Police shooting in Louisana

[PhillyKev 0]

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The three black cops shooting a white guy allusion you present is hilarious. I for one, and I'm sure BlueEyed et al feel the same way, wouldn't give a damn. I'd be glad the cops did their job. Unlike the bleeding heart liberals infesting San Fran, I neither judge anyone by thier race nor support any program that does.

If someone points what I believe to be a gun at me, the last thing I'm going to care about is their race. I guess in that half a second where they thought they were about to die they thought, "he's black so it's ok to shoot him", whereas if he were white they wouldn't have.

I watched that video, I didn't notice what's been described as "gang clothing" or that the guy was black. I saw a gun, so did the cops, and they did what they had to do to save their own innocent lives from a felon.

I used to follow The Dead on tour, sell grilled cheese, play bongos and wax poetic about the hippy communal lifestyle. I've met a lot of people with SadSue's and the northern Cali outlook on this type of thing. It's extremism and based on unrealistic perceptions of the world. It's easy sitting around with your white friends, in a white neighborhood, talking about how bad the white man is. I guarantee I could show that video to a group of ghetto raised, non-racist, black men who would say that shooting was totally justified.

[LouDiamond 1]

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Oh and Lou...

Any adult who can think for themselves... would not proudly post something like this.
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I am sure there are a lot of people laughing their asses off in front of their monitors when they read your posts. So keep on keeping on with the caffine or not taking the meds, it makes for interesting reading.
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That tells me one thing, you are posting on this subject to gain approval from your peers. That about sums it all up!

Oh you are such a sharp one. You have seen through it all. Yes, yes everyone give me your approval...BWAAAAAHHHH Get a life, that shit may work against kids and weak minded people but it just reinforces what I posted earlier about your posts.

Your entitled to your opinion, but as it has been pointed out, you have no facts to substantiate your claims that it was racially motivated or that it was excessive force. If you could produce some factual evidence and not rely on your highly emotional irrational responses then , maybe, people would consider your view.

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posted by TheThinker

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snip....but all people would agree that my posts are bull shit. Why...b/c thats wut i go for Just because I insulted you however doesn't mean you have to go on insulting sue..

Well I don't think you'll get much argument from anyone on that point, so we are in agreement on one thing I'm not trying to insult anyone, I am trying to point out that her points might be taken a little bit more serious if she/he didn't come accross as she/he does with a one sided, non factual, rehashed statememnt every X post.

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It seems quite logical that one would start throwing insults such as "back to the medication" or "your posts are entertaining" b/c shes getting to you.

If anyone is "getting " to anyone, it would appear that the majority of the respondants to this thread have gotten to SadSue and you. Since neither one of you has provided any facts or even a viable viewpoint, I would not be surprised if either one of you started posted " I know you are but what am I" type of statements or, heaven forbid, started verbally attacking the other posters to divert attention away from the fact that neither one of you has a factual leg to stand on.

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Ill leave it to you to find the definition of a bint and a prat. Seeing as you have so many little buddies that want to hold your hand...ask one im sure theyll know. SNIP.... As far as personal attacks, u can tell on me...if i get kicked off the forum, i can take it. Its just u lot and your interesting ways intrigue me so i come back for more! cheers

AAAHH, so quick to call names but not man enough to tell me what it means? I am not surprised. As for the rest of your playground banter, I expect as much from you. I won't "tell" on you since I think your own actions will be your down fall. I'm just gonna give you some more rope and you'll eventually hang yourself


NOW, if EITHER one of you would like to talk FACTS and discusss what has already been declared a justified use of force, then by all means, please proceed.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[SadSue 0]

thanks Anvl for your post. A couple points-

the overwhelming number of people who replied clearly DON't know the diference between Northern and Southern California mentalities- they cite Rodney King as being a "California" thing when in fact it's tyipcal of SO CAL, not No Cal...FYI for those ignorant of the 30 million people in California there is the equivalent of a Mason Dixon line out here approximately 100miles south of San Fran.....the difference between the two parts of the state is roughly the difference between living in Toronto and Texas, so your ignorance is showing thru....at least YOU have some facts together on this because you understand the "bleeding heart" mentality of the NORTH....

But whoa...you rip on me for the "race" card, yt yo are playing the "not all Southernsare racist" card....OK, maybe not but the sad fact is that you see nowhere near the diversity of SF in a Southern town...just yesterday I had lunch with an Indian couple who told me how they were treated like zoo creatures in Durham and in Houston,,,thsi is the inevitable consequence of lack of diversity....people that are different are treated wierdly...gee, how did the the South get like this whereas it's not like that here? Hmmm..CLOSE MINDS....CLOSED VALUES....racism? The movie was called MISSISSIPPI Burning, NOT Seattle Burning...get real.

