Cincinnati PD - death after arrest

[Jib 0]

Quote

My point is that I think it's unlikely that the authorities will even consider investigating other tactics; and part of that is because no-one seems to be able to entertain the idea that there has to a better way to subdue someone other than to hit them for 10 minutes with metal clubs.

You've uncovered the police's conspiracy to beat the hell out of people.

Not all police departments have or can afford tazers, which are rather painful, and with a heart condition?? If a club didn't work on somoene hopped up, I doubt mace or pepper spray would either. On the other hand is a quicker and easier way to subdue someone: shoot them!

--------------------------------------------------
the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[Jimbo 0]

At what point did you tell us what you would have done in the situation? Point it out to me, I must have missed it.

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[Michele 1]

Quote

No, I'm just answering it in a way that you don't want to hear. How many times do I have to reiterate the same point?

It isn't that you're not answering it like folks want to hear...it's not answering at all.

It's dancing around a direct question.

What would you (not the cops, not the "institution"...you) have done differently given the same set of circumstances?

Your repeated refusal to answer the question makes me think that you have an ax to grind with the cops, and aren't able to see this objectively. If so, that's cool - we all have our own personal prejudices. But don't cloak it in you have answered, when indeed you haven't.

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[marks 0]

i wouldnt have beat him at all..

i would have shot is pcp loaded ass. as soon as he came at me the second time.......

but then again... thats why the police will not let me have a gun....

[turtlespeed 226]

Quote

i wouldnt have beat him at all..

i would have shot is pcp loaded ass. as soon as he came at me the second time.......

but then again... thats why the police will not let me have a gun....

LMFAO!!!

Yeah, but some of us TRY to be PC these days.

LMAO!!!

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Jimbo 0]

Quote

i would have shot is pcp loaded ass. as soon as he came at me the second time.......

Given this guys size, combative nature, and intoxication level, I think it's something of a surprise that the police didn't shoot him.

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[andrewstewart 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

It makes one think that he doesn't see an alternate solution and must admit that the solution used was the best available.

Absolutely not.

So what is your solution then?

Jeezus. From post #109:

Strangely, I don't get paid to sit around thinking about how to subdue suspects in a way that doesn't either cause or contribute to their death. That's not my job. It IS the police's job though.

The chosen method of the police, as graphically demonstrated, is to hit someone with a metal stick until they are "subdued" (or dead, in this case). To have that be the textbook approach is negligent in itself. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary. They obviously haven't done that, otherwise Nathaniel Jones would be alive right now.

[marks 0]

Quote

Quote

i would have shot is pcp loaded ass. as soon as he came at me the second time.......

Given this guys size, combative nature, and intoxication level, I think it's something of a surprise that the police didn't shoot him.

-
Jim

im sorry i didnt mean this as a joke... im 100% serious... i would have shot is sorry ass ... white black geen i dont care,..... i just dont want my ass beat by some pcp loaded 500 lbs no inhabitions freak!

[marks 0]

Quote

So what is your solution then?

45mm

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

No, I'm just answering it in a way that you don't want to hear. How many times do I have to reiterate the same point?

OK, listen real close now, the question is:

WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE DONE?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[marks 0]

45mm would have killed him quicker...= less suffering.. wich means making tree huggers happy!

[Kennedy 0]

- or would just like to admit you have no knowledge whatsoever pertaining to this type of situation and just want to bitch about something?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[turtlespeed 226]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

It makes one think that he doesn't see an alternate solution and must admit that the solution used was the best available.

Absolutely not.

So what is your solution then?

Jeezus. From post #109:

Strangely, I don't get paid to sit around thinking about how to subdue suspects in a way that doesn't either cause or contribute to their death. That's not my job. It IS the police's job though.

The chosen method of the police, as graphically demonstrated, is to hit someone with a metal stick until they are "subdued" (or dead, in this case). To have that be the textbook approach is negligent in itself. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary. They obviously haven't done that, otherwise Nathaniel Jones would be alive right now.

We are all aware of what you posted in #109.

LMAO - Perhaps you could quote this back to us and HIGHLIGHT what it is in these paragraphs that you have written that describes what you would have done, as opposed to what you are not paid to do, thus, fulfilling the answer to the question..

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Kennedy 0]

what is a 45 millimeter?

you mean a .45 caliber?

[editted to remove misdirected thoughts]

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[turtlespeed 226]

Quote

Quote

So what is your solution then?

