OK Serious Topic Here: How many of YOU are between the ages of 18 and 26? Are YOU ready to go to WAR?

[MarkM 0]

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You may want to look a little harder... the military, specifically ground forces, are way over committed.

I guess this is why we got our ass kicked in Iraq....

[crapflinger2000 1]

I was in the Marine Reserves for 6x2, in an arty unit.

We were "alerted" twice for possible activation, once for Bosnia, and once for when things were looking REALLY bad with N Korea (this was 94-95).

I was not that fired up about going to either, Korea would be just ugly ugly ugly, and I did not enlist to perform peacekeeping ops. But I would have gone, since my uniform said "USMC", not "USMC Only When I Agree"

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What would Vic Mackey do?

[benny 0]

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You may want to look a little harder... the military, specifically ground forces, are way over committed.

I guess this is why we got our ass kicked in Iraq....

Good try but what happens when a real war arises while all those troops are over there fighting the second battle in the "war on terrorism"?

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[JohnRich 4]

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the US Congress is in the process of having the draft re-enacted. This draft would be for ALL people, MALE AND FEMALE between the ages of 18 and 26. If you are in college and are drafted, you will be able to finish your current academic semester and then would be considered ACTIVE DUTY after that.

So you want to live your life in America, enjoying all of its freedoms and prosperity, but you're not willing to serve your country for a few years in a time of national crisis.

If threats and fighting got so bad that the current armed forces couldn't handle the job, and a draft was necessary, I have confidence that enough young people will step forward to do the job. Even if you don't.

That's a wonderful attitude you have there.

Note that the Bills provide for alternative civilian service - you wouldn't necessarily be in the military.

You women wanted equal rights, and this gives it to you. You can step up and serve your country like the men have been doing for hundreds of years.

"Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country."
- John F. Kennedy

[wmw999 2,440]

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Damnit, I was just gonna write something like this. Right on, I'm glad to know I'm not the only one

I think it's a wonderful idea. Not just because the country gets all that young energy, but also because all those energetic young kids would get to spend a year or two learning how to be grown ups in a mildly sheltered environment.

When they're not deployed and/or being shot at, the military is a little sheltered; housing and food are provided, so you can't really fall behind on your rent. Clothing is pre-selected, and you KNOW you have a job. And no one calls your parents when you mess up, you have to deal with the fallout yourself.

Great idea.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[crapflinger2000 1]

See my previous posts and junk, I am not a lilly-livered pansy, etc etc.

But I am always amazed when people paint the Iraq war as some stupendous military operation. Not to cast aspersions on the efforts of our guys in the military right now, but the Iraqi military basically melted away and either gave up or fought as irregulars.

Don't get all hissy-fitty. I know there were some REAL honest to god firefights and real fighting in some places, but some people equate the drive to Baghdad with the Soviet drive on Berlin or the breakout in Normandy, and there is just NO comparison...

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What would Vic Mackey do?

[Nightingale 0]

seemed to me like the post you quoted was simply reporting what was going on rather than offering an opinion...

[jdhill 0]

I guess that why we have been asking for troops from other countries... why the country is still not stabilized... why the Iraqi army was allowed to just drift away into the desert... why we did the capture and release thing... yada, yada, yada...

Or maybe that's why our doctrine keeps canging... was a two front war, then it was two major regional conflicts, now if one major regional conflict and a small one...

What happens when North Korea moves South, China makes a move on Tiawan, or Rummy decides he want to take on Iran and Syria at the same time (don't believe he's not thinking about it)?

Too many irons in the fire, and not enough resources.

J

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke

[benny 0]

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So you want to live your life in America, enjoying all of its freedoms and prosperity, but you're not willing to serve your country for a few years in a time of national crisis.

It's not the serving my country, but the national crisis part that I have a problem with. Where's the crisis? In Iraq?

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[JohnRich 4]

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what happens when a real war arises while all those troops are over there fighting the second battle in the "war on terrorism"?

Would you prefer to allow the terrorists free territory in which they can plan and organize their terrorist acts against our homeland?

