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[AggieDave 6]

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Islam is a religious lifestyle, not just a quick Sunday morning church visit and a label

So is Christianity. That is how it is taught and those are the examples used in the New Testiment. However, that is not how it is truely followed in the US. That's not the fault of the religion, that's really the fault of the followers. Has to do with US culture and if the person is like that as a Baptist, then they'll be like that as a Muslim, or a Hindu, or anything else they might go to.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[happythoughts 0]

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Islam is a religious lifestyle, not just a quick Sunday morning church visit and a label

So is Christianity. That is how it is taught and those are the examples used in the New Testiment. However, that is not how it is truely followed in the US. That's not the fault of the religion, that's really the fault of the followers.

It is nice that someone can make the blanket statement that their religion is more faithful to its beliefs than the others or somehow more moral.

It's good troll material, but has little basis in fact.

[ACMESkydiver 0]

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I guess I am kind of harsh in that statement, I really don't have a problem with spirituality or religion, except when people let thier "faith" do thier thinking for them.

These people can't manage thier day-to-day lives without thier "faith" dictating (or "guiding") thier actions.

Um...gee, Dumpster...that's what a walk of faith is designed to do, you silly! Faith = belief in the unseen and the path that the unseen is meaning you to follow...

~Jaye
Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action.

[Guest]

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The practice is almost totally different from the teachings.

Not me. I'm a dyslexic, agnostic, insomniac. I stay up at night wondering if there really is a dog.

"I thought I was a sadomasochistic necrophiliac into beastiality...

...then I realized I was just beating a dead horse."

"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[Skyrad 0]

Hey just pointing out a couple of facts, draw your own conclusions. As church attendences fall in this country social decay is increasing that is a fact.
If people no longer belive in God and an afterlife and moral and social responsibility are not taught in the home or the school then why keep the law? If its possible to break them and get away with it with instant gratification, why not?

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[zyne 0]

I think you're missing the point here bud ... Just because you are spiritual and believe in an invicible man in the sky doesnt make you any better than me or anyone else.
My point is you don't have to be spiritual and believe in god to show respect towards another person or be responsible.
I for instance actually had quite a bit of religious involvement when I was younger but it never made any sense to me. Instant gratification? I don't think I can apply that to myself.
Regardless of spiritualism I think a criminal is a criminal is a criminal. It doesnt matter if you have "found god" or not. It is ones actions that should judge the person, not their belief!

[zyne 0]

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If people no longer belive in God and an afterlife and moral and social responsibility are not taught in the home or the school then why keep the law?

I don't see how this can become a legal matter. So I guess you're saying that if you don't believe in god you're a criminal? I guess I need to go to jail, go directly to jail and not collect 200 dollars.
Is it just me or does anyone else think that statement is absurd? I don't believe in god and yet, I'm not in prison, I don't step on the wrong side of the law, I have moral, I take my responsibility and I try to treat my fellow man in the same fashion as I would like them to treat me. La dee daa .. Let me call up the closest county jail and confess my sins since that's where I belong.
Your statement is ridiculous!

[happythoughts 0]

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why keep the law? If its possible to break them and get away with it with instant gratification, why not?

Because it's wrong? I am not spiritual/religious in the slightest. I understand what is right/wrong.

I think it is a problem when adults let someone else define what is moral for them.

[jlmiracle 7]

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If people no longer belive in God and an afterlife and moral and social responsibility are not taught in the home or the school then why keep the law?

I don't see how this can become a legal matter. So I guess you're saying that if you don't believe in god you're a criminal? I guess I need to go to jail, go directly to jail and not collect 200 dollars.
Is it just me or does anyone else think that statement is absurd? I don't believe in god and yet, I'm not in prison, I don't step on the wrong side of the law, I have moral, I take my responsibility and I try to treat my fellow man in the same fashion as I would like them to treat me. La dee daa .. Let me call up the closest county jail and confess my sins since that's where I belong.
Your statement is ridiculous!

I agree 100% with you. Isn't it up to the parents to raise their children to be morally and socially responsible. If we are only to learn this in church, we would be in a lot worse shape.

