Container Service Life

[jumpwally 0]

Once again, I don't fear old gear ! i just like new ! or newer,,its no different than cell phones, an old one will serve you well, but i get a new one every time my contract is up just cuz' i can, i want to and i like to,,,nothing more, nothing less.

smile, be nice, enjoy life
FB # - 1083

[billvon 3,065]

>but a SuperRaven probably would have been just fine.

I agree.

However, to a jumper who is not a rigger, it may well be a good decision to avoid all reserves of that era to avoid the risk entirely.

Keep in mind that jumpers in this sport start out knowing almost nothing. They may not know that an old Racer without riser covers is a safety risk, or that a regular Super Raven is pretty safe but a Micro Raven is not. They may not be able to understand the issues of high wingloadings on reserves, and that modern reserves can be overloaded more safely than older reserves. They may not know that a five cell Swift with flyaway brake lines is harder to land, or that it looks like you have broken lines after you open. They may not know that a Hobbit reserve may work fine but requires an entirely different pack job, one that some riggers may not be able to do.

Or they could get more modern gear and avoid all those issues. For someone who does not know much about gear, it may be a good decision. Once they have a thousand jumps and a rigger's ticket (or even just a lot of experience with gear) they will be in a better position to decide that that Micro Raven 120 is actually less safe overall than a PDR113, but a MR150 might be OK.

[likestojump 3]

I agree with you Bill.

All I was saying that older/more vintage does not automatically mean less safe.

[pchapman 279]

Quote

However, to a jumper who is not a rigger, it may well be a good decision to avoid all reserves of that era to avoid the risk entirely.

I wouldn't go quite so far. I'd encourage them to learn more.

But your points are valid about how we all have to start somewhere and learn. Someone newer in the sport might look at an older design rig and say they aren't jumping it. Not because they are a pussy or an idiot... they're just unsure of the details, they've never been taught about it, and want to stay safe by not messing with something they don't know about.

Sure, I or someone else with more experience might get a laugh out of it. C'mon, what's the problem? Velcro, no tuck tabs, a high stall point on the reserve, F-111 main, no AAD, whatever, it can all be used reasonably safely in the right circumstances. But you can't always blame them. And so we have discussions like this one to hash out more detail about where dangers lie or not.

For every newbie who thinks everything old is dangerous, you also get a newbie who shows up at the DZ with some old rig as his first rig and really doesn't understand the implications of what they've bought.

I'll defend old equipment -- but just as with new stuff, one has to learn its limitations.

[CMiller 1]

Quote

I cant imagine having to cutaway to a 20 year old reserve, I just dont see why, your reserve is your last hope, shouldn't you have the best?

It was fine. It worked, I made it back to the DZ, and landed fine. My reserve was 20 years old, but it was deemed airworthy by a rigger. If it wasn't, it would not have been packed.

Now, it may not have worked so well during a head down premature deployment, but I do not freefly. I trust the rigger's judgement when he says "That will probably save your life", 2 years old or 20.

I really only started this thread to find out if Container manufacturers (particularly sunpath) put service life on their containers.

[Beatnik 2]

Quote

I had my first cutaway yesterday, and am extremely glad I had a nice new reserve packed. Once again it gave me peace of mind to know that that reserve is at least maintained well, and is of the most modern design there is(In reserve technology). I cant imagine having to cutaway to a 20 year old reserve, I just dont see why, your reserve is your last hope, shouldn't you have the best? Anyways, Im done with explaining myself. If you still dont see what I am saying, then so be it.

I can understand what you are saying from your posts but your arguments are not really valid. What I mean is that you make invalid inferences that because they are new they are the best and better. If you feel safer jumping all really new stuff then good for you. It is a psychological issue more than anything. If you learn about gear and under it and your limitations you would be better off. You can have the newest stuff on the market and it is not going to save you if you don't know how to use it. Jumping new gear is not going to make you safer or better, only you can do that. Just so you know I understand your argument, I just don't like that you make some invalid inferences.

This thread on a whole is pretty interesting for me. In the last decade I have done more jumps on vintage gear than anyone else I have known or heard of. I have seen jumpers make arguments that the gear is unsafe because it is old or blame old gear for something when it is more the jumper's fault than anything else. Sure you have to be more aware of certain things but if you know what to be aware of you can do it safely and do it for many, many years. There have been some designs better than others but that happens regardless of their time frame. Educate yourself more, it will do more for you than nice new shiny gear.

[kallend 2,106]

Quote

Once again it gave me peace of mind to know that that reserve is at least maintained well, and is of the most modern design there is(In reserve technology). I cant imagine having to cutaway to a 20 year old reserve, I just dont see why, your reserve is your last hope, shouldn't you have the best? Anyways, Im done with explaining myself. If you still dont see what I am saying, then so be it.

-Evo

I know several jumpers who removed their "modern design" reserves and replaced them with "old technology" PDRs because it turned out that that particular "modern design" reserve had a very nasty tendency to stall on landing and cause injuries.

So, in other words, I don't buy your argument.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[flyboy62000 0]

This Parachutes Australia service life limit got me. I have a bailout rig from PA for my glider that is completely serviceable other than the service life limit. Because it has been stored inside or been on my back in the cockpit of the glider, has seen very little sunlight, wear, etc. The rig, including the canopy are as nearly good as new. 0 jumps on either (thankfully). However I don't think it's worth the hassle of sending the thing back to PA for an evaluation, nor was this update out when I replaced the rig. Now I'm using this canopy for other purposes(car cover/rigging practice).

Blue Skies,
Adam
I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry