Suicide

[Dumpster 0]

To qualify myself here - I lost my father, a man I have always had great admiration for, and who held life in high regard, to suicide in 1989.

In his case, he fought with cancer, lost one of his lungs to that, had emphysema (pardon the spelling) in his remaining lung, his heart was weak, then his gall bladder gave out.

This was a fellow who liked to look back at the end of the day and see that he's accomplished something worth while. He taught me the value of a good day's work.

When he got to the point where it was a major accomplishment just to get out of bed without assistance, he apparently decided enough was enough, he was sick and tired of being sick and tired, and being a burden to his family, and he took his own life.

That's our best guess - He never discussed it with anyone and left no note. It was a very sudden, very messy affair.

As you can tell I try to rationalize it. But most of us find suicide an irrational act. It seems to me some one who is extremely depressed isn't thinking rationally, and to me suicide is irrational.

My father ended his very painful life, and probably beleived he was doing those he "left behind" a big favor, too.

But let me tell you, unless you've been closely involved in this as I have, you have absolutely no idea what it does to the survivors. The fallout is absolutely tremendous. The scars last for a lifetime. This was back 1989, and I still have my moments, as does my Mom and brother and sisters. It took me years to be able to talk about it even with close friends, my Mom suffered a break down a year after the event, and I don't know if my brother was ever the same since.

I take it very seriously, and I take great offense when anyone makes light of it. To me making jokes about suicide rates right down there with jokes about child molestation.

Suicide is irrational, therefore a rational decision to commit suicide is impossible. My father was not thinking rationally.

[RhondaLea 4]

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At the root of suicide I believe is a loss of hope.

Some instances of suicide, particularly those that do not succeed, are a little lot more manipulative than that.

Among the personality-disordered, the "I'll show you, you son-of-a-bitch" rate of suicide attempts (parasuicide) is kinda high. This is pretty simplistic, but such people are not so much hopeless as so filled with rage that they will take extreme measures to exact their revenge on the object(s) of that rage.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[udder 0]

I read paper on the net a while back and it listed the economic benefits of attempting suicide. It noted that after attempting suicide the survivor(for want of a better word) had a increased income and greater job satisfaction.

"In one way or the other, I'm a bad brother. Word to the motherf**ker." Eazy-E

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

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This is a purely hypothetical question, so don't anyone break down my door and put me in a straightjacket. I'm interested to hear what folks here think of this -

Is it possible to make a rational decision to end one's life, or is that, by definition, an irrational decision thus requiring the person to be restrained from any action ?

Kevin

I think under certain circumstances it is completely rational. Likewise, I think if a person has made that rational decision he or she ought to have some quick, humane, fool-proof way to accomplish the act without fear of persecution.

Edited to add that "rational" is a very subjective term. All it takes is a few trips to some lesser third-world countries to understand that what you and I percieve as positively wrong, they see as totally normal.

Chuck

[kkeenan 14]

I appreciate all of the responses to this thread. I was hoping for some thoughtful and honest insight from a wide cross-section of people whose opinions I value - fellow jumpers.

I have a good friend who recently faced this situation. Thankfully, this friend is still with us, but a lot of folks, in the skydiving community to which this friend belongs, have been thrown into disarray by the event. We are trying to support our friend and to come to grips with the problems that let this person down this particular path.

There are members of this community who may not regularly read DZ.com. I will try to point them to this thread so that they, too, may profit from the time, caring, and intelligence (for the most part) shown by all of you who have responded.

Thank you again for help that may be given to this friend and to others by the sharing of your time and thoughts.

Kevin Keenan

_____________________________________
Dude, you are so awesome...
Can I be on your ash jump ?

[bianuan 0]

Not all cultures view suicide in the Christian influenced culture way - where it is generally considered a waste of life/selfish/result of depressive illness.
For some cultures to take your own life in certain circumstances is considered a matter of honour and therefore from a rational decision to be honourable.
Like all things depends on the point of view you are looking from.

Ann

[cocheese 0]

For the record, i'm not suicidal at all. I was just trying to think of rational reasons for this event.
I think the key to determine irrationality is when someone fails at the attempt. They clearly weren't thinking too smart to fail at killing themselves. Someone who succeeds may have been thinking clearer in my opinion. I don't condone suicide at all, but I think sometimes the mind set is not much different than making a 200 foot base jump or waving a gun at a cop. These people are not trying to live a long life.

[kbordson 8]

Suicide is "caused" by many things.

Pain (physical or emotional), loss of hope (sorrow or chronic illness), depression, psychiatric instability

The decision to procede with suicide is NOT generally one makes lightly ("should I ... go to the mall or take these pills?") Nor is it a decision made based on thoughts of other people. It's generally about freeing yourself from whatever pain you need to escape from with the thought that the death would be better than the process currently.

A suicidal "gesture" (not a real attempt) might be more manipulative, but even some of those actually do become real suicides if not caught.

Would I select the option for suicide if I had the proper situation? I don't know. Ovarian cancer, metastatic, bowel obstruction.... or pain meds. I would definately consider it a "reasonable" choice.