Judy

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[zyne 0]

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If people no longer belive in God and an afterlife and moral and social responsibility are not taught in the home or the school then why keep the law?

I guess you're saying that if you don't believe in god you're a criminal? I guess I need to go to jail, go directly to jail and not collect 200 dollars.
Is it just me or does anyone else think that statement is absurd? I don't believe in god and yet, I'm not in prison, I don't step on the wrong side of the law, I have moral, I take my responsibility and I try to treat my fellow man in the same fashion as I would like them to treat me. La dee daa .. Let me call up the closest county jail and confess my sins since that's where I belong.
Your statement is ridiculous!

I agree 100% with you. Isn't it up to the parents to raise their children to be morally and socially responsible. If we are only to learn this in church, we would be in a lot worse shape.

Judy

I would certainly think so. If you really want to talk about respect and moral just look at Ireland and all the bloody bombings. Hows that for respect or morals? Look at balcan and the war there, respect? Moral? I don't think so. Look at the lack of stability in Israel and Gaza, moral, respect? I don't think so.
There is more blood spilled in the name of religion than for any other reason and you talk about how society is decaying as a result of people losing their faith? Yet another absurd statement. Loss of moral and respect is NOT a result of lack of spiritualism. On the contrary, had it not been for religion there is a good chance the disturbing pictures we see on the night news never had to be seen.
I'm not saying religion is to blame for this, I'm saying peoples interpretation of it is. And I'm also saying that anyone believes that the lack of religion causes moral decay needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Religious folks are to blame for just as much of the moral decay as an atheist!

by the way, finally someone who approaches this issue without a blindfold, thank you!!

[Blahr 0]

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I agree 100% with you.

by the way, finally someone who approaches this issue without a blindfold, thank you!!

Ahhh, so only people that agree with you 100% are approaching the issue without a blindfold.

I do believe that several posters in this thread had valid points, not just the ones that agree with you.

[Zenister 0]

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The practice is almost totally different from the teachings.

Not me. I'm a dyslexic, agnostic, insomniac. I stay up at night wondering if there really is a dog.

"I thought I was a sadomasochistic necrophiliac into beastiality...

...then I realized I was just beating a dead horse."

omg.. thats fucking hilarious...

____________________________________
Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed.

[zyne 0]

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I agree 100% with you.

by the way, finally someone who approaches this issue without a blindfold, thank you!!

Ahhh, so only people that agree with you 100% are approaching the issue without a blindfold.

I do believe that several posters in this thread had valid points, not just the ones that agree with you.

Nope, I'm not saying that because she agreed with me. I said it because it was presented in a manor that was fair towards either "side" and without bullshit.
Also, there are valid points in here I don't agree with but I value as well. Just because you have a disagreement doesnt mean you cant learn from them yanno. Its the straight up ludicrist comments that are attacks on atheists/agnostics that pisses me off.
My other half is christian and does the whole church thing and even though we don't see eye to eye on that we haven't killed each other yet. Correction, I'm the atheist so I guess that should read "I havent killed her yet" LOL ...

[Blahr 0]

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I agree 100% with you.

by the way, finally someone who approaches this issue without a blindfold, thank you!!

Ahhh, so only people that agree with you 100% are approaching the issue without a blindfold.

I do believe that several posters in this thread had valid points, not just the ones that agree with you.

Nope, I'm not saying that because she agreed with me. I said it because it was presented in a manor that was fair towards either "side" and without bullshit.
Also, there are valid points in here I don't agree with but I value as well. Just because you have a disagreement doesnt mean you cant learn from them yanno. Its the straight up ludicrist comments that are attacks on atheists/agnostics that pisses me off.
My other half is christian and does the whole church thing and even though we don't see eye to eye on that we haven't killed each other yet. Correction, I'm the atheist so I guess that should read "I havent killed her yet" LOL ...

Your comment implied that only this one person (finally, someone without a blindfold) was not wearing blinders.

This, in turn, implies that everyone else IS wearing them.

However, if you were to refer back to my comments much earlier in the thread you will see why I took exception to the notion that we are all wearing blinders. I neither supported nor defended any specific religeon, but rather, I implied that mankinds woes, both here and abroad, are the result of human nature and our inability to master our own passions, rather than any church or belief system.

