Hunting ethics

[Amazon 7]

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Then I swatted a mosquito . I'll swat the next one that lands on me, too, though

ALL mosquitos should die... they are evil....think of the millions of PEOPLE they have killed by biting them.

Malaria and West Nile are just a few of the things they can transmit to people.

This is one species I could support for extinction.

Amazon

[Vallerina 2]

The sources cited on the website were at least 11 years old. Some of the sources were even 30 years old. Newer studies have shown many of the "myths" as truths.

There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning

[BlueEyedMonster 0]

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Don't forget the bugs that get in the way of your windshield on the way to the dropzone.

Or, the one splattered on the visor of my Z1. I didn't wash it off because it looks cool. Kinda like a big buck on the wall.

[BlueEyedMonster 0]

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ALL mosquitos should die... they are evil....think of the millions of PEOPLE they have killed by biting them.

Malaria and West Nile are just a few of the things they can transmit to people.

This is one species I could support for extinction.

ha ha ha Funny. We too are on the food chain you know. And the same goes for us. If they have reason to (breeding) they can kill us too... whether or not it is intentional.

[PhillyKev 0]

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Then I swatted a mosquito . I'll swat the next one that lands on me, too, though

ALL mosquitos should die... they are evil....think of the millions of PEOPLE they have killed by biting them.

Malaria and West Nile are just a few of the things they can transmit to people.

This is one species I could support for extinction.

Amazon

Well, considering mosquito larvae is pretty close to the base of the food chain, that could be a bad thing. Although if they mutated into a non-blood sucking species, I'd be happy.

[78RATS 0]

I despise the "hunters" that feed grain right under the "blind". That ain't huntin.

Now cover yourself with mud and wait by the watering hole with a bowie knife clenched between your teeth - that's huntin.

Rat for Life - Fly till I die
When them stupid ass bitches ask why

[billvon 2,991]

>When land is cultivated to grow vegetables it is completely cleared
>and tilled. That kills and destroys the habitats of countless animals.

When growing grain for animals you must clear ten times the amount of land to generate the same amount of food for human consumption. If the animals themselves use it for grazing, they need twenty times the amount of land (since the usual yield enhancements like fertilizers are not used.) Since ranchers tend to use the minumum amount of land they can get away with, the land becomes overgrazed and is decimated.

>Nothing wrong with being a vegetarian, but don't pretend you're on
>some moral high ground.

It matters quite a bit if there's not enough food to go around. If that's the case, and you want to eat a lot of meat, nine other people have to go without food. It's hard to defend that as morally neutral.

[cptfunky 0]

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Some of the Euro guys seem to feel that private property rights are irrelevant.

yeah. because we're all fuckin commies

[PhillyKev 0]

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It's hard to defend that as morally neutral.

I buy free range, pasture fed beef. See the links for my morally neutral defense.

BTW, I've seen lots of figures thrown around for the amount of grain needed for beef, but never 10 times.

http://www.eatwild.com/environment.html

[billvon 2,991]

>BTW, I've seen lots of figures thrown around for the amount of grain
>needed for beef, but never 10 times.

From here :

Rice: 1250 kcal/sq m
Beef: 130 kcal/sq m

[Mindcake 0]

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I despise the "hunters" that feed grain right under the "blind". That ain't huntin.

Why???? let me tell you something...all forest critters can be patterened...every one of them..all hunting (by hunting I mean Killing of a animal) becomes easy if you take the time to learn their habits. having feed (by feed I mean like a bucket full not a mountain) may allow a hunter to take a better shot at a still target as opposed to a moving target, the end result is still a dead animal....does it really matter how it was killed as long as it was a quick death...

Once you learn how/where/when to find the game you seek then it isnt a challange anymore and it just becomes killing for food, and I am ok with that so long as "hunters" understand that they are taking a life.

Don´t belive the hype

[PhillyKev 0]

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>BTW, I've seen lots of figures thrown around for the amount of grain
>needed for beef, but never 10 times.

From here :

Rice: 1250 kcal/sq m
Beef: 130 kcal/sq m

Come on now. I'm sure I could find an equally inadequate comparison to skew it the other way. Even with your extreme example of a pure rice diet compared to a pure beef diet, it doesn't quite reach 10X. What are the figures for a "typical" omnivorous diet vs. a vegetarian diet?

And besides, that's a comparison of caloric value based on land area from two different food sources. A large portion of the land needed for the beef is grazing land, not cultivated crop land.

[billvon 2,991]

>What are the figures for a "typical" omnivorous diet vs. a vegetarian
>diet?

We weren't talking about what a typical diet was, just that you need ten times the land to raise a calorie of beef vs a calorie of rice. If someone's diet is all meat, they will need ten times the land. If it's half beef and half rice, they will need around five times the land. Half meat and half vegetables will be similar, but not the same since some meat animals need less feed and some need more. Some vegetables require more land and some less, etc.

