Mel Gibson's "Passion" film

[pajarito 0]

I copied a particular chapter from the e-book that I was talking about concerning this topic into a Word document and zipped it. It's very interesting and makes some good points. There is a section on the Versions.

[pajarito 0]

Whoops! Here it is again.

[LuvToFly 0]

That is some very interesting background info, and shows a lot more thought into this topic than one might have known!

In the end, though, of course, it is still about faith.. and that's okay because as previously stated, everyone has faith in someone, or, even faith in the absence of something -

"The helicopter approaches closer than any other to fulfillment
of mankind's ancient dreams of a magic carpet" - Igor Sikorsky

[pajarito 0]

True...You can't get away from the element of faith but I'm the type of person who likes as much hard info as I can get. That's my weakness. I believe it, though.

[pajarito 0]

Everybody becomes a Christian sooner or later!

[chuteless 1]

God did direct His WORD. You ask how He would then allow people to twist it nto their own private interpretations and re-write it.

God has given mankind a free choice to do things according to His commandments, or to reject His commandments and do things wrong.
a good example is you have the choice to kill people, or obey His laws and not kill people.

He gave you this choice. He also gave the choice to people like Zondervan who corrupts the WORD of God.

Whatever you, or Zondervan, or anyone else does, they will be held responsible.

As it says in His WORD:

let your heart ceer thee in the days of your youth, an walk in the ways of your heart, and in the sight of your eyes, BUT KNOW , that for ALL these things, God will bring thee into judgement. (Ecclesiastes 11:9)

You too, can re-write God's WORD, but you will be held accountabkle.

People have been corrupting God's WORD since the
very early days of history, and in referring to the WORD of God, that includes the Old Testament as well as the New.

The Apostle Paul wrote, : For we are not as many (people) who corrupt the WORD of God, but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God, we speak in Christ (Truth). (2nd Corinthians 2:17)


I dont think that God in reality favors one language over another, but it is a fact, that the English language is the Universal or International language of the world, and God made it so.

That too, has been directed from God, a part of His amazing plan for this world. It was not simply selected to be the Universal language on the whim of some man.

Even in aviation, if a Japan Air Lines plane flys into another foreign country, they sspeak ENGLISH to the tower. If a Russian plane flys into another foreign country..they speak ENGLISH, and this is the case anywhere in the world.

English is the Universal language in all countries.

It is a smal part of the rweason God's WORD was published in London, England first....the center of the world, and from there it could spread to the entire world.

Oh, you didnt know that London England is at the center of the world????

Well, it is situated on the Prime Meridian, exactly 12 hours from the International Dateline in either direction. the center of the 24 hour day.

Bill Cole

[LuvToFly 0]

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True...You can't get away from the element of faith but I'm the type of person who likes as much hard info as I can get. That's my weakness. I believe it, though.

Being a fellow IT person, I understand your need completely for hard info. It is the way us logically-trained folks are wired.

I guess what I am saying that the highway is only paved so far, and then stops. At that point, you have to make the leap of faith to complete the journey to the belief. And that is faith incarnate.

"The helicopter approaches closer than any other to fulfillment
of mankind's ancient dreams of a magic carpet" - Igor Sikorsky

[pajarito 0]

That's a nice theory. But, whew!!!, it's kind of a stretch. Even for me. I think the point of my Word doc, though, was that there's not enough difference in the version to make a difference. Especially in anything crucial to the authenticity of the religion. If anything, the versions support each other and add to the validity. I truly don't believe that language or version of the Bible (King James vs. NIV, etc) makes any difference whatsoever.

[pajarito 0]

I agree totally.

[chuteless 1]

In the NIV the publishers have ommitted or changed more than 65000 things. Some very crucial to the context of the original KJV. Some very crucial to the whole sacrifice that Jesus made.


It certainly does matter to me and others to whom put their trust in God's WORD.

Bill Cole

[WrongWay 0]

First, I'm not a Christian, and am not really interested in becoming one. However, I was raised Catholic so I know about the events in the film. I want to see it for two reasons....

1. Because it is shown realistically. I think the fact that he shows Jesus's (grammar?) suffering as brutal as it actually would have been will actually hit people with a "harsh reality check of faith" and perhaps even draw more people to the religion.

2. Because it's all in aramaic, that's such an excellent idea to go as far as reviving a dead language for realism, and I'd like to see how well it is done.

Wrong Way
D #27371 Mal Manera Rodriguez Cajun Chicken Ø Hellfish #451
The wiser wolf prevails.

[jaaska 0]

Oh... I hope this is a joke or something...

Please, tell me that you are just having a good time and that's the reason you're writing such BS.

I've been trying to understand and all, but clearly we see everything (not just religion) just in fundamentally different way that there is really no point of starting to argue about e.g. the role of English language in the world...

Did you know that there are quite a few languages that come before English if you start to count what languages people speak as their mother tongue?

English is not DIVINE language, trust me...

[chuteless 1]

no one claimed it was a divine language...it IS the International Language of the world. Like it or not..

Of course there were many languages before the advent of English, but before the Tower of Babel, there was only one language in the world...dont exactly know what it was, but only ONE(Genesis 11:1)

Bill Cole ( and it is not a "joke" or something)

[jaaska 0]

Ok... I see were you stand - not that it makes ANY sense to me, but I see where you stand.

