What comes with what when purchasing seperately?

[eightate8at8 0]

I know I've read it before, but to be honest the search function sucks here!

Basically I'd just like to know what things go with what when you buy things seperately. For example, all the things such as slider, dbag, PC, risers, all that jazz..

For example in my case, I'm buying a rig with a reserve but no main canopy, what should or shouldn't I get?

In addition, if I demo a canopy from PD or wherever, will I need to find additional equipment or will it come with everything I need? (I guess that question is being asked before my knowledge of the answer on the previous question)

Thanks guys

[GaryRay 0]

Quote

I know I've read it before, but to be honest the search function sucks here!

Basically I'd just like to know what things go with what when you buy things seperately. For example, all the things such as slider, dbag, PC, risers, all that jazz..

For example in my case, I'm buying a rig with a reserve but no main canopy, what should or shouldn't I get?

In addition, if I demo a canopy from PD or wherever, will I need to find additional equipment or will it come with everything I need? (I guess that question is being asked before my knowledge of the answer on the previous question)

Thanks guys

you're not trying hard enough with the search function, it works for everyone else, but to appease you and not turn you away from the sport here we go....

rig:
risers
PC
dbag

main:
links (s or french)
slider

reserve:
slider
links (s or french)

if you get a demo from PD i believe they come with everything you need, just need to take your dbag off of your old main and attach it to the demo canopy, then attach the risers to the container and voila, go jump...i do suggest having a rigger or a packer check it over before you go jump it if you decide to do the rigging yourself, which i think you should b/c its good experience.

i know i missed something so have at me =D

JewBag.
www.jewbag.wordpress.com

[eightate8at8 0]

You say the demo comes with everything but then say I need to transfer my dbad to it?

Meaning that the demo doesn't come with a dbag/pc or?
Maybe I just misread that..

[bigway 4]

D-Bag is part of the container. The manufacturer that makes the container makes the dbag for that container.

It should not come with a demo canopy. Risers are also part of a container, so really they do not need to send you risers with the demo canopy either, but i imagine in some cases they would.

.Karnage Krew Gear Store
.

[antonija 0]

#1 Canopy (main or reserve): (s)links, slider, lines, cloth.
#2 Rig: Everything but #1

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[Joellercoaster 6]

Quote

you're not trying hard enough with the search function, it works for everyone else

Kinda

--
"I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan

"You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at?

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

Quote

...

rig:
risers
PC
dbag

i know i missed something so have at me =D

bridle comes with PC and D-bag. Toggles come with risers (just to be complete)

And no, I've never seen a seperate bridle

Eightate8at8 - What did you search?

I tried "what comes with canopy container" and got a couple threads with this info.

"Included with" or "canopy includes" "container includes" didn't do much, but sometimes I have to try a few different keyword combos to get what I want.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[likestojump 3]

Quote

You say the demo comes with everything but then say I need to transfer my dbad to it?

Meaning that the demo doesn't come with a dbag/pc or?
Maybe I just misread that..

Imagine your container has a deep and long bag (more rectangular) and a pullout pilot chute.

And imagine PD sends you a demo canopy with a short and deep (more square) dbag and a BOC pilot chute.

That won't be much help to you.

bags differ in shape greatly from container to container, and people use different deployment systems. Transferring a dbag from canopy yo canopy takes under a minute.

PD demos come on risers, that's it.

and BTW, the search function works very well here, I use it all the time. Replace user, press any key to continue.

[councilman24 37]

Quote

you're not trying hard enough with the search function, it works for everyone else, but to appease you and not turn you away from the sport here we go....

rig:
risers
PC
dbag

main:
links (s or french)
slider

reserve:
slider
links (s or french)

...
i know i missed something so have at me =D

Okay.....
Rig
Harness and Container assembly
Webbing keepers
Reserve ripcord
reserve freebag if for square
safety stow or other freebag locking device (rubber bands, tube stows)
reserve toggles
Reserve PC
reserve PC cap if applicable
reserve loop, especially if abnormal but usually
Cutaway handle
Main bag
usually rubber bands to stow lines
main PC
main closing loop
main risers
main toggles
RSL lanyard if applicable
manual hopefully
packing data card usually

Answer to second question, what should come with a rig with no main?

ALL of the above plus the reserve canopy, including slider and the method of attachment to the reserve risers (links) and, hopefully, the manual, and all of the packing data cards for the life of the reserve and container.

