Parachuting and employers

[BASE813 0]

I posted this in the BASE forum, but just wondered if any of you guys have had shit over your "parachute activity"

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well I returned to work for 2 days this week after 3+ months off as I really cant afford to live on Statutory Sick Pay.

I had a meeting with one of the directors about the fact I may require alot more time off due to some complications and further surgery and the discussion moved onto the acceptance of BASE with my company.

Apart from the fact of being told I have a 50/50 chance that I will be sacked with more time off sick (and its in my contract to say after 13 weeks this can be done) I was blatently told "if you BASE jump again, you will not have a job with us" - asking about skydiving they said it may have the same conclusion.

The director tried to go into the arguement about the risk of BASE compared to other sports, and I had to just stop the conversation and tell him I could debate for hours about this subject and the approach the company are taking towards me. It was not worth doing.

I know that within business you dont want "percieved" high risk........ I know that after 3+ months off I left them in shit and in the end my director is thinking about his situation........... I know its not personal.....

I have learnt my lesson that its better not to let people know know what I do........ even if you are friends with them, but if your actions may have an impact on them, then you may have to reconsider what you say to them.

I know people have issues with BASE and their jobs due other issues........ but I am curious if anyone has other issues like me where the corporate world where you would otherwise be a fundamental part of the workings of a department / company are actually disregarded due to the fact of your "hobby"

I never boasted, I never spoke to other people in the company about what I did, but I felt my boss was someone who I could tell about what I do, & they were ok with it until it went wrong.........

Let this be a warning, although you maybe a person that they deem valuable, they may actually turn round and deem your sport unacceptable to their corporate goals....

aint it a fucking shit!!!

anyway enough rant from me....... apologies......... but it pissed me off........

just curious thats all!

NB: replace BASE jumping with skydiving to make it more relevant to you if needs be, cause its the same to my bosses and maybe the same to yours...........

[yoink 321]

Just asked my MD....

he says "well I've not fired you for skydiving yet have I? As for BASE - I might fire you if you were stupid enough to tell me..."

my boss is cool.

[mr2mk1g 10]

If you are fired in the UK simply because you skydive, please go see an employment solicitor ASAP and have them file a claim with the employment tribunal for wrongful dismissal. You have a limited time in which to claim after you have been dismissed. As a skydiver you would have a very good claim for wrongful dismissal: you simply cannot be sacked for lawfully conducted sporting activities.

BASE has a few complications attached to it that don’t apply to skydiving which I’ve posted about in the BASE forum, but my advice would be the same – go see a lawyer. Your prospects of sucsess may differ a little but I would advise that it is definatly worth looking into. Think about a conditional fee arangement and look at your home insurance policy as this can often provide funding for certain litigation.

Don’t let yourself be bullied by an ignorant employer.

[metalslug 36]

One of our company directors skydives, usualy at the same DZ as me.
Some people play golf with the boss, I skydive with
the boss.

It's not all sunshine though, DZ politics and office politics have the potential to overlap with each other in uncomfortable ways.

[nacmacfeegle 0]

I'm a safety engineer, I manage risks and major accident hazards for offshore oil platforms, refineries, power stations, etc.
People in my business often look at me oddly when they find out about my weekend activities, but I just smile and draw parallels with oil production and skydiving, and the generally poor understanding (by the public) of the actual risks involved in both activities.
Its all about risk management, and an in depth understanding of the hazards, and consequences.

--------------------

He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[gordy 0]

I agree, contact a laywer, even if just to confirm your position

[pccoder 0]

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I agree, contact a laywer, even if just to confirm your position

Of course, it depends on where you live. Here in Florida (a right to work state) your employer can fire you because he doesn't like the way you look and give you no reason why he did it.

PcCoder.net

[gordy 0]

True....just that response was taking into account that he lives in the UK.

[rehmwa 2]

If it was me, I'd send an e-mail to him discussing the issue and request his position. You might get lucky and he'll respond via e-mail. Either way, now you have some kind of documentation.

In an at will employment situation, it's better to not give any reason for termination. With society being as litigious as it is, any reason is just ammo for the disgruntled employee. But outside (recreational) work activities is goofy as grounds, unless they are illegal and might be grounds for some kind of legal protection/response.

