rhino 0 #1 September 29, 2004 Sept 6, 2002 - Initial custody order was signed. Nov 15, 2002 - My ex-wife did so many nasty things, parent alienation, refusing parenting time, ect. The Judge ordered a change of custody evaluation to be done at the Friend of The Court "In my favor" because there was a "Change of Circumstance." Dec, 3 2002 - Defeated 2nd False PPO "Cost to me was $4,800" that my ex-wife filed against me in an adjoining county "Forum Shopping". This really pissed the judge off. My ex was ordered to pay $1500 in my attorney fees. Jan 15, 2003 - FINALLY the initial foc investigation "1 day" was completed. Feb 28, 2003 - Got recommendation back and didn't agree. March 25, 2003 - Went back in front of the judge and was ordered to have a full blown FOC Evidence hearing on the case BEFORE WE COULD GO BACK TO THE JUDGE AND HAVE HER RULE. May 1, 2003 - May 17, 2004 - 11 days!! Separate days of testimony at the FOC building Court. Took over 11 months because the FOC Referee had to take care of her personal business all the time, kids dance class, vacations, bla, bla bla.... That was 11 full days in court total. Paid for a certified court reporter to be in the courtroom every day and paid for transcripts.. Transcripts alone were $9,400. Attorney bill for that 11 months stands at $64,500 and counting. Already paid that firm over $38,000. July 15, 2004 - Got FOC recommendation back. Not only did the FOC referee not see a change of circumstance she recommended that time be taken from me as it was easier to do so than be thorough and do her job properly. Aug 10, 2004 - Filed objection to FOC recommendation personally as my former attorneys quit on me after a 90k + attorney bill. Aug 15, 2004 - Hired a new attorney. Paid $1800 in advance for a 3-day evidence hearing in front of the judge. Last Thursday, after getting my new attorney spun up on the case. Which was not an easy thing to do.. We showed up to court... Negotiated for 6 hours with my ex-wife and her attorney trying to come to some sort of settlement to avoid a full blown hearing "Which I was MORE THAN READY to do".. Only to have her attorney after lunch come back and say "he made a mistake" and misrepresented his client on the offer they wanted to give us initially. Finally I said FUCK THIS LETS DANCE!!! Only to have the judge pull both of our attorneys into chambers and inform my attorney this.... Because so much time had passed since the change of circumstance was issued that WE NO LONGER HAD A CHANGE OF CIRCUMSTANCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! So.. Let's recap... 1. Judge issues a change or circumstance giving me an open door to get custody. 2. Judge orders me to go to FOC for hearing 3. We goto FOC for hearing 4. Gullible female referee buys ex-wife's load of shit 5. Recommendation sucks 6. I object 7. back to judge 8. Judge doesn't want to do job so orders a full-blown evidence hearing 9. Back to FOC for a year "ex-wife represented herself and got away with murder in the hearing" 10. Got recommendation that sucked again from a gullible female referee 11. Objected 12. Back in front of judge for my day in court FINALLY 13. Was told to fuck off by judge because her referees are incompetent. I did WHAT SHE MADE ME DO and she punishes me for it.. It was a NO WIN situation. What did I get from this whole mess? Every other weekend.. 2 extra weekends a year.. 6 weeks during the summer... ALL of his spring break "easter" a $64,000 attorney bill and a big FUCK YOU from the Oakland County court. I AM WRITING A STORY ON THIS ORDEAL AND WILL BE SENDING IT TO EVERY FATHERS RIGHTS ORGANIZATION AND EVERY NEWS STATION THAT WILL TAKE IT IN THE COUNTRY. I will be filing suit against Oakland County within the next 6 months.. I will be going after the referees and judges job with a vengeance. No fucking respect for Dads in Michigan.. The Judge happens to be on the board of directors for the woman's organization "HAVEN" that helped my ex-wife kidnap and get the initial false ppo "Personal Protection Order" against me over 3.5 years ago. This is fucked up... At least I made some gain. Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sunshine 2 #2 September 29, 2004 Sorry Rob. You did what you had to do and got majorly fucked. You still have my respect for trying. I know you love your son. It's a shame he can't live with you. Wish i could do something for you. ___________________________________________ meow I get a Mike hug! I get a Mike hug! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1shlips 2 #3 September 29, 2004 QuoteWhat did I get from this whole mess? Every other weekend.. 2 extra weekends a year.. 6 weeks during the summer... ALL of his spring break "easter" In my opinion, as the (former) son of divorced parents, whatever extra time you got was worth it.... no matter the cost or headache.-- drop zone (drop'zone) n. An incestuous sesspool of broken people. -- Attributed to a whuffo girlfriend. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #4 September 29, 2004 QuoteSorry Rob. You did what you had to do and got majorly fucked. You still have my respect for trying. I know you love your son. It's a shame he can't live with you. Wish i could do something for you. I appreciate that Sunny.. I have to take a mental breather for a couple of weeks to be able to see straight... I'm thinking.. 1. Sue Oakland County 2. Sue Ex for Slander, Libel and Defamation of Character. If she goes to jail I get custody. 3. Appeal... Based on the fact that the ladder FOC referee was giving Legal Advice to my ex-wife on the record and we had to object twice.... Start all over again............ I'm happy with the gain... But unwilling to let my son sit there in that family and ROT. Catching my breath and regrouping at the moment.. Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #5 September 29, 2004 QuoteIn my opinion, as the (former) son of divorced parents, whatever extra time you got was worth it.... no matter the cost or headache. I agree with you.. Sorry you had to go through that... Any gain is a good gain... Rhino Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