You can rag on liberal bleeding hearts all you want but he feact of the matter is THIS- even after the dot com crash, California remains, on its own the 5th largest economy in the world...and the heart of that economy exists NOT in Hollywood, but in San Francisco....there is no reason to suck George Bush's economic cock when us liberals do a MUCH BETTER JOB with our economy here. It is a bad cliche that left wing people dive the economy into the ground when our economy kicks the rest of the US's ass, not to mention the world's ass as well, even in these troubled times. So bleeding heats? Yep...all those fringe kids you made fun of in high schol, they were nerdy, bookish and SMART ad they all made their way out here to create a cool world.

I'm not surprised that SF kicks such ass because THIS is what America is SUPPOSED to be about- diversity, tolerance, acceptance- that is why there is such solid financial strength and base here, and why a black guy can marry a white girl without dear of molotov cocktals being thrown thru the windows...or why a a Korea girl can marry a Japanese guy after 3000 years of racial infighting between them (I mean c'mon, even today in Japan 5th generation Korean Japanese still have to be fingerprinted, but out here they're getting it RIGHT), where Palestinian kids have Jewish babysitters and it's all cool.....so it'snot that I am issuing some sort of sweeping indictment og the South...but when you compare the REAL America to the candy ass hypocritical imitation in Lousiana then you know how far the rest of America has to go...

Out here we ADMIT we have work to do.....why can you not do the same without falling back on the refelx of the "insulted Southerner" who feels he isn't given credit for progress? Oh, that's why...because you're still shooting people in the back and the rest of the country backs you up.....cool.

To all of you who have schooled me...if I am ignorant of law enforcement techniques then I apologixe...but ultimately, if the world you create is a cool one then it shouldn;t come to what happened on that tape, let me not indict the conduct of those officers then, but the conduct of EVERY FUCKING CITIZEN of Lousiana who allows such a close minded world to exist where officers are forced to do that...if the guy had had an opportunity to go to college on a California style residency law then it wouldn't have happned, if there hadn';t been decades of racial gerrymandering where the guy grew up in a no hope slum....

OK, kill me now. But we have the strong economy thru diversity out here...that IS what Americais suppose to be. Right? I'm Irish from Dublin, and I remember just gong thru the AIRPORT in Houston and hearing them freak out at my accent like I was some sort of freak.....closed mind alert, please take caution.

Anyway, I have to go now... but I look forward to seeing your responses later.

Have a nice day

Hope you don't get Banned!

[PhillyKev 0]

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if the guy had had an opportunity to go to college on a California style residency law then it wouldn't have happned,

Are you serious? There's no crime in San Fran? Bad guys never pull weapons on the police? That's amazing!! It must be Utopia there. Maybe you should take up some issues with the San Fran residents.

Shooting brings up SFPD procedures

Family Protests Deadly Police Shooting

A 1996 investigative report by the San Francisco Examiner found that the city was paying large amounts in civil lawsuits following shootings but that the involved officers were not being disciplined by the department, or criminally prosecuted

The San Francisco Police Department

That was all on page one of my google search for "san francisco police shooting".