[wink 0]

well hello all, my first post here, what a way to start eh? I was just reading through this thread and noticed some misinformation being spread about. Namely the statement that the King James version of the bible isn't copyrighted. That is just plain wrong, in fact IIRC it wasn't until the colonies claim of independence was a version of the bible printed here due to copyright laws.

some info

and the search that produced it

[chuteless 1]

Sorry, but there IS NO COPYRIGHT on the King James version of the Bible. I believe there is one onthe NEW KJV, but it also includes changes from the Authorized (by King James ) version.

[pajarito 0]

Examples?

[Ripple 0]

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God did direct His WORD. You ask how He would then allow people to twist it nto their own private interpretations and re-write it.

God has given mankind a free choice to do things according to His commandments, or to reject His commandments and do things wrong.
a good example is you have the choice to kill people, or obey His laws and not kill people.

Ok, so God gave us free choice. Well, the thing I don't understand is why give us free choice if:
a) God is going to influence our lives anyway and so only allowing us free choice in certain circumstances, as illustrated by your:

Quote

I dont think that God in reality favors one language over another, but it is a fact, that the English language is the Universal or International language of the world, and God made it so.

If this is the case, and I personally don't believe it, then its a bloody good example of God meddling, influencing and thus not allowing us free choice, surely?

and, b) we're going to be 'condemned' if we make the 'wrong' choice? Why not just make us so we always make the right choice? What's the point otherwise? Sounds like God enjoys a bit of sadism on the side

Next Mood Swing: 6 minutes

[wink 0]

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Therefore, it is no surprise that the title page of the New Testament of the original edition of the KJV reads, at the bottom, Cum Privilegio, Latin words which literally mean "with privilege" or "right"; that is, with the right of reproduction retained, or, in a word, "copyrighted."

That's an excerpt from here . I'm not sure how you can say that it isn't copyrighted when everything else seems to indicate the opposite. Instead of just immediately throwing away what I'm typing, go read it, you might just learn something new.

[North95 0]

Weren't we talking about Mel Gibson's "Passion" film?

North

Repetition does not transform a lie into a truth.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

[pajarito 0]

I'd refer you to my document attached in a previous post. It lists a whole bunch of passages from several different versions and does comparisons.

[sdgregory 0]

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I twisted nothing. It is you who has taken to heart only the bits you wish to be defined

Really? And you know this how? Have you and I had an in depth discussion of my views of what is said in the Bible? How is it that you know EXACTLY what I think without me telling you? Are you that arrogant?Do you know my life story? Do you have one inkling of insight into what led me to a life of faith? Have you walked in my shoes, seen what I've seen, lost what I've lost, gained what I've gained, and done what I have done? Have you any clue of the peaks and valleys of my life? My joys? My Sorrows? My hopes and fears? What part of my life do you even remotely have any clue to? Please oh almighty seer and knower of all things pertaining to me, enlighten us on your great and vast knowledge. Show us your power. (I hope you sense the sarcasm because I am laying it on thick.)

You say that to read the Bible with an open mind means that you will come to a conclusion that it is false. You have no idea why, where, how or in what state MY mind was in before, during or after I read it.
Reading it with an open mind means you will draw your own conclusions.

For your information, I read the Bible to DISCREDIT it in a five year attempt to show my wife that she was following RELOGION in a blind, small minded point of view. I went into it BELIEVE, hell, KNOWING it was a book written by men and trasnlated into a set of mind controlling laws to control the masses and keep them uninformed. What I found in the end was truth. I went in with a CLOSED mind thinking "This is crap." and walked out with an open mind of the love God has for me. Instead of being told what to believe (true or false) I walked out with my own beliefs. I did not become a true free thinker until that moment.

Do not be so arrogant as to assume that you know my life, and my state of mind. It shows how much of a fool you are. Anyone who does not think as you do is not a free thinker? That's your stance? I freely choose to think differently than you. That makes me a free thinker. I freely choose to go the way that is right for my life. That makes me a free thinker. I freely choose to believe, live, act, speak and love in the way I believe to be right. That is free thinking. I freely profess my faith in God without care of the way people like you talk or think about me. That is free thinking.

Yes, I accepted the scriptures on faith after reading them. Because logically, it made sense to my free thinking mind. If that makes me weakminded in the eyes of someone I neither know, see, nor enjoy the company of, fine. I will let you know when I loose sleep over it. Don't hold your breath. In fact, if any of my friends decided they did not want to be friends with me because of my beliefs, I would still believe that way freely. I will not succumb to peer pressure to change my mind. That makes me a free thinker.


Furthuremore, your response does not discount my original statement. You still took scripture out of context and twisted it to your own ends. And I know this because I see what you said it meant and I look at what it says in context with the chapter it is in and any fool can see you are missing (deliberately or otherwise) the key point of that part of Acts. My response to that still stands.

As far a BLINDLY accepting it as faith. There again you are wrong. Many times in scriptures, God says "Come let us REASON together." He does not want blind automatons. God wants people who know what they believe and why. That hardly is BLIND faith. He wants people who can say what they believe, why they believe it and why it is right. HE wants people who can effectively bring others to know Him. That cannot be done blindly.

And according to those Scriptures, YOU are the one who is Blind. That is not from me, that is from God. So don't shoot the messenger.

On second thought, go ahead and shoot me so I can go home.

[North95 0]

I've got a better way to go home. Have a brawl with a coworker. I tried that yesterday, got suspended and sent home!

North

Repetition does not transform a lie into a truth.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

[pajarito 0]

Yeah...but did you win???

[North95 0]

Not much of a brawl, I was exaggerating. He grabbed my scrubs, then made a fist, I grabbed his shirt and tie, then I think we stood down.

But we were BOTH suspended, after being banished to different parts of the hospital, then writing statements. Then "escorted" from hospital.

All firsts.

North