f1shlips 2 #6 September 29, 2004 I didn't find it to be all that bad, as an adult I'm just glad I have a relationship with my father. The hardest part is that my folks still hate each other and play games about spending equal time. Thankfully I've discovered a the joy of hotel rooms and a thick skin....-- drop zone (drop'zone) n. An incestuous sesspool of broken people. -- Attributed to a whuffo girlfriend. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rwieder 0 #7 September 29, 2004 Rob: keep fighting the good fight. my youngest i fought for for years is now 21 years of age. things have come a long way, but the courts are still on the inclination to the learning curve and have not yet reached the plateau. Good Luck, Best Wishes.-Richard- "You're Holding The Rope And I'm Taking The Fall" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #8 September 29, 2004 Quotekeep fighting the good fight. my youngest i fought for for years is now 21 years of age. things have come a long way, but the courts are still on the inclination to the learning curve and have not yet reached the plateau. Good Luck, Best Wishes. I hear you bro... I have a responsibility to my son, other children, and other parents to fight to get this fixed. Or at least make a difference... I'm just getting started.. I'm starting my criminal justice degree here soon................ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RevJim 0 #9 September 29, 2004 Keep fighting Rob, bud. My eldest, who is now 13, has been living here with me now for almost 2 years. I fought and fought, and it seemed like every time I went back to court I lost ground. One day all of a sudden she calls me up, says he wants to live with me, and is willing to go back to court and sign off. She even gave me hand written and signed statements to that effect before the actual dates, which I still have right here in front of me. 11+ years of fighting, bud. Worth every damn second of it too. NEVER give up.It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallinWoman 1 #10 September 29, 2004 Oh, Rob, this sucks!!! You so deserve to have your son with you. Keep in your heart that there are people out there who believe in you and your fight. Marc and I are currently fighting to have the legal orders changed. We have had the child for 15 months (at her mother's suggestion) but we are still paying her child support. The process sucks. But Daniel (and our Lauren) is worth it. Keep fighting for him, he deserves it! Keeping you and Daniel in my prayers, Anne Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gravityizsexy 0 #11 September 29, 2004 Im real sorry that happened. Go for it, everything they have, I hate divorce courts with a passion. they are diseases, infecting good people and good families. I've been through it first hand, (from the childs perspective) I really didn't get it until I was older... that women get it all no matter how fucked up in the head they get. hrmmmm.... stand back... I'm going to try to get creative. OK, here are your options... a) Immediatly start dating hot, YOUNG, sexy, sexpot b) Immediatly start dating hot, YOUNG, sexy, sexpot c) Immeditaly start dating hot, YOUNG, sexy, sexpot d) find that lawyer fuck, and get personal... NOTE: I'm just a kid (22) my parent's divorced when I was 9, considering the situation... it must seem that life is unfair. She gets the kid, YOU PAY, she runs with the kid, YOU PAY, you get the kid, YOU PAY, You beat her.. You REALLY PAY! etc.... anyway you look at it the shit end of stick is always pointed at the male in this. Things probably don't make any sense for you right now. All you can really do is be a DAD. For the kid (in my experience, I assuming he is somewhere between 8-12 years old) he's fully capable of comphrehending exactly whats going on. You have to realize though that he does have his own life going on, whether it be in school , friends, girls, whatever, he's got other things going on that you probably don't know about. Yes, mom and dad are splitting up and thats a pretty big ordeal, but he's probably used to the two of you making the decisions in his life, and if you two decided to split up he has no choice but to accept that. But just please remember, you and your ex-wife's problems are his too Especially now since what happened in the courts, Im guessing you can't stand being in the same room with each other. (That hurts the most). Most of all he's looking to you to figure out on his own what to do. so be GOOD in front of the kid. I don't know you, or your situation. I'm just writing to relate what I can to you how it was for me. If Im totally off the mark with this, please disreguard and accept my apologies. I just wanna help you make it as painless as possible for the little guy. Good luck with the petition. -Tony "'Someday is not a day in my week'" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #12 September 29, 2004 Anytime you have the child for 6 consecutive nights you get a 50% abatement.. Anytime you have the child for over 134??? days a year you get another abatement... Check into it Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christoofar 0 #13 September 29, 2004 I'm SO thankful my parents stayed married (and still are). Basically, as the age of 9 or so at the end of a bitter argument I asked out loud "if you guys hate each other so much, why don't you just get divorced and get over yourselves?" My mother replied, "we're too G-damed POOR to get divorced!!!" How true that was. They're so old now, they can't function without each other, even if they do bitch and argue a lot. ____________________________________________________________ I'm RICK JAMES! Fo shizzle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallinWoman 1 #14 September 29, 2004 Our big problem is that our case covers three states...Missouri granted us temporary emergency custody...and that is where the three of us live. Illinois will not change the child support order until permanent custody has been awarded. Mom lives in Ohio. It will all get sorted out, but it is a very slow process....and meanwhile mom is getting money from Marc every two weeks.... I care less about the money than I do about having the courts recognize us as the custodial parents. I just want Lauren to be here and to know that she is going to stay here. She deserves that stability. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #15 September 29, 2004 QuoteNo fucking respect for Dads in Michigan.. None anywhere else either bro. My fight is heating up again. I just hired attorney #6. Ex-wife just denied my visitation. Have to file contempt motion and start all over again on the custody fight. Wonderful. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #16 September 29, 2004 QuoteEx-wife just denied my visitation. I'm so tired of this bullshit..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paige 0 #17 September 29, 2004 Fight the good fight until you get what you want or a fair judgement is rendered. I'm sure any news station would eat that up if all you say is the way you say it (Esp. father's rights groups too). The best of luck to you!Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #18 September 29, 2004 QuoteI'm so tired of this bullshit..... Yeah.......but it's actually sort of good for me this time. I got MAJORLY screwed a year ago because I had an attorney that was STUPID. OK....she wasn't stupid she just FUCKED up royally. So...by the ex opening this up again it gives me a 2nd chance. By her continuing the pattern of interfereing with visitation I have some nice recent ammo to work with. It's a blessing in disguise. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nightingale 0 #19 September 29, 2004 Dang... is there any way you could file in a more father-friendly venue? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sabr190 0 #20 September 29, 2004 QuoteDang... is there any way you could file in a more father-friendly venue? Not in the wonderful family court system of the USA. "The needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few, or the one" - rehmwa Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gthomas101 0 #21 September 29, 2004 Im glad i read this this afternoon, I was starting to not like my ex again thinking she wasnt doing some things right but i got to tell you I divorced her a almost two years ago we used the same att. decided on childsupport together and i bought half of my tools from her and i kissed her ass alot but everymorning i take my daughter to school Im heading out to pick her up right now, i pick her up when ever i want to , so yea i got it sweet , Im really sorry for your situation, growing up my dad used to throw rocks at my moms car as she was leaving so i understand . Good Luckgthomasphoto.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
catfishhunter 2 #22 September 30, 2004 I just received this in my email (I have a webring for divorced dads) I will forward the entire email if you like. There are several links that I didn't post that you might find helpful.If anyone else would like to read the entire email just PM me with the email addy you want me to forward the email to. Across U.S., Non-Custodial Parents Sue Tuesday, September 28, 2004 By Wendy McElroy At least 28 federal class action suits in 28 states have been filed in the last two weeks on behalf of non-custodial parents (NCPs). The defendants are the individual states. The plaintiffs claim to represent an estimated 25 million non-custodial parents - primarily fathers - whose right to equal custody of minor children in situations of dispute is allegedly being violated by family courts across the nation. Family law is traditionally a state matter, but the federal government has assumed greater control in the area over the last few decades. Thus, the plaintiffs are appealing to the Constitution, U.S. Supreme Court precedent and acts of Congress "to vindicate and restore their various inalienable rights." In short, federal law is being asked to trump state practice in custody matters. According to the suits, state practices appear to be "willful, reckless, and/or negligent fraud, deceit, collusion, and/or abuse of powers" with a "systematic pattern of obstructing, hindering, and/or otherwise thwarting the rightful and lawful conclusion of due process" of non-custodial parents in child custody proceedings. In particular, fathers protest the widespread practice of almost automatically granting sole custody to mothers in divorce disputes. The 28-plus class action suits are identical, as any future suits will be. The ultimate goal is for every state and U.S. possession to be represented in one large consolidated action. Indeed, Torm L. Howse - president of the Indiana