Frankly, much of the time I'd rather it not be known. I'm good at my job and want to be known for that at work, not as the 'skydiver'.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[turtlespeed 220]

My boss told me that if I got hurt - He'd killl me.

He's cool.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[ranchhand28 0]

I work in the peacekeeping department of the UN, where probably half of the staff has a military background, and have jumped out of airplanes quite a lot.

My deputy director has a piece of an old static line attached to his key chain! And small troffees and awards for military jumping given to him by the UK Army.

So, it's pretty okay that I skydive. They actually all gather around my computer to watch footage when there are good clips on dz.com! Hahaha!

I freackin' love my job!
T

[BASE813 0]

you lucky bastard...............

the corporate world sucks arse!

[lemonjelly 0]

I'm actually encouraged to Skydive.
apparently, they then won't need to pay me off, and it will make a good story for the newspaper

*************************************************
RED LIGHTS & OFF LANDINGS ARE JUST MY THANG
http://www.redlightrob.co.uk

[JohnnyD 0]

You're not in danger of being fired because you base jump. You're in danger of being fired because you're missing so much work. Employers generally could care less what you do with your free time unless it starts to overlap with your work obligations. Yours obviously has. You pays your money, you takes your chances. Hope you heal up.

[mr2mk1g 10]

Actually if you read his post his employers are saying they'll sack him simply for BASE jumping... posibly even for just skydiving.

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"if you BASE jump again, you will not have a job with us" - asking about skydiving they said it may have the same conclusion.

That's one of the reasons why their attitude is so atrocious.

[tigra 0]

Well, when I first started skydiving, like many new jumpers I was extremely open (obsessed?) about it and my boss hated it! Even tried to tell me that at certain times I could not go! (in my business, the end of the month is always busy!) At that company, I honestly think if I had gotten injured while jumping, they'd have found a way to fire me-legal or not.

When I left that job for a better (?) one, I decided to be a little more "low key" about it. Six months later, I was injured (broken ankle) and while I only took a week off and went back to work on crutches and pain meds (non weight bearing, too) my bosses made it pretty clear they felt I (and my injury) were a nuisance. (never mind that I could have done the same or worse playing softball, or just taking the stairs wrong!) They resented the time off for doctors appointments and PT, etc. They also made it clear that they thought I was nuts! (especially when I started jumping again) BUT, I also think the fact that I went right back to work instead of taking more time (which I probably should have) left a positive impression and possibly repaired some of the damage to my "reputation" that my skydiving injury caused. They've had other employees milk lesser injuries for way more time off than I took!

To some extent, it depends on the employer and what you do. But I think you hit it with this statement.

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Let this be a warning, although you maybe a person that they deem valuable, they may actually turn round and deem your sport unacceptable to their corporate goals....

Once you are sick or injured, you become less of an asset and more of a nuisance or liability- whether its a broken leg or cancer, or anything in between! Its politically incorrect to fire someone with cancer (not that it hasn't been done) but maybe firing an injured skydiver/ base jumper is somehow more acceptable!

Just my thoughts..... Good luck to you- I hope it works out!

maura

[EricTheRed 0]

Hey you!

I am also in Risk Management. My official title is Loss Control Consultant.

I always get a mixed response when people find out what I do for fun.

So for you are the only other Safety professional that I know that jumps.

Red

illegible usually

[JohnnyD 0]

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Actually if you read his post his employers are saying they'll sack him simply for BASE jumping... posibly even for just skydiving.

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"if you BASE jump again, you will not have a job with us" - asking about skydiving they said it may have the same conclusion.

That's one of the reasons why their attitude is so atrocious.

He has already missed three months and will likely miss a lot more - if you read the post. What would any reasonable person expect in this situation? I don't see how the employer's attitude is atrocious for attempting to prevent missed time. I have to agree with them. They have a filled position that has duties and responsibilities. If the person in that position is unable or incapable of fulfilling his or her duties and responsibilities, the employer should find someone who is.

[mr2mk1g 10]

His boss has specifically told him that if he BASE jumps again he will be sacked. He has hinted that if he skydives again he will also be sacked. How would you like it if your boss told you that if you did one more skydive you would be sacked? Do you think it is fair that your boss should wish to interfere in your personal time? Do you think it should be legal for your boss to interfere with what you do in your own time?