Police killings in San Francisco

February 19, 2003 - Authorities said officers were compelled to open fire Wednesday on Michael Moll of San Francisco after he drove a stolen Honda Civic into an unmarked police cruiser's open passenger door, ramming it into a plainclothes officer.... The officers fired a total of eight shots, striking Moll five times. Police defend killing of youth -- his parents want a probe
March 2002 - five officers opened fire on a 100-pound, mentally disabled man named Richard Tims, killing him. The barrage of ricocheting bullets destroyed a bus shelter, sprayed the block and felled onlooker Vilda Curry -- forever robbing the 39-year-old mother of her ovary and the use of her leg. Five cops should have been able to take Tims' knife without firing a single bullet. Instead, they shot two people. All officers were cleared in that case, too - Pattern of SFPD coverups runs deep
February 2002 - Take the killing of Gregory Hooper in February 2002. Off-duty officer Steve Lee got into a fistfight with Hooper, a street vendor who had turned his life around after a stint in state prison. Eyewitnesses reported that after the fight ended, Lee shot the unarmed Hooper four times in the chest at point- blank range. At least three witnesses told The Chronicle that Lee fired not in self-defense but in anger. Lee had a record of off-duty misconduct, having been cited previously by the Office of Citizen Complaints. But the SFPD and district attorney quickly exonerated the officer. Pattern of SFPD coverups runs deep
June 12, 2001 Idriss Stelley was shot more than 20 times and killed by San Francisco Police Officers at the Sony Metreon. Young man dies, shot 20 times by 8 cops Just before midnight on June 12, 2001, Idriss Stelley was killed by 8 San Francisco police officers, shot over 25 times. Since then, Idriss's family has been stalled, lied to and disrespected by SFPD and the City of San Francisco. This website demands justice for Idriss, however long it takes. - www.justice4idriss.org
May 13, 1998 - Sheila Patricia Detoy, sitting in the front seat of a Ford Mustang, was shot once in the head by plainclothes police officers as the car barreled out of the driveway of the Oakwood Apartments May 13, 1998 Mother of slain girl files wrongful death claim
April 6, 1996 - Mark Garcia, a 15 year teamster, was killed by San Francisco police. Mark Garcia was robbed and partially stripped of his clothing. The San Francisco Police Department (SFPD) was called. Instead of helping Mark, the police beat him, pepper sprayed him, handcuffed him, stood on his back for more than 5 minutes, hog-tied him, and then threw him into the back of a police van. Although they took him to the hospital, Mark Garcia died as a result of this abuse. Silence and the case of Mark Garcia by Tom McKay
June 4, 1995 - Aaron Williams, an African-American man suspected of a $50 pet-store burglary who died in police custody. According to witnesses and police sources, a team of police led by Officer Marc Andaya repeatedly kicked Williams in the head and emptied three canisters of pepper spray into his face. Despite the fact that Williams was having difficulty breathing, the police finally hog-tied, gagged and left him unattended in the back of a police van, where he died. Lessons from a Killing

[Jib 0]

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To all of you who have schooled me...if I am ignorant of law enforcement techniques then I apologixe...but ultimately, if the world you create is a cool one then it shouldn;t come to what happened on that tape, let me not indict the conduct of those officers then, but the conduct of EVERY FUCKING CITIZEN of Lousiana who allows such a close minded world to exist where officers are forced to do that...if the guy had had an opportunity to go to college on a California style residency law then it wouldn't have happned, if there hadn';t been decades of racial gerrymandering where the guy grew up in a no hope slum....

Your righteous indigation is misplaced but amusing. Why not just indict the entire United States of America? [think Animal House]
Consider moving to Louisianna, better yet any inner city outside of Cali, hand out scholarships to drug dealers and junkies who dropped out of school in 8th grade to make a quick buck or get a quick high and change the world to a cooler place. You can do it; I have complete confidence in your ideas; love is all you need; you can make the world a better place... if you completely ignore human nature. But, when one of these potentially cool people tries to mug or kill you, perhaps you'll appreciate the cops that put their lives on the line where people aren't cool.

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the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[livendive 8]

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The cold hard fact of the matter is follows: this would have NEVER happened in Seattel, San Francisco, or anywhere in Canada, i.e. anywhere where ENLIGHTENED law enforcement occurs.

You mean like here (attached)?

Also, don't kid yourself. Seattle PD definitely have their problems, as do (I suspect) SFPD and the Mounties.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[livendive 8]

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SadisticSue, is it better for a cop to die or a criminal? (If one must die.)

That would depend on the individual cop and the individual criminal.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[BlueEyedMonster 0]

Hey SadSue! You are fun to play with

Before I start, here is an interesting article about black cops. http://www.city-journal.org/html/12_3_black_cops.html

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just yesterday I had lunch with an Indian couple who told me how they were treated like zoo creatures in Durham and in Houston,,,thsi is the inevitable consequence of lack of diversity

So what did they do about it? Did the couple educate and make friends, or did they accept the isolation and let the racism perpetuate? Closed minds usually don't open themselves, it takes someone to open the door.

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I'm not surprised that SF kicks such ass because THIS is what America is SUPPOSED to be about- diversity, tolerance, acceptance- that is why there is such solid financial strength and base here, and why a black guy can marry a white girl without dear of molotov cocktals being thrown thru the windows...

Don't forget that diversity also includes the right-wing religious fanatics. That is what America is supposed to be. A melding of everything. That includes right/left wing along with what you mentioned. I have a co-worker that sits next to me. He's a black guy, his wife is a skinny blond babe. He's never had the fear of molitov cocktails.

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To all of you who have schooled me...if I am ignorant of law enforcement techniques then I apologixe..

