps over the weekend, you even pointed out to our group that the spot was getting long on the Casa and to be aware that we might have to pull a little higher. You saved Ian from potentially getting chopped up by a plane propeller. I heard multiple times at the boogie that you were the one person that many wanted to meet and I was constantly pointing you out to people.

You are NOT an unsafe skydiver. As with a lot of things around here, I think people are overreacting in this situation. Don't go away though, you're one of the people that make this site great.
Your(high comma)s truly.

Andrea said everything (almost) that I was going to say. Every jump I was on with you at the boogie, or was on the same plane with you, you were the essence of safety and sanity. Your jump with Cora made her feel more safe and secure than she has EVER felt in a freefly jump, and neither one of us ever worried for a moment that she might have been in the hands of a lackadaisical prankster.

Is a nudge really pushing someone? You know, I have to apologize to you Chris, because I apparently pushed you, with seeming evil intent, many times over the span of the boogie...you know, an evil push to point out Jaime Johnson, an evil push to point out Gia slowing our roll and many more diabolical attempts at hurting you when items of interest caught my eye. I lay myself at the mercy of the High Internet Court.

At the risk of sounding vehement and antagonistic, which seems par for the course with the neo-cro-magnon portion of the crowd here, eff people who make snap judgements about you based on their misperceptions of a video of yours. They simply don't know, and their thoughts, feelings and emotions aren't yours.

Ooh! But now I know what to get you for Christmas!

Edited to add: "So THEN he says..."

Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28
"I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC
Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

[Squeak 17]

See now this whole thing is even funnier than the video

Don't sweat it Chris, WTH does it matter what others think

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[skymama 37]

Quote

I don't care about any of that, but i do see a pattern of whinny posts and an over sensitivity of what others think about you.

That's just rude. When a person feels that their integrity is being attacked, it's only natural to want to set the matter straight. I'd do the same thing.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[cocheese 0]

Sometimes tough love is better than a group hug. My post is just the male version of what Sunshine said.
But on the other hand, I'm laughing at the irony that i'm defending my post to you.

[McDuck 0]

What's even funnier is having witnessed cheese running for the back fence a few times.

Kevin - Sonic Beef #5 - OrFun #28
"I never take myself too seriously, 'cuz everybody know fat birds don't fly." - FLC
Online communities: proof that people never mature much past high school.

[mnealtx 0]

Hell, Chris...don't sweat the little shit.

Next time, just yell "Hee-yah!!" and smack em on the ass - works with horses every time!

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[weegegirl 2]

well, you inspired me to go read the other thread and i appreciate the laugh. ladies and gents, what we have here is yet ANOTHER case of dropzone.drama. for the love of god people, GET OVER IT! chris is a safety nazi, a fantastic skydiver, and a very gererous instructor who offers help and free coaching all the time. give the guy a freakin break.

i have also learned not to post anything that excites you or entertains you about skydiving. for example, stories about mister bills, crw pictures, or small pushes out the door. they will certainly be over-analyzed by many people who have no athority to comment.

chris, my advice to you....... don't let it rent space in your head.