His post is not addressing being sacked for taking time off – it specifically states “apart from the fact… that I will be sacked with more time off”. His post is about the fact that his boss thinks it appropriate to regulate lawful activities such as skydiving carried out on his own time.

"if you BASE jump again, you will not have a job with us". Simple. The warning didn’t come with a rider about injury – it was simple: Jump and you’re sacked. That is atrocious.

[JohnnyD 0]

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His boss has specifically told him that if he BASE jumps again he will be sacked. He has hinted that if he skydives again he will also be sacked. How would you like it if your boss told you that if you did one more skydive you would be sacked? Do you think it is fair that your boss should wish to interfere in your personal time? Do you think it should be legal for your boss to interfere with what you do in your own time?

His post is not addressing being sacked for taking time off – it specifically states “apart from the fact… that I will be sacked with more time off”. His post is about the fact that his boss thinks it appropriate to regulate lawful activities such as skydiving carried out on his own time.

The warning didn’t come with a rider about injury – it was simple: Jump and you’re sacked. That is atrocious.

I think it is absolutely fair. The guy broke himself and has missed enormous amounts of work - 3 months off already is roughly 6 years of vacation time for most people and there is more down time to come. If the employer wants to attempt to prevent similar future occurrences of this, it seems quite reasonable. The guy should be happy he has a job to go back to. A lot of people wouldn't.

[rehmwa 2]

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Hey you!

I am also in Risk Management. My official title is Loss Control Consultant.

I always get a mixed response when people find out what I do for fun.

So for you are the only other Safety professional that I know that jumps.

Red

We have a local jumper (357-way team member) who's an OSHA employee.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[pilotdave 0]

I'm a system safety engineer for a helicopter company. Spent last week at a system safety conference... and of course brought my rig. Skipped out early one day to make a jump. Felt pretty strange walking by the conference rooms filled with people talking about risk management and all that with my rig.

My coworkers, who are mostly current or retired military helicopter pilots, seem to be pretty entertained by my skydiving. My boss is actually pretty interested. He was at the conference for one day with me, and when he heard I had been jumping he started asking a lot of questions about it. Spent most of the time talking about it. Sounds like he might even try it some day. During our staff meeting yesterday, he even brought it up, and not in a negative way. Voice over the speakerphone responded "I still haven't figured that one out yet. ...only bird shit and crazy people..."

Dave

[mr2mk1g 10]

You'd be happy if your boss told you that if you ever did a skydive again you would be sacked? Just in case you hurt yourself?

What if your boss told you that you were not allowed that nice powerful car you drove but you had to trade it in for a 1 litre model? Just in case you hurt yourself?

Where do you draw your line?

[JohnnyD 0]

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You'd be happy if your boss told you that if you ever did a skydive again you would be sacked? Just in case you hurt yourself?

What if your boss told you that you were not allowed that nice powerful car you drove but you had to trade it in for a 1 litre model? Just in case you hurt yourself?

Where do you draw your line?

I would draw it at insurability. Insurance is expensive if you can get it at all as a skydiver. There are other activities that will place you in the same arena as well. That's where I would draw the line as an employer. What an employee does on his own time is none of my business unless it becomes my business.

I don't know what the law in the UK is. Who knows, he may have a case if he gets fired. In some places in the US he may have a case, in some places he wouldn't. The fact that an employee can miss that much work and sue you for firing them is what kills businesses (except for law firms).

[MissMae 0]

I can see how taking massive amounts of time off due to injuring yourself doing your weekend activities (I'm assuming that you hurt yourself on a BASE jump), but I'm not really sure they can tell you that you can't BASE anymore because they don't like it, I mean - a stretch of course- but a golfer could get ping'd with a golf ball, and then what? I've been very lucky with injuries (knock on wood) and the only thing I had was a damaged iliosacral ligament in my lower back from a canopy collapse at about 20+ feet, but I showed up at work w/ crutches only a couple days later (didn't actually have to miss work), so they haven't seen skydiving really hindering my ability to do my job. My current boss tells me that I'm not allowed to let anything happen to me period because she doesn't want anyone else doing my job. She is really quite cool.

Good luck to you.

take the time to appreciate the people around you.