BTW most manuals are available on line.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[mjosparky 4]

This is PIA's document on it.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[councilman24 37]

Pretty much works doesn't it?

But considering it's 23 years old might need a little help.

Hmm, think we need to assign document review responsibilities and schedule.

Actually I thought we did at one time. Maybe that was somewhere else.

Maybe I'll have to work on that now that I'm an interim committee chair, again.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[bigway 4]

Quote

Quote

...

rig:
risers
PC
dbag

i know i missed something so have at me =D

bridle comes with PC and D-bag. Toggles come with risers (just to be complete)

And no, I've never seen a seperate bridle

Eightate8at8 - What did you search?

I tried "what comes with canopy container" and got a couple threads with this info.

"Included with" or "canopy includes" "container includes" didn't do much, but sometimes I have to try a few different keyword combos to get what I want.

Is that a serious answer?

Bridle comes with D-Bag????


Toggles come with risers?

It all comes with the container and when buying spare parts you dont get a D-Bag with a bridle.

.Karnage Krew Gear Store
.

[Remster 30]

Now, keep in mind: all bets are off with used gear.

The rig _should_ come with everything but the canopies, but often, risers are left with canopies that are sold separately, d-bags get lost or also sold with canopies.

So, when dealing with used gear, ask!

Remster

[kingbunky 3]

Quote

Is that a serious answer?

Bridle comes with D-Bag????


Toggles come with risers?

It all comes with the container and when buying spare parts you dont get a D-Bag with a bridle.

i suppose, technically, the bridle comes with the main pilot chute, generally sewn to it. depending on the system, the bridle may be attached to the d-bag with a link (if the pilot chute is collapsible) or just threaded through a grommet in the base of the bag (non-collapsible).


(not replying to bigway, just a general clarification.)

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[riggerrob 643]

" ... and all of the packing data cards for the life of the reserve and container. ..."

...............................................................................................
If they are sold separately, packing data cards are supposed to go with
the reserve canopy.
However, this gets complicated if there are Service Bulletins affecting the container or AAD.
Some junior riggers refuse to repack reserves if complicated Service Bulletins are not documented.
Maybe photo-copies - of the packing data card - should accompany the container if they are sold separately.

[councilman24 37]

Quote

" ... and all of the packing data cards for the life of the reserve and container. ..."

...............................................................................................
If they are sold separately, packing data cards are supposed to go with
the reserve canopy.
This gets complicated if there are Service Bulletins affecting the container of AAD. Some junior riggers refuse to repack reserves if complicated Service Bulletins are not documented.
Maybe photo-copies - of the packing data card - should accompany the container if they are sold separately.

This answer was specifically what this guy should get. And the 'old' school of thought was as you stated, with the reserve canopy. But, with containers having SB's and in the old days AD's we really need the container data too. I just assembled a used rig purchased separately and had a card from the canopy with deployments and pack jobs in a different container and a card for the container with SB's for it recorded when it had a different reserve. Don't know what went with the other reserve canopy. Certainly photo copies are appropriate. There is water proof printer paper used for maps that is available and might be a good idea.

Some not so junior riggers want to know that the ripcord was tested and when and who replaced that side of the harness and when.

Loosing the information on who and when service bulletins or repairs to a harness and container were performed is uncomfortable at least.

Some H/C's have come back with separate cards for the container service bulletin. Not a bad idea to have a container card and a canopy card. AAD? maybe but usually covered by labeling. Just need to note that it is current or Use By date on the card.

Where the military surplus crap when you need it? And the riggers that would throw away the previous card so they could put in a new card with their business info printed on it? (Knew several of these.)

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[eightate8at8 0]

Quote

Quote

You say the demo comes with everything but then say I need to transfer my dbad to it?

Meaning that the demo doesn't come with a dbag/pc or?
Maybe I just misread that..

Imagine your container has a deep and long bag (more rectangular) and a pullout pilot chute.

And imagine PD sends you a demo canopy with a short and deep (more square) dbag and a BOC pilot chute.

That won't be much help to you.

bags differ in shape greatly from container to container, and people use different deployment systems. Transferring a dbag from canopy yo canopy takes under a minute.

PD demos come on risers, that's it..

Since I'm newer I just might not be getting this..

So are you saying it's easy to put the dbag you have with a demo you receive? Cause initially you talk about shapes which to me makes it sound like you're saying you can't take the dbag you own and throw it on a pd demo..

I'll send you a case of beer for putting up with this

Edit: Well now I atleast see you're comparing pullout to BOC so I get that.. Makes sense

Final fcuking edit!: So you're just saying to have your own dbag and pc ready to transfer to whatever canopy you might be jumping correct? And so the only thing that matters is that size of the dbag fits that of the canopy correct? Sorry, brainlock after too much school work (

[likestojump 3]

Quote

Since I'm newer I just might not be getting this..

So are you saying it's easy to put the dbag you have with a demo you receive? Cause initially you talk about shapes which to me makes it sound like you're saying you can't take the dbag you own and throw it on a pd demo..

I'll send you a case of beer for putting up with this

I am saying that the dbag is specific (more or less) to a container. As the canopy is not a solid shape, but rather fits into the dbag with appropriate volume, the canopy itself will fit into any compatible container. The big BUT is whether the dbag that the demo place sends you will fit your container - and as the asnwer is not always a yes, it's just easier to disconnect your dbag, and connect it to the demo canopy.

as far as shapes - your containers' main packtray has a well defined shape, that your containers' dbag fits into. A packed canopy does not have a well defined shape - it will take shape of any bag that you stuff/kick/force it into.

does this help ?

[eightate8at8 0]

Definitely, so you're saying that my FIRST priority is to make sure the dbag fits in my container correctly, and THEN adjust accordingly to make sure I can get the canopy into my dbag..

So my question now is, are there certain types of dbags, like shapes for the different containers? And then, within those types are different sizes for say a small velo vs. a 210 student canopy?

[floormonkey 0]

When buying used, you get what you get. Ask the seller and read the ad. There is no absolute on what you WILL get, only what people think you SHOULD get.

Check with your LOCAL rigger and I'm sure they will be glad (or at least won't refuse) to help you, as long as you provide beer.

Besides, you need to have them look at it anyway to guage it's airworthiness and tell you if it is a decent deal.

[likestojump 3]

Quote

Definitely, so you're saying that my FIRST priority is to make sure the dbag fits in my container correctly, and THEN adjust accordingly to make sure I can get the canopy into my dbag..

So my question now is, are there certain types of dbags, like shapes for the different containers? And then, within those types are different sizes for say a small velo vs. a 210 student canopy?

no, that is not what I said.

your container should come with a properly sized dbag. that is the dbag you should use with any canopy that you will be putting into that container.

[likestojump 3]

Quote

Check with your LOCAL rigger and I'm sure they will be glad (or at least won't refuse) to help you, as long as you provide beer.

Besides, you need to have them look at it anyway to guage it's airworthiness and tell you if it is a decent deal.

a rigger, being a person who rigs, packs, basically your nylon grease monkey - how the hell do they know what is a good deal ? Wouldn't a gear seller/reseller be a much more knowledgeable resource ? I could be wrong, but Dave DeWolf never mentioned anything about pricing and the gear market.

[NWFlyer 2]

Since this thread seems to have gotten a bit confused ... maybe I can simplify.

If you have a container, it should come with a deployment bag that is appropriately sized for that container. That deployment bag will fit a range of canopy sizes; how big that range is will depend on the canopy's shape, style, and pack volume. As an example, I'll use my own gear.

My container has held a Spectre (7-cell) 230 and a Pilot 210 (9-cell). Those canopies have almost identical pack volume, even though they are different sizes. Those were a tight fit, but they fit safely. I would not be able to put a canopy with a larger pack volume in this container.

I currently have a Pulse 210 in there (9-cell, but with low-bulk fabric on the bottom skin, so it packs smaller than the Pilot). The Pulse is "looser" in the bag than the Pilot was, but it is not even close to dangerously loose, and I was able to make sure that it safely fit by shortening my closing loop. I could safely put a 190 in there, and most likely a 170. Smaller than that and I'm probably going to need a smaller container/d-bag.

Risers come with demo canopies purely for convenience, as it is a lot easier/quicker to swap out risers than it is to unhook a canopy completely and reattach it to another set of risers.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[eightate8at8 0]

I definitely understand now, thanks for clearing that up.
I forgot that containers are sized with a range of canopies, say 120-135, so the dbag will accordingly fit those..

Thanks everyone!

[bigway 4]

Quote

I definitely understand now, thanks for clearing that up.
I forgot that containers are sized with a range of canopies, say 120-135, so the dbag will accordingly fit those..

Thanks everyone!

Correct.

.Karnage Krew Gear Store
.