Reserve slink to attach bridle (#5 Grommet)

[audiobahn18s 0]

Hi guys, I have been lurking these forums feeding my brain for a couple years now and I have a question the search function isn't answering.

I purchased a Cazer zp collapsible pilot chute through Chutingstar and they recommended using a reserve slink to attach the bridle to the bag. I just ordered it yesterday and havent received it yet ( and i have no experience with slinks), but the #5 grommet on my D-bag seems like a large hole that a slink could potentially slip through, causing a nasty malfunction if it did. I e-mailed chutingstar and they said the #5 grommet was not an issue, but I want to ask you guys too. Are any of you using a reserve slink with a #5 grommet to attach your bridle?

[monkycndo 0]

Do you mean to attach the bridle to the dbag or canopy? Slinks are often used bridle to canopy. I have not seen the slink used for the dbag because a hard barrier like a french link is needed so as the bridle won't pull through the grommet.

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You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

[audiobahn18s 0]

I am refering to attaching the bridle to the D-bag. It makes sense to me if the bundle of slink combined with the bridle is too large to slip through the grommet than it would seem to work. But my #5 grommet seems kind of large in comparison to the bulk of fabric that would be needed to hold the bridle securely. here is a link to chutingstar with a video of what they recommend.
http://www.chutingstar.com/newgear_en/collapsible-main-pilot-chute.html

The video is at the bottom

[Martini 0]

Lots of people, myself included, use a slink on the bridle at the d-bag grommet. I use a regular slink, I'd bet the grommet would pull out of the bag (Infinity) before the slink/bridle would pull through the grommet. Using a speed link caused enough damage to one of my bridles that I retired the bridle and pc. I don't know about a #5 grommet and won't speculate on other people's gear but both of my Infinities are set up the same.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[audiobahn18s 0]

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Lots of people, myself included, use a slink on the bridle at the d-bag grommet. I use a regular slink, I'd bet the grommet would pull out of the bag (Infinity) before the slink/bridle would pull through the grommet.

Do you know what size grommet your using?

[mjosparky 4]

If you email ChutingStar and Mike said it would not be a problem it probably won’t be. Try not to over think things.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[audiobahn18s 0]

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If you email ChutingStar and Mike said it would not be a problem it probably won’t be. Try not to over think things.

Sparky

Yea, your right.... But being such a novice in the whole skydiving thing, I need some reassuring. I'll know for sure in a couple days if it works when my rigger inspects it. Plus some of those old threads I was reading didnt have a definative answer. I'll post when I get the PC attached just to provide a current post for future wonderers. Thanks for your help.

[Martini 0]

The grommet hole is around 9/16", I think that may be smaller than a #5. Keep in mind I'm using regular slinks not reserves which may be needed on a larger grommet. I am not a rigger and am only describing my setup. Mike at Chuting Star you can trust, also talk to your rigger. If you don't have one then you need one.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[audiobahn18s 0]

Thank you. and yes, I do have a rigger. And he will definatly be involved when I change it out.

[davelepka 4]

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I have been lurking these forums feeding my brain for a couple years now

That's your first mistake. The internet is a shitty place to learn about skydiving. It's an 'OK' place to discuss the in's and out's of skydiving, provided you have learned those in's and out's in the real world.

If you want to be an 'internet skydiver' that's one thing. If you want to move into being a real skydiver, drop all the internet stuff you 'heard', and start from scratch. If you're paying attention, and trying hard enough, you'll learn what you need to know in real life.

After all, you're posting about how to attach a PC to a canopy. It doesn't get any more basic than that, and if you had spent any time in the packing room looking over different rigs top to bottom, or working with a rigger to learn about gear, you wouldn't be having this 'problem'.

[audiobahn18s 0]

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I have been lurking these forums feeding my brain for a couple years now

That's your first mistake. The internet is a shitty place to learn about skydiving. It's an 'OK' place to discuss the in's and out's of skydiving, provided you have learned those in's and out's in the real world.