Civil Rights Council and coordinator of the suits - says that paperwork is under way for submission to the Judicial Panel on Multidistrict Litigation, a legal body which has the authority to transfer such multiple civil cases to a single district court. If this happens, every single non-custodial parent in America will be represented by the class action suit, which is nothing more than a lawsuit brought by one person or a small group on behalf of an entire class who shares a grievance. What specific relief is being sought? The sweeping legal goals are spelled out in a press release. The main relief sought from federal court is the immediate "restoration/elevation to equal custodial status" of all current non-custodial parents against whom no allegations of abuse or neglect have been proven and who have an ongoing relationship with the child. The establishment of equal custody embraces several other reliefs. For example, the "prohibition of custodial move-aways of minor children [more than 60 miles] from their original physical residences with natural parents." Also, the "abolishment of forced/court-ordered child support in most cases." Support of the child would be borne by each parent during their own parenting time. The Plaintiffs argue for restoration of equal custody not merely for the sake of non-custodial parents but also for children's welfare. The press release cites a much-touted study entitled "Child Adjustment in Joint-Custody Versus Sole-Custody Arrangements," which was published in the APA's Journal of Family Psychology. The study concluded, "Children in joint physical or legal custody were better adjusted than children in sole-custody settings, but no different from those in intact families." In this sense, the suits also advocate children's rights. Other reliefs being sought are financial in nature; some of them take the suits into murky areas. For example, the suits ask for "reimbursement" from custodial parents to non-custodial parents of any state-ordered child support that exceeded the "maximum limits of federal law." This ceases to be an appeal to constitutional or parental rights and instead pits one set of civil law against another, with retroactive penalties being imposed. In addition, the suits ask for "various damages against the Defendant [the state named] in the aggregate value of $1,000,000 payable per Plaintiff." The court awards would be "executable upon all monies, property, chattels, assets, goods, pecuniary interest and anything whatsoever of any value" owned or controlled by the State. The suits request that "an appropriate portion" of the award be provided by the liquidation or direct transfer of title of "unused, abandoned, or unnecessary state property and assets." The number of non-custodial parent plaintiffs who sign on to a federal class action cannot be predicted but it could run into millions; the collective damages could run into billions or even trillions of dollars. Unfortunately, this gives the appearance of pursuing profit rather than justice. When asked to elaborate on the amount of damages, Howse clarified, "We are preparing, later this week, to offer proposed settlements that will waive the vast majority of damages, among other things, in exchange for a quick restoral of equal custody rights, a few forms of tax abatements/credits to balance what custodial parents have enjoyed for years and some other basic and related issues, like the setting up of neutral visitation exchange centers, and the like." He added, "It has never been about winning large amounts of money from the states ... It's about restoring the lives of our children, and restoring our own lives." I genuinely hope the settlements come to pass. Stripped of their financial demands, the suits could go a long way toward removing what I believe to be the worst laws governing child custody in disputed divorce. At bare minimum, they are raising the profile of an issue that will not go away: the crying need of non-custodial parents, especially fathers, to know their children. And the equal need of children to embrace both parents. Wendy McElroy is the editor of ifeminists.com and a research fellow for The Independent Institute in Oakland, Calif. She is the author and editor of many books and articles, including the new book, "Liberty for Women: Freedom and Feminism in the 21st Century" (Ivan R. Dee/Independent Institute, 2002). She lives with her husband in Canada MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RevJim 0 #23 September 30, 2004 PMing you my email addy. Even though I am now the custodial parent, I wasn't for over 11 years, paid out the nose, was charged with a felony for being unemployed, and was constantly threatened with jail time. During those same 11 years, my son's mother earned a grand total gross income of just over 3 thousand dollars before support. 3 grand in 11 years. Just WHO was I supporting? Anyway, I specifically set up the current custody order without support, just as that letter suggests, though I would seriously enjoy ripping apart the state for what they have done to me in the past. If it it going in WI, or ever does, count me in.It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #24 September 30, 2004 Send it to me bro... It's go time baby!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
catfishhunter 2 #25 September 30, 2004 sent to your dropzone email........... MAKE EVERY DAY COUNT Life is Short and we never know how long we are going to have. We must live life to the fullest EVERY DAY. Everything we do should have a greater purpose. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
