npgraphicdesign 3 #26 April 27, 2009 Quote I have an older Tri 220 with the 4.0 Mod and a 2 year old 190. LOVE the Tri and will probably never jump anything else but I'm older and a conservative jumper...I agree with everything popsjumper said! Thank you. You wouldn't happen to be a graphic designer, would ya? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adobelover 0 #27 April 28, 2009 You're very welcome and no graphic designer here but I do love Doberman Pinchers! _________________________________________ Old age ain't no place for sissies! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #28 April 28, 2009 First a word to Capt_Stan... As per our PMs, I just want to publicly say that Stan has a very true and excellent point that learning from others can be less than optimum. Indeed, as he said later, it could even be dangerous. My initial response to him was excessively harsh and for that I apologize. As for the 3+1... I took it to mean 3 internal lines + 1 stabilizer line. Flaking would be between the 3 internal lines while not including the stabilizer material in the 3-line flake. I have that take on it because that is how I pack my Tri. With respect to flaking only... I pull the material out from in between the stabilizer lines and let it hang. I move into the canopy and gather the brake lines and the 3 D-lines in one hand then flake between the Ds and Cs. I continue forward...Add all three Cs and flake between the Cs and Bs, then between the Bs and As. I then move to the other side and do the same. You can see that the stabilizer lines are not included in the canopy flaking other than pulling the material out at start. And yes...I learned this through experimentation. it works well for me...well enough that I recommend it to other Tri owners. As a side note, I use a two-shoulder method where left-side line groups are hanging on my left shoulder and right on right while flaking.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #29 April 28, 2009 First to the OP...you are getting some good info in response to your original question and no doubt, you will get more so please forgive the additional questions raised. there's some learning going on and that's, hopefully, a good thing. To Beachbum From DZbum Slider stops... OK...I'm not talking about placing and keeping the slider up against the stops. That's a given and should be done every pack job. Your slammer may well have been caused by inadvertently letting the slider slip away from the stops while rolling it up or putting it into the D-bag. As far as how much movement I have no idea. I have not experimented with that and I'm understandably reluctant to do so. Slider adjustments... Positioning of the nose of the slider on a Tri is a very good adjustment point for opening speed. Here's what I mean: AFTER you push in the canopy nose material into the cone of the canopy, set the slider by pulling the nose of it out of the canopy material. How much you pull it out affects opening speed. Your slammer, given that it was a packing issue, could very well have been because you forgot to set the slider after you pushed in the nose of the canopy. Pulling it not at all will result in a brisk (or even a slammer) opening. Pulling it all the way will be a very slow opener. The optimum is a personal preference. I suggest this....pull it out 2-3 inches from the cone of the canopy material and try it. If it's too fast, next pack pull it out 1 inch more. If it's too slow,, next pack pull it out 1 inch less. Experiment and find your desired optimum. Recommendation: Do NOT do what I did as a young jumper..."Let's see what happens if you don't set the slider at all and let the nose of it stay buried inside with the nose of the canopy". That goes right along with Stan's "learning by experience". One last thing...Disclaimer: From experience, I know this works well with Triathlon, Specter, Storm, Sabre2, student canopies and similar conservative canopies. I do not have any input on how something like this could/would apply to HP canopies. My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,523 #30 April 28, 2009 Quote Quote It doesn't seem to pack much differently than a nine-cell (except you only count to 3). What's that all about? Wow, did this take off. I should learn that obscure jokes should stay in the bonfire.The "count to 3" reference was for flaking out the cells. Not the lines. I grab all the lines with similar height knots (that gives me line groups). Then I count out the cells as I flake. A 9-cell has 4 flakes, a 7-cell has 3. Yes, I'm anal enough to flake and smooth each cell individually. I know others just smooth out the entire group of cells together, but I choose to be a bit more thorough. Switching back and forth between my 7-cell and other's 9-cells means I have to remember to count cells to 3 or 4 depending."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #31 April 28, 2009 QuoteWow, did this take off. I should learn that obscure jokes should stay in the bonfire. The "count to 3" reference was for flaking out the cells. Not the lines. I grab all the lines with similar height knots (that gives me line groups). Then I count out the cells as I flake. A 9-cell has 4 flakes, a 7-cell has 3. Yes, I'm anal enough to flake and smooth each cell individually. I know others just smooth out the entire group of cells together, but I choose to be a bit more thorough. Switching back and forth between my 7-cell and other's 9-cells means I have to remember to count cells to 3 or 4 depending. Yeah, my posts went off-topic. I was trying to understand how some of you guys are packing, and it took awhile to get a clear answer. Thanks for explaining your technique. I may always be puzzled why some choose to stop flaking a canopy before going all the way to the outside of the end cell and include the stabilizer and it's corresponding rib in the same stack of flakes. When I do that, I count to 4 (7-cell) or 5 (9-cell), hence our difference. That way the number of flakes corresponds to the number of lines, not to the number of cells. After all, these are not 6- or 8-cell canopies. The 7-cell square has 8 lines in each row and the 9-cell square has 10. I teach my students to account for all the lines, grouping them in 4s (7-cell) or 5s (9-cell) and flaking the canopy from the center all the way to (and including) the stabilizers. I hope The Russian Rocket got some good answers to his Triathlon question. Any more discussion about packing may be better served by a new thread. If anyone has more comments on this, you're welcome to PM me, and I'll start a new thread, taking whatever heat goes along w/ that. Blues, Stan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
npgraphicdesign 3 #32 April 28, 2009 Quote You're very welcome and no graphic designer here but I do love Doberman Pinchers! Oh hah! I read 'adobe' not 'a dobe' as in doberman. Nice... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
npgraphicdesign 3 #33 April 28, 2009 I definitely got some good answers so far. Now, I weigh 185-190, plus about 30lb for gear, and that would make my wing loading at 1.06 if i did my math correctly. The Triathlon 210...would that be a good size, or should I look for a smaller canopy in the 190ish range? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pinna 0 #34 April 28, 2009 I bought a Tri 210 5 years ago when I re-entered the sport after taking a decade off. At the time I was looking for something docile due to knee issues, and have not had a reason since to sell it off. I am not an aggressive canopy pilot and it always does well for me. We had a terrible spot last year at our dz which is surrounded by grape stakes for miles, and it was no problem to sink that canopy into a small utility field. I could have probably sold it for ten times what I paid for it at that moment to some of my high WL flying companions on that load! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d123 3 #35 April 28, 2009 For me this has been an educative thread! Many Happy landings, Jean-Arthur Deda.Lock, Dock and Two Smoking Barrelrolls! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beachbum 0 #36 April 28, 2009 Educational thread for me too ... thanks y'all! PopsJumper - Based on that info, I'm guessing it was due to forgetting to reset it after positioning the nose. I was initially taught to halve the slider nose to tail and have done it that way since. I'll experiment with the exposure on the nose side as you suggested ... thanks again!As long as you are happy with yourself ... who cares what the rest of the world thinks? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