You should have noticed by now, that the fight against terrorism is over there, and not on our own soil. If we pull out over there, they'll be striking us at home.

Which would you prefer?

And just because some troops are fighting in Afghan and Iraq, does not mean that we can't fight a second battle elsewhere if necessary.

Even though your good buddy Clinton was the one who downsized the military. And your good buddy John Kerry voted against nearly every modern piece of military hardware currently being used to fight effectively and spare American lives.

[MarkM 0]

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Good try but what happens when a real war arises while all those troops are over there fighting the second battle in the "war on terrorism"?

Real war? Iraq is the only type of "real war" we'll be seeing anytime soon.

No one can invade us, we'd nuke their homeland and 125 million people own guns in this country. Any external flame-ups are first going to go through a fun debate orgy at the UN. We'd have time to shift around our external troops.

It's quality, not quantity. That's why we lost 500-ish troops in Iraq and they lost way way way more.

[JohnRich 4]

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It's not the serving my country, but the national crisis part that I have a problem with. Where's the crisis? In Iraq?

There isn't one yet. But if there was, having a draft structure in place might be convenient, to quickly mobilize large numbers of troops. You want to have that process set up in advance, instead of waiting until it's too late.

We already require young males to register with the draft. Do you think that is unnecessary?

[JohnRich 4]

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Post the (reputable)links that show Congress is trying to pass this.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:s.00089:

[crapflinger2000 1]

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And just because some troops are fighting in Afghan and Iraq, does not mean that we can't fight a second battle elsewhere if necessary.

Joking right? Tell me you are kidding> Yes, we can fight an effective 2 front war, as long as one of them involves Nukes.

Well not quite that bad, but getting there...

Tell you what, without the draft, the military reserves are going to see (and are now beginning to see) a major exodus.

Reserves are a MAJOR part of the overall force structure. Therefore, they are constantly deployed, away from their families, and overall are jerked around with constantly extended tours. We are taking NG armour brigades, giving them shake and bake MP classes and sending them over. How many of those guys are going to re-up?

We are massively over extended right now, between Iraq, Afghanistan, Europe, Balkans, and the Korean Peninsula.

__________________________________________________
What would Vic Mackey do?

[jdhill 0]

All that says is has been in committe since 1/7/03

Not a very active push...

J

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke

[MarkM 0]

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http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d108:s.00089:

A bill introduced by a senator doesn't mean anything. I once saw a senator introduce a bill calling for a 1000% tax increase on 9mm ammo, because he personally had a thing against guns.

That doesn't mean Congress supported it.

[osuskydiver 0]

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Tell you what, without the draft, the military reserves are going to see (and are now beginning to see) a major exodus.

Thats what I said. I agree totally with your opinion.

With all the deployments and troop rotations going on, the kids who signed up to be in the army for college money are not going to re-up.

When this mass exodus hits, and not enough people are willing to serve, I can definately see some kind of draft.

By the time you read this you have already read it.

[benny 0]

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You should have noticed by now, that the fight against terrorism is over there, and not on our own soil. If we pull out over there, they'll be striking us at home.

Which would you prefer?

Is it really "over there" John, or is that just where they (the Bush admin) have directed our attention? Where did 9-11 take place? Baghdad? Where were those terrorist living, 1, 2 years prior to the attack? What nationality were they? Not Iraqi, I can tell you that much.

The terrorists strikes have little to do with military presence John, except for the fact that said presence seems to be inducing the threat of terrorism in Iraq itself.

What would I prefer, I'd prefer we go after the actual terrorists in a manner that might actually work rather than promoting more terrorists, or adopting a foreign policy that would make more people like us rather than hate us. That's what I'd prefer. I'd also prefer that Americans stopped being such pansies and recognized that every now and then people are gonna get pissed off and bomb something and there's really not much of anything we can do to stop it, particularly not giving up our own civil liberties in the name of security.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[countryscrub 0]

well im 26 and if they need me ill go ...but ill probably spend my day in the brig... i not real big on being yelled at and spit on... but heck what ever i need to do for my country ill do my best...heck i just hope i can jump as much as now.