[zyne 0]

I may have missed your post stating that or I skimmed it, that's my bad.
I wasnt trying to generalize anything or anyone with that comment. I was basically just stating the fact that I thought it was direct and to the point, that's all.

[Blahr 0]

AND MINE WASNT???!



Sorry, I'm just yankin yer chain at this point.
Strange as it sounds, even though you are an athiest and I'm not, we seem to be pretty much in agreement

[zyne 0]

I guess I actually had to read it in order to make a statement pertaining to said post's direct value to me LOL. I'm looking for it here dammit, give a brotha some time ... hehehe

[zyne 0]

I missed the last two lines on this one LOL ..

Religious values should not be a determining factor as to whether you can agree with someone. That part has to do with values and that to me has nothing to do with religion!

[rehmwa 2]

I've always considered religion a means of laying out basic rules for conduct. It evolved into something spiritual. (i.e., don't eat certain foods, why? they didn't stay fresh way back when. how did it manifest itself? people got sick and died. What did the wise people say? Don't eat that or God will smite you.) OK, it's a food example, but extend the thought to behaviors such as killing, stealing, etc. They served real purposes and gave many people a basis for interaction (=morals). Also gave people a comfort zone for dealing with death.

I think religion can provide great strength and comfort and moral training for many. I respect those quietly religious types.

It's not for me as it doesn't add up. But others can do what they want. We can all admire the 'righteous' man. Just not the 'self-righteous' man. Religiously speaking.

Now the idea of the world-wide organized structure of the 'church' (any type) I just consider a power structure like any political party and subject to corruption.

Simply:

- praying/self reflection/meditation/self understanding = good

- organizations bent on controlling the ignorant populace and telling them how to think and be and, by the way, please overpopulate at a rate faster than the other organized religions = bad

or more simply, there's a difference between faith, religion, values and church

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Vertifly 0]

I'm not much for religious debates. Not much of a believer in congregational homage toward a god or The God - or whatever is considered to be "correct" in your eyes.

However, I will admit to the disbelief that it is unfair for a group of human beings to restrict the physical appearence, diet, sleep, work, leisure, sexuality, time, or whatever...etc. Everyone is different. It should be up to the individual how to live ones life. As it should be up to the that same individual to be disciplined, moral and ethical, considerate, generous, integral, health-conscious, etc.

As for posting a religious message on this forum (by a 2nd time post-er)...yes, that is a bit arrogant. Very few people here need to be imposed upon concerning your beliefs. Frankly, I doubt many of us would look favorably upon the unsolicited knowledge of your religion. Remember, often times, being descrete is a spiritual value as well.

Since I've read your imposition... Here, you can read mine:

"I do good then I feel good. I do bad then I feel bad." -A.L.

Why does it have to be more detailed than that???

[Blahr 0]

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disciplined, moral and ethical, considerate, generous, integral, health-conscious, etc.

What about oral hygiene??!?

[Vertifly 0]

I believe that falls under "health-consciousnes". heheh Nice try my friend.

[Skyrad 0]

Reread what I wrote and you will see that at no time did I claim to be better than anyone else. Show me anywhere that I've said anything derogatory about atheists. I haven't. If you actualy had read and understood what was written you would have seen that I said that morality and social responsibility can be taught in the home or the school not just in a place of worship. Even a limited understanding of the social issues and contempary criminology in Britan today may have helped you understand the argument that you totaly missed. To judge Ireland and the Irish by the actions of a few terrorists is offensive and is the dangerous type of attitude that labels all Muslims terrorists because of the actions of a few twisted individuals. Quite frankly your argument shows a gross lack of understanding of the people and regions that you use as examples.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[rinard 0]

I don't outbid on Islam. Islam a brilliant religion by itself and doesn't need any preaching or missionary work or me.
We cay say there are so many sects, cults, religions, philosophies, and movements in the world, all of which claim to be the right way or the only true path to God. How can one determine which one is correct or if, in fact, all are correct? The method by which the answer can be found is to clear away the superficial differences in the teachings of the various claimants to the ultimate truth, and identify the central object of worship to which they call, directly or indirectly. Can we either claim that all men are Gods or that specific men were God or that nature is God or that God is a figment of man's imagination.