45mm

Holy Shit!

Thats a 1 and 3/4 inch diameter round.

Whew - can you imagine the kick on that baby.!

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[andrewstewart 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

It makes one think that he doesn't see an alternate solution and must admit that the solution used was the best available.

Absolutely not.

So what is your solution then?

Jeezus. From post #109:

Strangely, I don't get paid to sit around thinking about how to subdue suspects in a way that doesn't either cause or contribute to their death. That's not my job. It IS the police's job though.

The chosen method of the police, as graphically demonstrated, is to hit someone with a metal stick until they are "subdued" (or dead, in this case). To have that be the textbook approach is negligent in itself. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary. They obviously haven't done that, otherwise Nathaniel Jones would be alive right now.

We are all aware of what you posted in #109.

LMAO - Perhaps you could quote this back to us and HIGHLIGHT what it is in these paragraphs that you have written that describes what you would have done, as opposed to what you are not paid to do, thus, fulfilling the answer to the question..

From my post, for hopefully the last time:

That's not my job. It IS the police's job though. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary.

[Jib 0]

Quote

It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary.

How would you suggest a 120lb policewoman handle the situation?

--------------------------------------------------
the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[Kennedy 0]

Quote

That's not my job. It IS the police's job though. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary.

In other words, you have no idea what you're talking about, and have not bothered to educate yourself beyond what you're paid to do, and are just bitching aimlessly. Yes?

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[turtlespeed 226]

Quote

LMAO - Perhaps you could quote this back to us and HIGHLIGHT what it is in these paragraphs that you have written that describes what you would have done, as opposed to what you are not paid to do, thus, fulfilling the answer to the question..

From my post, for hopefully the last time:

That's not my job. It IS the police's job though. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary.

[kmcguffee 0]

Quote

i would have shot is pcp loaded ass. as soon as he came at me the second time.......

but then again... thats why the police will not let me have a gun....

LOL, I agree and I am a cop (with a gun).

As for as non-lethal alternatives, there are no 100% effective non-lethal alternatives. Submission holds are outlawed by lots of forces because they have killed, batons have killed, bean bags have killed, tazers are very inaccurate and have a short range, OC spray doesn't work on some people, very nasty farts only incapacitate momentarily.

Study up before you start expecting the impossible (not talking to you Jimbo). Police forces don't have unlimited budgets, unlimited space in their vehicles or on their gun belts, or unlimited training time. They pick a few tools that are the most effective and use them. They are not going to pay for a very expensive, untested weapon, that only works on some people.

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin

[andrewstewart 0]

Quote

Quote

LMAO - Perhaps you could quote this back to us and HIGHLIGHT what it is in these paragraphs that you have written that describes what you would have done, as opposed to what you are not paid to do, thus, fulfilling the answer to the question..

From my post, for hopefully the last time:

That's not my job. It IS the police's job though. It is the job of the police to create appropriate strategies for dealing with situations; one's that don't end up with someone being killed unless absolutely necessary.

Again - you avoid.

Ok, in real simple words.

You say that you are not paid to think up new options.
We don't care.
We do care about what you would do in thier place, since you condemn their actions.
It would seem that you are afraid to answer that question.
It would also seem that your argument holds no weight without alternative solutions.

[turtlespeed 226]

Quote

I would have hypnotized him - does that make you happy?

The responsibility for how to figure out a way to subdue someone without killing them is not mine, it is the police's.

Yet, you find it your responsibility to critsize and condemn those that are required to do something that you will not or cannot do yourself.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[marks 0]

Quote

what is a 45 millimeter?

you mean a .45 caliber?

[editted to remove misdirected thoughts]

ok so im drunk!!!./..

i still would have shot his ass with somthin!

[marks 0]

or maybee i could have charmed him with my good looks!...

[andrewstewart 0]

Quote

Quote

I would have hypnotized him - does that make you happy?

The responsibility for how to figure out a way to subdue someone without killing them is not mine, it is the police's.

Yet, you find it your responsibility to critsize and condemn those that are required to do something that you will not or cannot do yourself.

Yes, I criticize the fact that their chosen method killed the guy (or at least was a heavy contributor). If you are the police and your methods result in the death of a person, I don't think it's unreasonable to say: "why don't you investigate your methods?". But I suspect that there will be no such investigation/analysis because of the prevailing mood (as exemplified by your own attitude) which is to simply say that "the guy had it coming".