Jayruss 0 #1 October 31, 2003 Boy's Costume Catches Fire at School ELLSWORTH, Maine - A high school student suffered severe burns after his Army sniper costume of leaves and a grass-like material was set on fire by a classmate during a Halloween assembly Thursday, police said. A 15-year-old at Ellsworth High School was charged with starting the fire with a lighter after allegedly saying, "I wonder if this will burn," police Lt. Harold Page said. Donald Awalt, 14, of Ellsworth, was airlifted to a Boston hospital with third-degree burns. He suffered burns to his back, legs and head, Page said. His condition was not immediately released. "This is just a prank gone horrifically wrong," Page said. The entire school — about 500 students, many in costume — was at the "Spook Day" assembly in the school gymnasium when the flames broke out at the top of the bleachers. Some people initially thought it was a joke when they saw the flames. Then students bolted for the exits in a panic. The victim ran down to the floor, where students and a school worker used a fire extinguisher and a coat to smother the flames. The 15-year-old was charged with reckless conduct, aggravated assault and arson and taken to a youth detention center in Charleston, Page said. The boy was remorseful and said he never intended for anyone to be hurt, Page said. __________________________________________________ "Beware how you take away hope from another human being." -Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #2 October 31, 2003 The kid said he was remorseful.... what ever... I bet it was something like this. LIghter KID: boy that looks flamable. Friends: I bet you wont do it lighter KID: Naw he might get hurt Friends : "tease and taunght" Lighter KID: ok he is a dork anywayLeroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RevJim 0 #3 October 31, 2003 What the fuck was a 15 year old doing with a lighter anyway? Much less a 15 year old with a lighter in school. Trial as an adult, I say. He had the lighter. He used it on another human to see if he would burn. Put 'em away. Preferably for a long time. Kids wanna act like adults, treat 'em like adults.It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Remster 30 #4 October 31, 2003 QuoteWhat the fuck was a 15 year old doing with a lighter anyway What? how is he supposed to light up his cigs? matches???Remster Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyyhi 0 #5 October 31, 2003 I am with Jim. . .that was absolutely intentional. . .ya burn someone elses clothes, they are going to get hurt. . .LOCK HIM UP. . .he is a menace to society. . .________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RkyMtnHigh 0 #6 October 31, 2003 Geez..what's this world coming to?! Psycho kids with no parental supervision! _________________________________________ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jayruss 0 #7 October 31, 2003 this is yet another reason why some schools don't allow kids to wear costumes __________________________________________________ "Beware how you take away hope from another human being." -Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RkyMtnHigh 0 #8 October 31, 2003 Yep..some of our public schools here have gone back to uniforms/dress codes _________________________________________ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropoutdave 0 #9 October 31, 2003 I accidently set my friends arm on fire when I was fire breathing....im no menace to society. It was fuckin hilarious. ------------------------------------------------------ May Contain Nut traces...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JeffD 0 #10 October 31, 2003 Ha, we used a small bottle of cologne and a lighter to make a mini flame thrower whilst sitting around during lunch. But we didn't intend to hurt anyone, except those damn ant's. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropoutdave 0 #11 October 31, 2003 My old man once blew up one of those 5 foot tall gas bottles with a blow torch when the tide was out. Made a hole the size of a bungalow apparently!! Anyone know when low tide is? ------------------------------------------------------ May Contain Nut traces...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 235 #12 October 31, 2003 Yeah, he should be hanged. NO MERCY!!"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RkyMtnHigh 0 #13 October 31, 2003 The Question is: did HE think it was hilarious? _________________________________________ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,006 #14 October 31, 2003 >What the fuck was a 15 year old doing with a lighter anyway? Much >less a 15 year old with a lighter in school. I had a lighter, a pocketknife, a magnifying glass (to burn things with) and lots of dry cells when I was 15. I'm amazed I didn't burn down _my_ house. >Trial as an adult, I say. He had the lighter. He used it on another >human to see if he would burn. He used it on a costume to see if it would burn. He was being a stupid kid. Kids do stuff like that - throw snowballs at cars, light stuff on fire, shoot at traffic lights with BB guns. Their parents are the first line of defense against stuff like that, the police are second. When both those things fail then call in the courts. >Kids wanna act like adults, treat 'em like adults. Seeing if stuff will catch on fire is acting like an adult? In that case, I was an adult when I was 8. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dropoutdave 0 #15 October 31, 2003 Yeah he thought it was piss funny. Only singed hairs and a bit sore. ------------------------------------------------------ May Contain Nut traces...... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RkyMtnHigh 0 #16 October 31, 2003 Thank God he wasn't scarred forever and have that constant reminder of his nutcase buddy! _________________________________________ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MNskyjumper 0 #17 October 31, 2003 QuoteSeeing if stuff will catch on fire is acting like an adult? In that case, I was an adult when I was 8. I would think a 15 year old would be smarter than an 8 year old. But, I could be wrong. Kevin W. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RevJim 0 #18 October 31, 2003 QuoteQuoteSeeing if stuff will catch on fire is acting like an adult? In that case, I was an adult when I was 8. I would think a 15 year old would be smarter than an 8 year old. But, I could be wrong. Kevin W. Exactly what I was thinking, but arguing with Bill is like arguing with a 15 year old. They know everything, ya know? The difference here is, Bill really does know everything. Just ask him. Seriously, I think that at 15, though you might still be thinking like a kid, you know the difference between harmless pranks and actions that will likely cause great bodily harm. Edit: The only difference here is the outcome. Had the 14 year old died from the wounds, everyone would be screaming for a trial. Injuries get a slap on the wrist. Why is it lately that someone must die to show that some things and ways of thinking are wrong? The fact is the 15 year old lit the 14 year old on fire. What happens to the 14 year old will determine the outcome? Why? The 15 yera old did the same thing, with the same mentality, in all possible outcomes. Thank God for quick teacher actions. Without the fire extinguisher and coat to smother the flames, we'd be screaming murder instead of "Spank his parents".It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dgskydive 0 #19 October 31, 2003 QuoteI would think a 15 year old would be smarter than an 8 year old. That's the problem 15 year olds are too smart. He probably thought "there is no way this will really burn" The 8 year old wouldn't have even thought that much. We used to burn stuff as kids. I even burned down a shed in my uncles back yard that almost took out two houses. I didn't think it would get that big that fast! I ran away to get some water to put it out and by the time I came back out of the house the whole damn thing was going! I am not saying this kid is innocent, nor does his ignorance and stupidity mean that he should not be punished. He needs something done to him. I bet he feels really sorry for what he did. Doesn't change the fact that the other kid is screwed for life. Dom Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 2,027 #20 October 31, 2003 QuoteWhat the fuck was a 15 year old doing with a lighter anyway? Much less a 15 year old with a lighter in school. Trial as an adult, I say. He had the lighter. He used it on another human to see if he would burn. Put 'em away. Preferably for a long time. Kids wanna act like adults, treat 'em like adults. "If you call a tail a leg, how many legs has a dog? Five? No, calling a tail a leg don't make it a leg." Abraham Lincoln And calling a child an adult doesn't make him an adult.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,006 #21 October 31, 2003 >Seriously, I think that at 15, though you might still be thinking like a > kid, you know the difference between harmless pranks and actions > that will likely cause great bodily harm. I agree. Judgement is something that doesn't just happen at a certain age; it starts around age 5 (which is, in my opinion, around the time kids can start to tell right from wrong) and continues forever. By 17, you could argue that most people have enough judgement to be held 100% responsible for their actions. By 15? Maybe he's 80% of the way there. Maybe 8 out of 10 15-year-olds are responsible enough to be trusted with lighters, alcohol, even guns. The law recognizes this, which is why cops, parents, prosecutors etc have more leeway with underage criminals. >What happens to the 14 year old will determine the outcome? Why? Because crimes in this country are determined more by the damage they cause than by the criminal's intent. Which I think is the way it should be - judge people by the results of their actions, not by what they were thinking when they did it. The former is a lot easier to both prove and judge. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites RevJim 0 #22 October 31, 2003 Can't seem to break the rec.skydiving reply format, huh? That's ok Bill, I understand. > >What happens to the 14 year old will determine the outcome? Why? > Because crimes in this country are determined more by the damage they cause than by the criminal's intent. Which I think is the way it should be - judge people by the results of their actions, not by what they were thinking when they did it. The former is a lot easier to both prove and judge. You do make a very good point Bill. We are judged on damage more than intent. More than likely this is for the reason you pointed out, it's easier to prove. I cannot argue that point. It's when those lines start to blur, that I believe we need to start judging on intent, however slim of a sliver we can prove. Child burns ants at age 6. Childish, and expected. Child burns piles of leaves, sticks, grass, ect. at age 12. Small and controlled. No damage, no action taken. Child lights toys on fire, in living room, age 13 1/2. Plastic smell lingers for weeks. Otherwise, no damage. No action taken. Child lights another child's clothes on fire, age 14. Other child not seriously injured. Apologies and restitution are done, no major action taken. Child lights another child on fire, age 15. Child suffers 2nd degree and worse burns, but recovers fine. Juvenile courts "Throws the book at the kid". In other words, a few weeks in a hall, and some supervised probabtion. Essentially, not much action taken. What does the child learn after nearly a decade of playing with fire? He/she can play all he/she wants, without fear of major repercussions. Fast forward to the fall of 2003, Southern California. How many blackened acres will it take? Get my drift?It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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kallend 2,027 #20 October 31, 2003 QuoteWhat the fuck was a 15 year old doing with a lighter anyway? Much less a 15 year old with a lighter in school. Trial as an adult, I say. He had the lighter. He used it on another human to see if he would burn. Put 'em away. Preferably for a long time. Kids wanna act like adults, treat 'em like adults. "If you call a tail a leg, how many legs has a dog? Five? No, calling a tail a leg don't make it a leg." Abraham Lincoln And calling a child an adult doesn't make him an adult.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,006 #21 October 31, 2003 >Seriously, I think that at 15, though you might still be thinking like a > kid, you know the difference between harmless pranks and actions > that will likely cause great bodily harm. I agree. Judgement is something that doesn't just happen at a certain age; it starts around age 5 (which is, in my opinion, around the time kids can start to tell right from wrong) and continues forever. By 17, you could argue that most people have enough judgement to be held 100% responsible for their actions. By 15? Maybe he's 80% of the way there. Maybe 8 out of 10 15-year-olds are responsible enough to be trusted with lighters, alcohol, even guns. The law recognizes this, which is why cops, parents, prosecutors etc have more leeway with underage criminals. >What happens to the 14 year old will determine the outcome? Why? Because crimes in this country are determined more by the damage they cause than by the criminal's intent. Which I think is the way it should be - judge people by the results of their actions, not by what they were thinking when they did it. The former is a lot easier to both prove and judge. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RevJim 0 #22 October 31, 2003 Can't seem to break the rec.skydiving reply format, huh? That's ok Bill, I understand. > >What happens to the 14 year old will determine the outcome? Why? > Because crimes in this country are determined more by the damage they cause than by the criminal's intent. Which I think is the way it should be - judge people by the results of their actions, not by what they were thinking when they did it. The former is a lot easier to both prove and judge. You do make a very good point Bill. We are judged on damage more than intent. More than likely this is for the reason you pointed out, it's easier to prove. I cannot argue that point. It's when those lines start to blur, that I believe we need to start judging on intent, however slim of a sliver we can prove. Child burns ants at age 6. Childish, and expected. Child burns piles of leaves, sticks, grass, ect. at age 12. Small and controlled. No damage, no action taken. Child lights toys on fire, in living room, age 13 1/2. Plastic smell lingers for weeks. Otherwise, no damage. No action taken. Child lights another child's clothes on fire, age 14. Other child not seriously injured. Apologies and restitution are done, no major action taken. Child lights another child on fire, age 15. Child suffers 2nd degree and worse burns, but recovers fine. Juvenile courts "Throws the book at the kid". In other words, a few weeks in a hall, and some supervised probabtion. Essentially, not much action taken. What does the child learn after nearly a decade of playing with fire? He/she can play all he/she wants, without fear of major repercussions. Fast forward to the fall of 2003, Southern California. How many blackened acres will it take? Get my drift?It's your life, live it! Karma RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