If you want to be an 'internet skydiver' that's one thing. If you want to move into being a real skydiver, drop all the internet stuff you 'heard', and start from scratch. If you're paying attention, and trying hard enough, you'll learn what you need to know in real life.

After all, you're posting about how to attach a PC to a canopy. It doesn't get any more basic than that, and if you had spent any time in the packing room looking over different rigs top to bottom, or working with a rigger to learn about gear, you wouldn't be having this 'problem'.

I am sorry if my statement is misleading. I have learned ALMOST everything I know from my instructors/rigger but I use DZ.com to see what others think about any paticular issue. I also am also one of those unlucky ones who's local DZ is closed in the winter so I use DZ.com as a resource.(and still closed. Opens next weekend..FINALLY!!) As someone who is so new to the sport, I am beginning to really understand the intricacies of a rig. What seems novice to you now ...at some point in your career wasn't. So please have some mercy on those willing to learn.
So , to keep this thread on topic, do you have any experience with this scenario. Just to clarify though, my rigger will have the ultimate say in this matter. But because my DZ isn't open yet I am trying to get some feedback to see if this is even an issue( sounds like it probably isn't)

[champu 1]

There was a discussion about this a few months ago but the exact setup you're talking about (#5 grommet; Cazer PC; reserve slink) didn't come up.

I keep forgetting to test out a reserve slink so while I think it should probably be fine I can't say for sure. I will say I would definitely not use a main slink.

[Martini 0]

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I will say I would definitely not use a main slink.

Have you tried to pull a main slink setup through a #5 grommet? It would be interesting to see if it is possible. I'm assuming a #5 is 5/8" ID.

I wonder if a pull-through is a real problem. The bag will still extract and the canopy will deploy. The kill line may not function, only a problem on highly loaded canopies. Most (but by no means all) highly loaded canopies are small and light so the snatch force that could result in a pull-through is relatively low making a pull through less likely to start with.

Got laid off last week, gives me more time to ponder trivia.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[champu 1]

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I will say I would definitely not use a main slink.

Have you tried to pull a main slink setup through a #5 grommet? It would be interesting to see if it is possible. I'm assuming a #5 is 5/8" ID.

I wonder if a pull-through is a real problem. The bag will still extract and the canopy will deploy. The kill line may not function, only a problem on highly loaded canopies. Most (but by no means all) highly loaded canopies are small and light so the snatch force that could result in a pull-through is relatively low making a pull through less likely to start with.

The photo I posted in the other thread was a main slink through a #4 grommet (which is smaller than a #5, though just barely if I remember correctly)

My concern regarding a pull through would be that the pilot chute collapses after the pin is extracted but before the bag is extracted or before line stretch. This could result in a number of problems.

[audiobahn18s 0]

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Have you tried to pull a main slink setup through a #5 grommet? It would be interesting to see if it is possible. I'm assuming a #5 is 5/8" ID.

When I receive my PC It comes with a standard slink and a reserve slink. The reserve slink is ment to be used on the bridle attachment but I may assemble both ways just as an experiment( obviously I won't jump it) to see how it looks and if it is possible to pull it through with the standard. Thanks both of you, for your input. I do appreciate it.

[mjosparky 4]

#4 grommet is 1/2" and a #5 is 5/8".

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[Martini 0]

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My concern regarding a pull through would be that the pilot chute collapses after the pin is extracted but before the bag is extracted or before line stretch. This could result in a number of problems.

Excellent point. Also worthy of a test so I did and you're right, the pc could easily collapse before the bag is extracted or canopy deployment. Don't know how I missed that. I don't have a #5 grommet to test pull-through though.

Attatched is a pic of bridle damage caused by using a speed link as a bridle stop, it probably has 900-1000 jumps and was nearing retirement anyway.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[Martini 0]

That's how I read that too, one site called a 9/16" grommet a #4-S, I thought that the S was for stainless though. Maybe it's a #4 1/2?

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[Martini 0]

Great, let us know how the test works out.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[mjosparky 4]

This is a chart of grommet sized.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[Martini 0]

Thanks, I also found that table. But others such as Stimpson
http://www.stimpson.com/rolledRimGrommets_washers.htm?col5=open

and Chicago Canvas

[/url]http://www.chicagocanvas.com/job-helpers/[url]


don't agree. Poynter's table doesn't refer to a 9/16" but he does refer to one regarding grommets for cones.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[mjosparky 4]

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Thanks, I also found that table. But others such as Stimpson
http://www.stimpson.com/rolledRimGrommets_washers.htm?col5=open

and Chicago Canvas

[/url]http://www.chicagocanvas.com/job-helpers/[url]


don't agree. Poynter's table doesn't refer to a 9/16" but he does refer to one regarding grommets for cones.

I know you know this but for those that are wondering what we are taking about look in PPM Vol. I page 147. It shows flat washer grommets in size 9/16” and 7/16”. They are used with cones for closing old military containers.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[kingbunky 3]

i'm not sure what kind of rig you have, but when in doubt, check with the manufacturer. i did (with my infinity) and was told to go ahead, as long as i used reserve slinks. i asked a friend to pick some up for me on a trip south and hooked it up. i jumped it that way for awhile, and another jumper asked me if i had any more to do his new mirage (i believe) with. i said sure, but made certain he knew i wasn't a rigger, and i couldn't speak for his manufacturer as to whether it would be okay on his rig. he has about 3k jumps, and said, go ahead. i stuck them on and he had a cutaway on his second jump because the bridle pulled through the grommet and collapsed his pilot chute before it could do anything.

i checked mine after that, and it seemed okay. fast forward 4 years and one day after a jump i noticed that my bridle had pulled through the grommet. . closer inspection revealed that i had used main slinks. i replaced it with a reserve slink and all has been well since. sometimes ignorance is not bliss.

just this weekend a friend replaced his pilot chute with a new cazer from chutingstar. it came with a reserve slink for the bridle to bag connection and a main slink for the bridle to canopy connection. i assembled it for him and pulled on it with varying forces and it didn't seem inclined to pull though. (javelin rig)

"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

[sundevil777 102]

So, the extra thickness of the reserve slink is enough extra bulk to keep it from pulling through.

I'd like to use what I have instead of pay $30 or so for the reserve slinks, certainly someone can suggest a way to add bulk in a way that is sensible/easy/won't cause damage. I'm sure some will immediately say that it is stupid to consider, but tough shit to them nervous nannies.

So, if you have any ideas, please offer.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[audiobahn18s 0]

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i'm not sure what kind of rig you have, but when in doubt, check with the manufacturer. i did (with my infinity) and was told to go ahead, as long as i used reserve slinks. i asked a friend to pick some up for me on a trip south and hooked it up. i jumped it that way for awhile, and another jumper asked me if i had any more to do his new mirage (i believe) with. i said sure, but made certain he knew i wasn't a rigger, and i couldn't speak for his manufacturer as to whether it would be okay on his rig. he has about 3k jumps, and said, go ahead. i stuck them on and he had a cutaway on his second jump because the bridle pulled through the grommet and collapsed his pilot chute before it could do anything.

i checked mine after that, and it seemed okay. fast forward 4 years and one day after a jump i noticed that my bridle had pulled through the grommet. . closer inspection revealed that i had used main slinks. i replaced it with a reserve slink and all has been well since. sometimes ignorance is not bliss.

just this weekend a friend replaced his pilot chute with a new cazer from chutingstar. it came with a reserve slink for the bridle to bag connection and a main slink for the bridle to canopy connection. i assembled it for him and pulled on it with varying forces and it didn't seem inclined to pull though. (javelin rig)

I should have included in my first post, that my rig is an '01 Javelin J4K. I am expecting my Cazer Pilot Chute to be delivered tomorrow, so I will no for ALMOST sure if it will work or not. I will get the ultimate say from my rigger this coming weekend. I'll be sure to take pics of the setup with both the main and reserve slink attaching the bridle.