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i used to do alot of things ....skydiving wont be one of them :)

[billvon 2,990]

>If we pull out over there, they'll be striking us at home.

Don't know if you noticed a failed Ricin attack on Congress a while back . . .

You won't reduce US terrorism by killing lots of arabs. Check out how well that's working for Israel.

>And just because some troops are fighting in Afghan and Iraq, does
>not mean that we can't fight a second battle elsewhere if necessary.

Uh, that would be a _third_ battle. I know, Afganistan is old news, but there's still a war going on over there - and we're still fighting Al Qaeda. Perhaps we might want to concentrate on that before we invade North Korea.

[NoShitThereIWas 0]

First of all JohnRich, I did not say I would not support my country in a time of "NEED". Second of all, I am 30 years old, have a three year old daughter and am her last surviving parent. I couldn't join the military if I wanted to and I doubt very seriously I WOULD get drafted but if I "HAD" to defend my country's "national security interests", I would. I plan on going into some type of profession where that is the case. However, you missed the point of my post and bear in mind that this draft does not pertain to me.

My purpose for making this post was to get people to THINK and especially those who are younger to be AWARE of what is going on around them.

Next, I questioned what the WAR is really about. If the WAR is on TERRORISM which was enacted after we were attacked on 9/11, why are we over in IRAQ?

Funny, I thought it was AlQuieda and Osama Bin Laden who planned and carried out 9/11. I also recall that Bin Laden wanted to assassinate Hussein because due to his secular regime.

I think it is important for people to know where we are headed. If we are declaring ourselves in a ""permanent" state of war on terrorism, permanent seems to be a VERY LONG time. I think there are things we needed to accomplish in Iraq but I also think we need to think about where this is taking us. Where are we going with this and what impact will it have on our country, the human death toll, the economy and international relations? There is a lot else at stake with how we act and other countries are seeing us. We are not the only ones out there in the world who "matter".

Just so you know, I am very patriotic about our country but I do question authority and I am skeptical about politicians in general.

Roy Bacon: "Elvises, light your fires."

Sting: "Be yourself no matter what they say."

[lawrocket 3]

This is one of the problems, and you've hit the nail on the head.

Throughout the service you will find an exodus of troops. The Reserves in particular.

Due to the Vietnam War, the policy makers decided that they could not go to war without public approval. Thus, key logistic support became the job of the Reservists. You cannot go to war without the Reserves. You cannot deploy the Reserves without public support. It is that simple.

Now is the first TRUE test of that doctrine. It also shows some weaknesses in the system in human personality. We are now fighting an enemy unlike any other. I don't know if our doctrine was set up to deal with that.

Draft? I don't know. Scary concept, in a way. Necessary? Maybe. I hope not.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[osuskydiver 0]

spit on? what kind of basic training are you talking about? I was never spit on.

Basic and AIT, as tough as they were, I will never forget and never regret. It shaped me into a great person and I met some people who I will stay in contact with the rest of my life.

By the time you read this you have already read it.

[NoShitThereIWas 0]

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Even though your good buddy Clinton was the one who downsized the military. And your good buddy John Kerry voted against nearly every modern piece of military hardware currently being used to fight effectively and spare American lives.

With all do respect, didn't John Kerry earn a purple heart for being wounded in Vietnam? What was your "buddy" Bush's service record like during Vietnam? I heard it wasn't too pretty even after Daddy who was head of the CIA pulled lots of strings for him ... Like I said earlier, I am not a Democrat, but I think I know who I will be voting for in 2004.

Roy Bacon: "Elvises, light your fires."

Sting: "Be yourself no matter what they say."

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[NoShitThereIWas 0]

Also, I do agree with what Gork says here but I believe that Americans should have a choice. Be it at home on National Soil or Away.

Roy Bacon: "Elvises, light your fires."

Sting: "Be yourself no matter what they say."