Apology accepted... And what an excellent opportunity to expand your diversity bu understanding those techniques and the reasons for them.

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..but ultimately, if the world you create is a cool one then it shouldn;t come to what happened on that tape,

We didn't create it. We are just a few little specs on it. So, slowly over 100's of years we will get better. But it will be generation by generation, not just *poof* were perfect tomorrow.

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let me not indict the conduct of those officers then, but the conduct of EVERY FUCKING CITIZEN of Lousiana who allows such a close minded world to exist where officers are forced to do that...if the guy had had an opportunity to go to college on a California style residency law then it wouldn't have happned, if there hadn';t been decades of racial gerrymandering where the guy grew up in a no hope slum....

Most states have low cost tuition for state residents. Quite honestly, because he is black, has more opportuinty for funding. The problem is generational poverty, and the fundamental belief that poor or minority people can't achieve what others can. The kid growing up in the slum thinks about being on top by being a supervisor at McDonald's? Why? He/She has the same potential that you or I have. The only thing stopping them is themselves. Yes there may be more barriers, but why not go around them?

So if you could spin a little bit of your Northern California magic, and make all these poor kids all over the country believe they can be anything.... That would solve many of our problems. And, you would then prevent many of the events like what you saw on the tape.

[TheAnvil 0]

Dammit! I should never post in the forums post-workout and pre-coffee. Adrenaline plus natural pre-coffee grouchiness (which helps for a great workout) make me a bit more aggressive than I normally am. Add to that my natural ire that comes with the stereotyping of Southerners as racist good ol' boys and any sort of racism in general, and my infamous smile ALMOST goes away.

Believe it or not, I was modelling away with my computer when I started thinking about that post for some odd reason. Thinking of that and a PM are what got me back here. You busted me, fair and square. My apologies to the group/SadSue. I hold my logic as tenable, but my method of presenting it was wrong. I should have generalized vice focused in on a single person and etc. Baaaaaaad Vinny. I'll drink coffee before any more early AM posts, I promise.

I'll read everyone else's Anvil-Slams and banter some more later, as I have to run to a meeting and actually do some work.

You got me jfields (Justin I believe?) - thanks for pointing it out.

Dammit! I'm late!

Beers to all,

Vinny the Anvil (still racially insensitive, Southern, and proud)

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[jfields 0]

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You busted me, fair and square.

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You got me jfields (Justin I believe?) - thanks for pointing it out.

Holy crap, that was well-taken. No sweat, Vinny. We all do it now and then. Like I said, I did agree with most of what you said.

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[skycop 0]

Holy Shit!!!
This thread is outta control!! Someone needs to call a cop!!! Just leave your cell phones in your pocket!!
Arguing this is like pissing in the wind, I think we all know who sides where!
I'm just sitting here at work (on my lunch, thank you)hoping to become the enlightened law
enforcement professional that sue wants!! So I guess I'll never leave the office and stay away from confrontations!
I'll use "I-messages" to solve my violent confrontations, give every bad-guy a great big hug, and never speak ill of those rowdy law breakers!!
Peace OUT!!!
Skycop

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[mjosparky 4]

Sue,
Looks like you are not doing very well with your posture. Oh well, life is a bitch and then you die.
Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[thethinker 0]

Silly sky diver....games are for kids! Im not involving myself in the debate...i frankly have no opinion...thus Im not providing any facts...lol. Sadsue, happens to be a friend thus Im supporting her, and when I see someone making childish remarks (such as ur posts) ill insert where i feel need be. I mean afterall you do have your little harem of tag a longs yeah? Ill man up and tell u wut a bint is, and a prat is...its uk slang, and its much like the common words for idiot, loser, morrion. No offense of course, its only the internet. And your right, there are no arguments on the way I post. I post specifically for the reactions i get. I love it!!! Narrow close minded and un-emotional people fascinate me I do love you replying to me however it gives me something to do. Talk soon im sure.

We do not have to visit a madhouse to find disordered minds; our planet is the mental institution of the universe.
-Johann von Goethe

[kmcguffee 0]

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but the conduct of EVERY FUCKING CITIZEN of Lousiana who allows such a close minded world to exist where officers are forced to do that

Damn, I sign on and am being blasted! I was born and raised in Louisiana. My father and grandfather were Louisiana troopers and Sheriffs. I'm a cop also.

Care to take a guess as to my education, racial opinions, and general intelligence SadSue?