It may be argued that all religions teach good things so why should it matter which one we follow. I made some searching and I couldn’t find a sharp answer but I found something interesting stated in the Koran:
Creation-worship is the greatest sin that man can commit because it contradicts the very purpose of his creation. Man was created to worship Allah alone, consequently, the worship of creation, which is the essence of idolatry, is the only unforgivable sin. One who dies in this state of idolatry has sealed his fate in the next life. This is not an opinion, but a revealed fact stated by Allah in his final revelation to man:
"Verily Allah will not forgive the joining of partners with Him, but He may forgive (sins) less than that for whom so ever He wishes"(Soorah An- Nisaa 4:48 and 116)

Buddha was a reformer who introduced a number of humanistic principles to the religion of India. He did not claim to be God nor did he suggest to his followers that he be an object of worship. Yet, today most Buddhists who are to be found outside of India have taken him to be God and prostrate to idols made in their perception of his likeness.

This is also what I found regarding Racism in Quran:

The noblest of you in the sight of Allah*, is the most pious (righteous) of you” (Qur'an 49:13).


As a result of following these teachings, many people have banished racism from their thoughts and actions. You can still see racial harmony today in the mosques of cosmopolitan cities. You will find people of various colors worshipping together, all with equal status before God. Rich or poor, black or white, kind or pauper all line up side by side to worship. No special preference is given to anyone based on color or social status. The leader in a mosque is appointed for his learning in the religious sciences, regardless of skin color. There is no such concept as a 'black mosque' or 'white mosque'. Islam removes such destructive concepts.


This is not an assault on Christianity or any other religion. It is indispensable for me to look for the truth and study comparative religion because if I would like to know whether a religion is true or false, I should not depend on my emotions, feelings, or traditions. Rather, I should depend on my reason and intellect. When God sent the prophets, He supported them with miracles and evidences, which proved that they were truly prophets, send by God and that the religion they came with was true.


God revealed a holy book to Jesus called the Injeel, some parts of which may be still available in the teachings of God to Jesus in the New Testament. But this does not mean that the Bible we have today because it is not the original scriptures that were revealed by God. They underwent alterations, additions, and omissions. This was also said by the Committee charged with revising The Holy Bible (Revised Standard Version). This Committee consisted of thirty-two scholars who served as members of the Committee. They secured the review and counsel of an Advisory Board of fifty representatives of the co-operating denominations. The Committee said in the Preface to The Holy Bible (Revised Standard Version), p. iv, “Sometimes it is evident that the text has suffered in transmission, but none of the versions provides a satisfactory restoration. Here we can only follow the best judgment of competent scholars as to the most probable reconstruction of the original text.
The Committee also said in the Preface, p. vii, Notes are added which indicate significant variations, additions, or omissions in the ancient authorities (Mt 9.34; Mk 3.16; 7.4; Lk 24.32, 51, etc.).

My question is do we believe in the information declared in the following sites or not:

THE REAL STORY OF MARY
http://geocities.com/SoHo/Gallery/3001/storyofmary.htm

THE TRUTH ABOUT JESUS
http://sultan.org/articles/Jesus.html

Who Was Jesus According to Jesus?
http://www.islaminfo.com

IS THE BIBLE GODS WORD?
http://www.jamaat.net/bible/Bible1-3.html

Women in Christianity and Islam
http://www.beconvinced.com/women/CH_IS.htm

The Bible - A Closer Look!
http://www.todayislam.com/bible.htm

[zyne 0]

First of all, I lived in europe for 20 years, I've seen some of the shit first hand as I've travelled.
Second, if you in any way can contend the fact that there has been more blood spilled in the name of religion than anything else, you are a bit .... WRONG!
Think about this, how many wars have we had in the name of atheism ... I'm thinking .. ZERO!
How far do I need to go back?? How about the crusades? Lets shove our religion down these peoples throats. I mean, pick up a history book and read for crying out load, its right there!!