henrik.anderson 0 #1 September 13, 2009 Is there anyone out there that have tried to jump a Velocity without setting the brakes? My right toggle did come lose in 2 of my jumps this weekend and now I'm wondering if it might be better not setting them at all? I tried not setting them on my Samurai and that was ok. Yes I know that I should take care of the break not sitting tight. :-) /Henrik Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain1976 0 #2 September 14, 2009 Here is a good thread about brake lines coming off. Lots of questions answered but not about leaving brakes off completely. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3666433;page=unread#unread Unless someone advises otherwise, I think the main reason we set them is to keep the canopy from surging on opening increasing the chance to fly into another jumper. There may also be a technical issue with it also but I would email PD with that question. Even though I jumped and packed the old rings & ropes deployment system years ago, I can't remember but I don't think we stowed the brakes. Maybe someone else can refresh my memoryYou live more in the few minutes of skydiving than many people live in their lifetime Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beatnik 2 #3 September 14, 2009 Canopies with rings and ropes reefing did still have the brakes set. At least on everything I have jumped. Setting the brakes usually gives a faster opening than when the brakes aren't set. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ficus 0 #4 September 14, 2009 It might be possible, but I do know of one guy at my DZ who had to chop his 96 after it was packed with the brakes unstowed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spindlee 0 #5 September 14, 2009 What sort of toggles do you have? The toggles on my micron have pins to help prevent that from happening. SimonIf in doubt, whip it out... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azureriders 0 #6 September 14, 2009 I have had packers pack my brakes unstowed. Yes I know I should do it myself. On a spectre at 1.4 : 1, the slowest opening ever experienced. On a safire I at 1.6 : 1, SLAMO. YMMV and obviously this does not answer your question specificly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jurgencamps 0 #7 September 14, 2009 Quote Unless someone advises otherwise, I think the main reason we set them is to keep the canopy from surging on opening increasing the chance to fly into another jumper. This is not the reason why you set your brakes. The reduced forward speed during/after the opening is only a byproduct. Brakes are set to force the air into the nose of the canopy in order to inflate it. The stabilizers left and right and the tail (which is pulled down) catch more air and direct this air into the nose of the canopy. So not setting the brakes will give you slower (to slow?) openings normally. Gr Jurgen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #8 September 14, 2009 You *could* jump it with the brakes unstowed; however, the canopy will take significantly longer to open. The canopy will also be much harder to control during the opening and will quickly spin up on you. Instead of throwing the baby out with the bathwater, what if you purchased new risers that had more secure toggles? Or perhaps you had the elastic replaced on the risers you currently own?--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peek 21 #9 September 14, 2009 Quote... I'm wondering if it might be better not setting them at all? The best thing would be to find out why your toggles are becoming unstowed on opening and solve that problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #10 September 14, 2009 Quote My right toggle did come lose in 2 of my jumps this weekend and now I'm wondering if it might be better not setting them at all? I tried not setting them on my Samurai and that was ok. Back to the basics. You should know why they are set for.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #11 September 14, 2009 How about Precision tandem mains that don't have a option to set them?Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #12 September 14, 2009 QuoteHow about Precision tandem mains that don't have a option to set them? That canopy was designed to be opened with the brakes unstowed. Even if it wasn't, at some point it was determined that leaving the brakes stowed was a better option, enough so that they now produce them with no provision to stow the brakes. The Velo was designed to be opened with the brakes stowed, and as far as I know PD still ships them with a cats-eye down near the bottom of the steering line. All signs point toward the OP fixing his toggle stowing problem. However, I would be interested to hear how it turns out if he does jump it with the brakes unstowed. Which brings up another question, if the canopy does spin up, will it spin faster because the brakes are unstowed? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Milo 0 #13 September 14, 2009 Quote Which brings up another question, if the canopy does spin up, will it spin faster because the brakes are unstowed? Beezy Shaw had this to say in 2005 about getting out of linetwists on an unbraked main: QuoteI have been asked about this a few times, so I thought I'd post this. Someone commented recently that their drop zone has had several tandem cutaways because of line twists on their Icarus (or Precision) tandems. These canopies do not have deployment brakes. While I can't really give an explanation as to "why" these dz's are having these (I do plenty of tandems and it is very very rare for me) I can offer a simple solution so that it doesn't result in chopping the main when line twists do occur on these canopies. Simply reach up and get the steering toggle that will turn the canopy in the direction it needs to turn in order to fly out of the line twist, and slowly pull that toggle to initiate a turn. The canopy will immediately correct itself. Just don't pull the control line down too quickly or pump the toggle, to avoid friction with the other lines. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1861474;#1861474 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #14 September 14, 2009 Can you see some drifting here? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
henrik.anderson 0 #15 September 14, 2009 Lovely to see some discussion. :-) I have V3 risers with the pin in the bottom and non elastic keepers. I have ordered a new lineset, someone suggested that changing lines would make my velo open better. And now I have to fix the toggles too. I have like 20 jumps on this velo and love it when it flies. But this weekend I did 5 jumps with one acceptable opening :-/ /Henrik Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cderham 0 #16 September 15, 2009 Might need new risers and toggles. I had a toggle come unstowed years ago on opening and in a deep discussion with Egon (blu-skyz) at Reletive workshop he stowed my break and toggle, grabbed my riser at the top and bottom then gave it a good snap. the tru-loc came right out and the brake almost came unstowed. He told me this is another check todo that will determine if I need new toggles. On a quick brisk hard opening it is possible for them to come unstowed if the toggles are wore or "broke in" to much. Chris It's Jimmy Time!! http://www.facebook.com/pages/Team-Fast-As-Fuck/6099474213 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
