GTAVercetti 0 #26 January 26, 2006 QuoteQuote I think most women want a Nice Guy with a Backbone. In my opinion, this is what it comes down to indeed ! PS: Nice guys with a backbone are welcome to pm me The superficial nature of us requires a picture first. Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #27 January 26, 2006 Well for one thing, you have to ask why women date men who treat them like crap- I think there is a lot of issues involved. For instance, IMHO ( I am not an expert on women in abusive relationships) women will often retreat back to abusive relationships, because they don't know any better, and often feel they don't deserve someone who will treat them better. Also, I think a lot of women would rather have a hot-looking guy with money, so they look better, rather than someone they can connect with. Shallow, but unfortunately I think it's true. ( But not always) Either way, I think "nice" guys should be patient enough to wait for the right kind of woman to come along...I would think a real nice guy wouldn't want to have anything to do with superficial, shallow women. My beau is one of the most generous, kind men I've ever met...I love him being that way. I love the fact that he always says I love you, cooks for me, etc. I would not settle for a guy who treated me like dirt, and I wouldn't want anyone to settle for me if I treated them like dirt. But since I don't.... Edited to add: I think nice guys DO have a backbone. Why do many people equate nice guys, with men who are overly sensitive, too sweet, or not masculine? ( this just seems to further make the line "nice guys finish last" more stereotypical. IMHO nice guys are the most masculine men there are) Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sweetness 0 #28 January 26, 2006 Does this superficial nature come with the nice-guys-with-backbone or just with all the guys ? "Ha ! I laugh at danger and drop ice cubes down the vest of fear ..." (Blackadder) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #29 January 26, 2006 QuoteDoes this superficial nature come with the nice-guys-with-backbone or just with all the guys ? I think it may come with EVERYONE. I am a firm believer that to some extent, everyone is superficial...particularly at first. When you see someone walking down the street, do you think, 'hey, nice mind" or "hey, nice ass?" Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #30 January 26, 2006 That's not being superficial Just because someone notices how good somebody else looks, does not mean they are superficial. Now, if they don't care anything else about the person except for their good looks/other external characteristics, then I would call superficial. Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #31 January 26, 2006 QuoteThat's not being superficial JUst because someone notices how good somebody else looks, does not mean they are superficial. Now, if they don't care anything else about the person except for their good looks/other external characteristics, then I would call superficial. superficial: 1. Of, affecting, or being on or near the surface: a superficial wound. 2. Concerned with or comprehending only what is apparent or obvious; shallow. 3. Apparent rather than actual or substantial: a superficial resemblance. 4. Trivial; insignificant: made only a few superficial changes in the manuscript. Sorry, it IS superficial. Physical beauty is not deep. It is shallow. And their is nothing wrong with it on its own. You are automatically applying a negative connotation to the word that does not necessarily have to exist. Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RhondaLea 4 #32 January 26, 2006 QuoteWell for one thing, you have to ask why women date men who treat them like crap- I think there is a lot of issues involved. This is true. QuoteFor instance, women will often retreat back to abusive relationships, because they don't know any better, and often feel they don't deserve someone who will treat them better. This is verifiably and unequivocally false. While there are many reasons that women stay in abusive relationships, the reasons you cite are myths. Quote Also, I think a lot of women would rather have a hot-looking guy with money, so they look better, rather than someone they can connect with. Shallow, but I think it's true. ( But not always) I'm glad you added, "but not always," although I'm sorry you wrote this paragraph at all. It isn't true, but if you say that it's your reason for choosing the guy you picked, I'll have to accept it's true for you. rlIf you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #33 January 26, 2006 QuoteQuoteWell for one thing, you have to ask why women date men who treat them like crap- I think there is a lot of issues involved. This is true. QuoteFor instance, women will often retreat back to abusive relationships, because they don't know any better, and often feel they don't deserve someone who will treat them better. This is verifiably and unequivocally false. While there are many reasons that women stay in abusive relationships, the reasons you cite are myths. Quote Also, I think a lot of women would rather have a hot-looking guy with money, so they look better, rather than someone they can connect with. Shallow, but I think it's true. ( But not always) I'm glad you added, "but not always," although I'm sorry you wrote this paragraph at all. It isn't true, but if you say that it's your reason for choosing the guy you picked, I'll have to accept it's true for you. rl Okay, so I am not a counselor yet, but I DO believe women stay in abusive relationships because they have a low self-esteem ( which to me would correlate with feeling they don't deserve better) ( I have seen this in female friends). As far as women wanting good looking guys rather than someone they can connect with, I think there are a lot of shallow people out there, I have met some of them. Again, there may be deeper issues involved, but not always. Some people just want a good looking person to boost their self esteem. Anyway, I chose the guy I am with for reasons far beyond that. I can share them if you wish Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RhondaLea 4 #34 January 26, 2006 Quote Okay, so I am not a counselor yet, but I DO believe women stay in abusive relationships because they have a low self-esteem ( which to me would correlate with feeling they don't deserve better) ( I have seen this in female friends). You're winding me up, hon. In about thirty seconds, I'm going to pull out the soapbox. In the meantime, I'm going to say "wrong again" and then I'm going to post some links. If that doesn't solve the problem, I'm going to start railing. Please do not perpetuate myths about the victims of abuse; they have a tough enough row to hoe as it is. Most women do not enter an abusive relationship with low self-esteem, but their self-esteem ends up in the toilet because of the abusive relationship. There are some extremely bright and talented women in abusive relationships--their abusers picked them for that very reason, and then, over time, took the steps necessary to control them. In such cases, the onset of abuse was slow and insidious. This is a very complex issue. The question is not: "why do victims stay?" but "why do abusers abuse"? http://www.healthyplace.com/Communities/Abuse/holli/facts_stats/battered_women.htm http://www.maav.org/WhyStay.html Why Do Women Stay in Abusive Relationships? The reasons women stay in abusive relationships are very complicated. There are a wide range of emotional feelings that allow the abuse to continue and prevent the woman from leaving. Here are a few reasons that women stay in an abusive relationship: Fear - Women fear the physical harm that might come if they attempt to leave. Love - Women may truly have deep feelings for the abusive partner. Promises - Promises that this abuse will never happen again. Abuse = Love - Confusion between being loved and being controlled by their partner. Guilt - Being made to think that the abuse is their fault, that they have the problem. Not Being Believed - A strong fear that nobody will believe them if they speak out against the abuse. Thinking They Can Change Them - The belief that over time the woman can change the abusive partner. Low Self-Esteem - After being in an abusive relationship there is a feeling that they can do no better than their current relationship. Being Alone - To end the relationship could mean a loss of mutual friends, relatives and others associated with the relationship. Financial - Money, children and no place to go also hold women in these relationships.If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites windcatcher 0 #35 January 26, 2006 OK, sorry. ( but I still have my own ideas about why things are, and part of it has to do with my beliefs. If someone posted a link on evolution, I would throw it out the window, because I believe what I believe and nobody can change that.) Not saying you're right or wrong, just that I may see things differently than you because of my beliefs. ( example, if you don't believe that something exists that I DO believe, I may contribute an idea based on that belief and you may think I'm crazy, but then again you have different beliefs). Thanks for the links, I'll read them later. ( Again, not disagreeing with what you wrote, I perhaps should do further research before spreading popular misconceptions.) Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites GTAVercetti 0 #36 January 26, 2006 QuoteOK, sorry. ( but I still have my own ideas about why things are, and part of it has to do with my beliefs. If someone posted a link on evolution, I would throw it out the window, because I believe what I believe and nobody can change that.) Honestly, that is the best way to live your life: truthiness instead of truth. truthiness: defined as the quality of stating concepts one wishes or believes to be true, rather than the facts.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites windcatcher 0 #37 January 26, 2006 QuoteQuoteOK, sorry. ( but I still have my own ideas about why things are, and part of it has to do with my beliefs. If someone posted a link on evolution, I would throw it out the window, because I believe what I believe and nobody can change that.) Honestly, that is the best way to live your life: truthiness instead of truth. truthiness: defined as the quality of stating concepts one wishes or believes to be true, rather than the facts. you mean like believing in GOd and the Bible as the inspired word of God??? I know God to be real, and if you think I'm crazy, that's perfectly fine by me Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites GTAVercetti 0 #38 January 26, 2006 No, not at all. Because I believe in God. But denying proof of something simply because you "believe" otherwise is silly. Ignoring research on evolution (or anything) SIMPLY because it is not in line with your notion of the way the world is self-inflicted ignorance at the highest level. We should all strive to learn as much as possible from every angle. Only then can we understand the reason the opposition to our beliefs believes what it does. And on that journey, we may even find hints of truth in what they have to say.