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if the guy had had an opportunity to go to college on a California style residency law then it wouldn't have happned, if there hadn';t been decades of racial gerrymandering where the guy grew up in a no hope slum....

We've put plenty of college educated criminals in jail. What makes you think this guy was raised in a slum and didn't go to college? Are you making generalizations based on his race?

Sounds like you have some issues. Get out of California and experience the real world.

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin

[SadSue 0]

OK, I'll concur.... HATE IS ALL WE NEED... Just ask any american indian, IF you can find one.

Hope you don't get Banned!

[SadSue 0]

Thanks for your intelligent, well thought out reply!

All of your points are very well supported!

Hope you don't get Banned!

[SadSue 0]

Anvil, How nice to meet you.... Knock one back for me please

Hope you don't get Banned!

[SadSue 0]

Now Kev, I never said there was no crime in SF. That would be a ridiculous statement. I did say that people here get very upset when they hear about folks being gang banged by authority. That particular incident was plastered all over ever newpaper, TV/ Radio channel here and as you have read there was a public outcry.

Now for something for you guys to chew on.

http://www.amnesty.ca/usa/racism.htm

Hope you don't get Banned!

[SadSue 0]

I'm Laughing my ass off here,

Muwahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Hope you don't get Banned!

[SadSue 0]

Damn, I sign on and am being blasted! I was born and raised in Louisiana. My father and grandfather were Louisiana troopers and Sheriffs. I'm a cop also.

Care to take a guess as to my education, racial opinions, and general intelligence SadSue?
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No, I'm sure yer a really nice guy. You could have come down a lot harder

We've put plenty of college educated criminals in jail. What makes you think this guy was raised in a slum and didn't go to college? Are you making generalizations based on his race?
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No Sir!

I grew up in a low income world myself, and i therefore speak from experience: The less opportunity and skills you have, the more likely it is you will turn to crime. That's true for any group of disenfranchised people. It has nothing to do with race!

So Im sure your a nice person, and I'm sure your quite fair, Most law enforcement officers are. But how can you tell me the citizens you serve are as fair minded as you are, when they are willing to be as unfair as THIS:

http://www.amnesty.ca/usa/racism.htm


Take Care!!

Hope you don't get Banned!

[kmcguffee 0]

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Shareef Cousin’s conviction has been reversed on appeal and the murder charges against him dropped.

Looks to me like the system worked.

This article is comparing statistics between people of different races. The death penalty is decided based on the facts of the murder ie a home invasion murder is more likely to draw the death penalty than a murder over drugs, etc. They are going to have to add a little more detail to the article to make it valid. I'm not saying there isn't a difference, just that this article doesn't prove it. You can make this comparison across the country and find that it is the same if the population of different races is comparable to Louisiana.

Before I became a cop, I would have agreed that this was an unjustified shooting. Since becoming a cop and finding out how quick decisions on the street have to be made, I think this was a justified shooting. Race had nothing to do with it. The only times these incidents become newsworthy is when they are white cops shooting black suspects and hindsight shows there was no danger to the officer's lives. The problem is, the officers don't get the benefit of hindsight. They have to decide immediately.

If you ever get the chance, get into a FATS trainer. It is a realistic computer game that law enforcement uses to train officers in these types of situations. You will only have to do it once to understand.

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Ben Franklin

[Jib 0]

Why is the alleged victim of racism the same whether a white person kills a black person or a black person kills a white person? You don't hear much about dead hispanics, asians or indians as victims? IMHO the only victim should be the dead man, unless of course it was self-defense, etc.

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the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[juanesky 0]

SadSue,

I certainly hope and pray that you don't have the same attitude when you skydive, and think that you know it all, have all the solutions at hand, for it will most likely bring you bad times, and not only that you could be a risk to those around you.....

If you think you are superior because you live in a certain region, let me remind you, this is the same mentality Nazia had in WWII. Regardles you shell yourself in the good deed mode, but indeed you reflect and despise everyone that is not within your region, claiming that the area you live in is the only one trully enlightened in the world.....

Let me tell you also that even though you would like to divide CA in 2, it is still CA, and you were not able to even discuss the points of the SFPD police shootings either.....

SO if you are not even willing to concede that people are bound to make mistakes, then please, don't get on the same load I will ride to altitud...

Good luck

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon

[SadSue 0]

If you think there might be a difference, then why not put the death penalty on hold.... like they did in Illinois.

Nice post though, You learn something new every day.
Thanks for the update!

Hope you don't get Banned!

[juanesky 0]

One more interesting mention, never mind you also seem to be sadistic.....Very noble...

"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon