hackish 8 #1 May 28, 2011 Every time I do a repack I carefully pull it out of the freebag and have a look at how the slider and lines sat from the last repack. I have found a number of times the D-Lines have migrated from the middle of the packjob. Sometimes it occurs on packjob from a 20+ year rigger and sometimes a newbie. Some other riggers you'd swear they used a comb on every single one of the lines on every packjob of theirs I've opened... I think it's happening during the width reduction folds and it seems more common in the larger reserve packs. I haven't done enough tandems yet to see if there is a trend there. Tips or tricks on prevention? Insight into the cause? -Michael Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 8 #2 May 28, 2011 While I don't think that those would be an issue, you can always do your width reduction folds and adjustments and reach up under the tail and make sure that its still straight. I don't think its the folds that cause it, but rather the tightening up of the pack job (pulling the skin away from the center and tucking it in)... at-least that's MY opinion on it. I wish I knew the technique that the people that get them perfectly center and straight use!"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bertt 0 #3 May 28, 2011 I bet it's happening when you fold it over and molar it. You could try experimenting with that part a few times. I bet every one of those pack jobs would have opened fine.You don't have to outrun the bear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hackish 8 #4 May 28, 2011 They probably will all open properly. I'm just interested in understanding what's going on so I can work on improving my own packjobs. Some of my D-Lines have been moving a little too (not this bad) so any tips & tricks would be appreciated. -Michael Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pchapman 279 #5 May 28, 2011 Just my opinion: The D-line attachments do tend to move apart. I see it happening for two reasons. One is the wrapping/folding to reduce the stack width. But before that, just flaking the tail has an effect. While the tail may be neat at the trailing edge, the geometry gets messy towards the top of the canopy, so it tends to pull the D's apart. When the tail is stacked up it tends slide off to the side instead of stacking up perfectly from the centerline outwards. It is a different kind of flaking at the tail (D's to tail, then along the trailing edge) than one is doing between the A's, B's, and C's, where all the fabric is moved into one big fold outboard. The geometry of the folds in the area is inherently messy and complex, so it tends to be a messy part of the pack job. At least one can sort of see the D-line attachments, and feel them, through the top skin. So one can grab them through the skin to some degree, retensioning them and keeping them from migrating outwards too much. (And if really needed one can reach up under the trailing edge to grab them.) I accept a little movement and spreading due to the bulk issue, but don't want them migrating to the outer edge of the width-reduced stack or getting into that fold. The top D line is most likely to get pulled outboard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #6 May 28, 2011 Just tie them off with seal thread, E thread if you really want to make sure they stay put....you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerpaul 1 #7 May 28, 2011 QuoteJust tie them off with seal thread, E thread if you really want to make sure they stay put.... Or just leave a clamp holding them neatly together. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 8 #8 May 28, 2011 QuoteJust tie them off with seal thread, E thread if you really want to make sure they stay put.... Better to just bartack them together."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerpaul 1 #9 May 28, 2011 QuoteQuoteJust tie them off with seal thread, E thread if you really want to make sure they stay put.... Better to just bartack them together. Too hard to remove for the next I&R. Stick with the clamps. They are easier to remove for the next I&R, and you contribute to the tool kit of the next rigger. Now that's a win/win deal! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #10 May 28, 2011 QuoteJust tie them off with seal thread, E thread if you really want to make sure they stay put.... Thats not as absurd an idea as some may think. We use ticket 3 to maintain line separation/continuity on cargo systems in order to keep the lines neat and controllable during the packing. I know of one main canopy that uses magnets on the last L/R "C' lines so that the entire set of "D" lines can be placed between them to keep them from moving during the packing. It works very well."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #11 May 28, 2011 Yes I was being a smartass with the comment about E thread, the other comment about seal thread, not as much, however not approved and if you did do that and fuck up and use the wrong stuff, well.....you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 37 #12 May 28, 2011 guys, guys, guys, You know some 10 day wonder newbie rigger is now going to pick ethread because they don't have a bar tack machine and clamps are expensive.For the newbies ...... these were all jokes!!!!! And maybe you don't think you need to say so and maybe I'm cynical (maybe?) but I don't trust anything said as a joke to not be believed by someone. I've seen it too often. Lou, what main has those magnests? stock or after market? I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #13 May 28, 2011 QuoteLou, what main has those magnests? stock or after market? Stock on the Intruder main canopy."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 37 #14 May 28, 2011 thanks, I don't keep up on military stuffI'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hackish 8 #15 May 28, 2011 Enough with the jokes. I'm not going to tie them together even with rigger's thread unless it's approved by PD which I don't think it is. I once found some elastic bands holding stuff together in a tandem reserve but that's a different story for a different time. -Michael Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #16 May 29, 2011 I lay a packing weight across the D-lines - to hold them in place - while I flaked the tail, but some of those free-bags got awfully HEAVY! Hah! Hah! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
floormonkey 0 #17 May 30, 2011 They "migrate" because someone didn't make sure they stayed in the middle. It usually happens during reduction folds. To get those pretty straight ones, lift up the tail after you make the reduction folds and put them back in the middle. Remember, contrary to what many jumpers think, canopies and their parts are inanimate objects that are subject to the laws of physics-they only move when moved or affected. Personally, I just don't pull on the tail enough to move them. Less work than having to reach in there again. One rigger I know used a 15 foot pull-up cord-he reached in and tied the D-lines together with a slip-knot, leaving the bitter end sticking out below the tail so he didn't have to lift it again. Other end was tied to a tool he needed to close the rig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 8 #18 May 30, 2011 Quote One rigger I know used a 15 foot pull-up cord-he reached in and tied the D-lines together with a slip-knot, leaving the bitter end sticking out below the tail so he didn't have to lift it again. Other end was tied to a tool he needed to close the rig. Thought I was the only one that did that... except my pull up cord is only about 4' long"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