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites windcatcher 0 #39 January 26, 2006 Quote But denying proof of something simply because you "believe" otherwise is silly. Ignoring research on evolution (or anything) SIMPLY because it is not in line with your notion of the way the world is self-inflicted ignorance at the highest level. It's not about denying proof. Why do you think evolution is a theory? How would I know to accept something as "true research", when it is contrary to God's word? Doesn't make sense to me, because I because the Bible is the Word of God. The thing is, you probably don't believe there are spirits/demons that may affect the way people experience life on earth...is there any scientific proof of this? Not likely. Does God's word say this? Yes. Therefore, just because I don't have proof, does not mean I am ignorant. It simply means I believe what the Bible says...and no amount of scientific "evidence" will make me disregard what the Word says. Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites GTAVercetti 0 #40 January 26, 2006 That was awesome.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Thanatos340 1 #41 January 26, 2006 Wrong Forum for theological debates. Now lets get back on topic here: BOOBIES!!!!!! OH Wait.. That wasn’t the topic.. Oh yea.. Nice Guys finishing last... I am more of an Arrogant Bastard but in that nice guy sort of way. I rarely finish last. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PLFXpert 0 #42 January 26, 2006 QuoteI am a firm believer that to some extent, everyone is superficial...particularly at first Perhaps, but maybe not. I can honestly say aestetics never played a role in whether or not I was interested in a guy. But, I suppose I could think of an example---a guy at my former job who literally smelled, had a severe case of crater-face, hair always standing up as if he was rubbed by a balloon just moments earlier, and always making snorting sounds. He must have had half a brain to be working in his position, which counts for something, but admittedly that would be a case of superficial no-chance-in-hell for me. But generally, I'd have to disagree that everyone has a degree of that. It ALWAYS took something else to get my attention. But talking about someone walking down the street--since that could be a girl, I would agree---as I'm always the first to call slut (not to her face of course) when I see the mini skirt and knee-high boot combo.Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites windcatcher 0 #43 January 26, 2006 QuoteWrong Forum for theological debates. Now lets get back on topic here: BOOBIES!!!!!! OH Wait.. That wasn’t the topic.. Oh yea.. Nice Guys finishing last... I am more of an Arrogant Bastard but in that nice guy sort of way. I rarely finish last. I know, whoops sorry! Maybe I just want to turn all bonfire debates into speaker's corner debates Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PLFXpert 0 #44 January 26, 2006 QuoteAs far as women wanting good looking guys rather than someone they can connect with, I think there are a lot of shallow people out there, I have met some of them. Again, there may be deeper issues involved, but not always. Some people just want a good looking person to boost their self esteem. I think your original "good-looking WITH MONEY" statement might be a bit more accurate--just a bit--due to the "with money" part. But otherwise, I'm 100% in agreement with RL. I do think, regardless of looks and on the otherhand, money DOES play a big role for whatever reason. Edited to add: The above based on college-experience. Girls/roomates not at all shy to admit they were only there to meet a soon-to-be-doctor or lawyer (my school had fantastic programs for both). I guess education was just a "bonus".Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PLFXpert 0 #45 January 26, 2006 QuoteWrong Forum for theological debates. Agreed. But, I can't help myself and feel compelled to add: I believe BOTH can co-exist. I believe in God and evolution. I will not explain how in this forum or any other. Perhaps we'll meet someday...Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites GTAVercetti 0 #46 January 26, 2006 QuoteQuoteWrong Forum for theological debates. Agreed. But, I can't help myself and feel compelled to add: I believe BOTH can co-exist. I believe in God and evolution. I will not explain how in this forum or any other. Perhaps we'll meet someday... We have discussed that very thing in the Christian thread in SC. And I agree in full.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PLFXpert 0 #47 January 26, 2006 <---didn't know that. I boldly entered SC for a day or two. Then never returned I prefer a public debate forum where actual rules of debate and proper refutes apply. Actually I was on the debate team and have never lost a debate. But, that's neither here nor there... But, interesting to know...Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Thanatos340 1 #48 January 26, 2006 OK.. Since Windcatcher and PLFXpert have violated the sanctity of this Forum by discussing Non-Boobie, Beer or General Sexual Innuendo Fluff in this forum.... Each should post Pictures of themselves in skimpy outfits (Outfit Optional) for the rest of us to enjoy as penance. VTA... Your pennace for encouraging this behavior is that you will not be allowed to Look at those pics once they are posted. I now return everyone to the general Fluffynesss of Bonfire. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ccowden 0 #49 January 26, 2006 Right on! Well put. It's all about having faith. faith [ fayth ] noun Definitions: 1. belief or trust: belief in, devotion to, or trust in somebody or something, especially without logical proof. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites windcatcher 0 #50 January 26, 2006 hahhaa, yeah right!!! Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... 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RhondaLea 4 #34 January 26, 2006 Quote Okay, so I am not a counselor yet, but I DO believe women stay in abusive relationships because they have a low self-esteem ( which to me would correlate with feeling they don't deserve better) ( I have seen this in female friends). You're winding me up, hon. In about thirty seconds, I'm going to pull out the soapbox. In the meantime, I'm going to say "wrong again" and then I'm going to post some links. If that doesn't solve the problem, I'm going to start railing. Please do not perpetuate myths about the victims of abuse; they have a tough enough row to hoe as it is. Most women do not enter an abusive relationship with low self-esteem, but their self-esteem ends up in the toilet because of the abusive relationship. There are some extremely bright and talented women in abusive relationships--their abusers picked them for that very reason, and then, over time, took the steps necessary to control them. In such cases, the onset of abuse was slow and insidious. This is a very complex issue. The question is not: "why do victims stay?" but "why do abusers abuse"? http://www.healthyplace.com/Communities/Abuse/holli/facts_stats/battered_women.htm http://www.maav.org/WhyStay.html Why Do Women Stay in Abusive Relationships? The reasons women stay in abusive relationships are very complicated. There are a wide range of emotional feelings that allow the abuse to continue and prevent the woman from leaving. Here are a few reasons that women stay in an abusive relationship: Fear - Women fear the physical harm that might come if they attempt to leave. Love - Women may truly have deep feelings for the abusive partner. Promises - Promises that this abuse will never happen again. Abuse = Love - Confusion between being loved and being controlled by their partner. Guilt - Being made to think that the abuse is their fault, that they have the problem. Not Being Believed - A strong fear that nobody will believe them if they speak out against the abuse. Thinking They Can Change Them - The belief that over time the woman can change the abusive partner. Low Self-Esteem - After being in an abusive relationship there is a feeling that they can do no better than their current relationship. Being Alone - To end the relationship could mean a loss of mutual friends, relatives and others associated with the relationship. Financial - Money, children and no place to go also hold women in these relationships.If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #35 January 26, 2006 OK, sorry. ( but I still have my own ideas about why things are, and part of it has to do with my beliefs. If someone posted a link on evolution, I would throw it out the window, because I believe what I believe and nobody can change that.) Not saying you're right or wrong, just that I may see things differently than you because of my beliefs. ( example, if you don't believe that something exists that I DO believe, I may contribute an idea based on that belief and you may think I'm crazy, but then again you have different beliefs). Thanks for the links, I'll read them later. ( Again, not disagreeing with what you wrote, I perhaps should do further research before spreading popular misconceptions.) Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #36 January 26, 2006 QuoteOK, sorry. ( but I still have my own ideas about why things are, and part of it has to do with my beliefs. If someone posted a link on evolution, I would throw it out the window, because I believe what I believe and nobody can change that.) Honestly, that is the best way to live your life: truthiness instead of truth. truthiness: defined as the quality of stating concepts one wishes or believes to be true, rather than the facts.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #37 January 26, 2006 QuoteQuoteOK, sorry. ( but I still have my own ideas about why things are, and part of it has to do with my beliefs. If someone posted a link on evolution, I would throw it out the window, because I believe what I believe and nobody can change that.) Honestly, that is the best way to live your life: truthiness instead of truth. truthiness: defined as the quality of stating concepts one wishes or believes to be true, rather than the facts. you mean like believing in GOd and the Bible as the inspired word of God??? I know God to be real, and if you think I'm crazy, that's perfectly fine by me Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #38 January 26, 2006 No, not at all. Because I believe in God. But denying proof of something simply because you "believe" otherwise is silly. Ignoring research on evolution (or anything) SIMPLY because it is not in line with your notion of the way the world is self-inflicted ignorance at the highest level. We should all strive to learn as much as possible from every angle. Only then can we understand the reason the opposition to our beliefs believes what it does. And on that journey, we may even find hints of truth in what they have to say.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #39 January 26, 2006 Quote But denying proof of something simply because you "believe" otherwise is silly. Ignoring research on evolution (or anything) SIMPLY because it is not in line with your notion of the way the world is self-inflicted ignorance at the highest level. It's not about denying proof. Why do you think evolution is a theory? How would I know to accept something as "true research", when it is contrary to God's word? Doesn't make sense to me, because I because the Bible is the Word of God. The thing is, you probably don't believe there are spirits/demons that may affect the way people experience life on earth...is there any scientific proof of this? Not likely. Does God's word say this? Yes. Therefore, just because I don't have proof, does not mean I am ignorant. It simply means I believe what the Bible says...and no amount of scientific "evidence" will make me disregard what the Word says. Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #40 January 26, 2006 That was awesome.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #41 January 26, 2006 Wrong Forum for theological debates. Now lets get back on topic here: BOOBIES!!!!!! OH Wait.. That wasn’t the topic.. Oh yea.. Nice Guys finishing last... I am more of an Arrogant Bastard but in that nice guy sort of way. I rarely finish last. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #42 January 26, 2006 QuoteI am a firm believer that to some extent, everyone is superficial...particularly at first Perhaps, but maybe not. I can honestly say aestetics never played a role in whether or not I was interested in a guy. But, I suppose I could think of an example---a guy at my former job who literally smelled, had a severe case of crater-face, hair always standing up as if he was rubbed by a balloon just moments earlier, and always making snorting sounds. He must have had half a brain to be working in his position, which counts for something, but admittedly that would be a case of superficial no-chance-in-hell for me. But generally, I'd have to disagree that everyone has a degree of that. It ALWAYS took something else to get my attention. But talking about someone walking down the street--since that could be a girl, I would agree---as I'm always the first to call slut (not to her face of course) when I see the mini skirt and knee-high boot combo.Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #43 January 26, 2006 QuoteWrong Forum for theological debates. Now lets get back on topic here: BOOBIES!!!!!! OH Wait.. That wasn’t the topic.. Oh yea.. Nice Guys finishing last... I am more of an Arrogant Bastard but in that nice guy sort of way. I rarely finish last. I know, whoops sorry! Maybe I just want to turn all bonfire debates into speaker's corner debates Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #44 January 26, 2006 QuoteAs far as women wanting good looking guys rather than someone they can connect with, I think there are a lot of shallow people out there, I have met some of them. Again, there may be deeper issues involved, but not always. Some people just want a good looking person to boost their self esteem. I think your original "good-looking WITH MONEY" statement might be a bit more accurate--just a bit--due to the "with money" part. But otherwise, I'm 100% in agreement with RL. I do think, regardless of looks and on the otherhand, money DOES play a big role for whatever reason. Edited to add: The above based on college-experience. Girls/roomates not at all shy to admit they were only there to meet a soon-to-be-doctor or lawyer (my school had fantastic programs for both). I guess education was just a "bonus".Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #45 January 26, 2006 QuoteWrong Forum for theological debates. Agreed. But, I can't help myself and feel compelled to add: I believe BOTH can co-exist. I believe in God and evolution. I will not explain how in this forum or any other. Perhaps we'll meet someday...Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GTAVercetti 0 #46 January 26, 2006 QuoteQuoteWrong Forum for theological debates. Agreed. But, I can't help myself and feel compelled to add: I believe BOTH can co-exist. I believe in God and evolution. I will not explain how in this forum or any other. Perhaps we'll meet someday... We have discussed that very thing in the Christian thread in SC. And I agree in full.Why yes, my license number is a palindrome. Thank you for noticing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PLFXpert 0 #47 January 26, 2006 <---didn't know that. I boldly entered SC for a day or two. Then never returned I prefer a public debate forum where actual rules of debate and proper refutes apply. Actually I was on the debate team and have never lost a debate. But, that's neither here nor there... But, interesting to know...Paint me in a corner, but my color comes back. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #48 January 26, 2006 OK.. Since Windcatcher and PLFXpert have violated the sanctity of this Forum by discussing Non-Boobie, Beer or General Sexual Innuendo Fluff in this forum.... Each should post Pictures of themselves in skimpy outfits (Outfit Optional) for the rest of us to enjoy as penance. VTA... Your pennace for encouraging this behavior is that you will not be allowed to Look at those pics once they are posted. I now return everyone to the general Fluffynesss of Bonfire. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ccowden 0 #49 January 26, 2006 Right on! Well put. It's all about having faith. faith [ fayth ] noun Definitions: 1. belief or trust: belief in, devotion to, or trust in somebody or something, especially without logical proof. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
windcatcher 0 #50 January 26, 2006 hahhaa, yeah right!!! Mother to the cutest little thing in the world... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