>And besides, that's a comparison of caloric value based on land area
>from two different food sources.

Right, but I think it's valid since lack of calories is why people starve. Few ruminants (goats are an exception) can graze on completely unfarmable land.

[PhillyKev 0]

True, but the point I'm trying to make is that just because land is able to be farmed, doesn't mean it should. The links I posted above show evidence that land used for grazing promotes biodiversity and has less negative impact on the environment than farming.

And no one is starving because of a lack of food available, they starve because they can't get their hands on the abundant supply.

[billvon 2,991]

>The links I posted above show evidence that land used for grazing
> promotes biodiversity and has less negative impact on the
> environment than farming.

There are two issues there. One is sustainable agriculture; this can be applied to produce, dairy and meat through various strategies (like limited grazing, organic farming, crop rotation, farm layout etc.) The other is whether you can feed more carnivores, omnivores or vegetarians when food is in short supply, and vegetarians definitely win there.

>And no one is starving because of a lack of food available, they
>starve because they can't get their hands on the abundant supply.

That's definitely true in the US but isn't so true in other countries. In many places starvation happens because they can't grow enough food.

[PhillyKev 0]

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The other is whether you can feed more carnivores, omnivores or vegetarians when food is in short supply, and vegetarians definitely win there.

True, and if it ever comes to a point where our food supply is being used up by people consuming all of it and some people going without for that reason, than I'll consider the moral implications of eating meat. Until then, I'll take mine medium rare.

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[Jib 0]

IMHO the food pyramid is BS. A high protein diet (or at least balanced diet, e.g. Zone) is healthier than eating grains; so, the fact that it takes more space doesn't mean much to me.

--------------------------------------------------
the depth of his depravity sickens me.
-- Jerry Falwell, People v. Larry Flynt

[billvon 2,991]

>A high protein diet (or at least balanced diet, e.g. Zone) is healthier
> than eating grains; so, the fact that it takes more space doesn't
> mean much to me.

Your average american will live a lot longer if he switches from a diet of mostly meat to a diet of mostly vegetables and fruits.

[PhillyKev 0]

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Your average american will live a lot longer if he switches from a diet of mostly meat to a diet of mostly vegetables and fruits.

That's been pretty hotly contested. The original "food pyramid" was created at the behest of grain farmer lobbyists. Personally, I'm in the protein is healthier than carbs camp.

Atkins was a little extreme, and proved that an extremely high protein low carb diet does cause premature death due to a lack of balance when on ice.

[Jib 0]

[replyYour average american will live a lot longer if he switches from a diet of mostly meat to a diet of mostly vegetables and fruits.

[Perky77 0]

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Now cover yourself with mud and wait by the watering hole with a bowie knife clenched between your teeth - that's huntin.

You could see me??

My rules, been hunting since I was 6,
you shoot you kill, one shot.
you kill it you clean it, and eat it
Respect what you hunt!!! You don't have to kill everything you see.
don't display it on your hood or hanging out the back of your truck, if you want to display it, in honor, have it mounted and put it in your house.

I also disagree with the truck blind user hunters, put some challenge in it, don't just be a trigger happy blood thursty poacher. Enjoy being in the woods....get out of the truck and walk.

[AggieDave 6]

A balanced diet with the right ratio of complex carbs and protein is what the body needs to be healthy. Its not just the protein either (i.e. toffu is shitty for protein for the following reason), it has to do with complete amino acid chains, also. Those are found in meat, specifically red meat.

Like stated before, people in America would be much healthier if they skipped McDonalds, didn't drink 64oz Cokes and ate a good balanced diet. With lots of water.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[w4p2 0]

Once again I left the bridge just at the time this thread became alive, so I have more than 12 hours catching up to do. Generally what I have seen, I am impressed with. It appears that the generally accepted ethics and methods are pretty much the same, weather in US or north Europe. Later on in this post I will bring up the subjects of silencer use, hand gun hunting and bow hunting with cross bows. However, before that I will answer my favorite DD
sharp shooter Same-specialist nemesis, AMAZON regarding some of my the gear:

Amazon: With regard to the gear I just checked my wallet and found that I have the license with me, I am not very good at throwing names but as I have them in front of me here we go, you asked for it: (statement in brackets my own clarification of use).

Rifles:

SAKO TRG 30-06 / sniper with ZEIS variable.
( with flame suppressor or silencer and bipod. Stainless steel over vinyl stock, Used for long range
shooting of canadian goose, eider, sea and forrest goose and very seldom for moose and deer)

SAKO Finnfire 22 / ZEIS variable + silencer
(my favorite gun for eider, duck, mallard pidgeon etc. I use it and I am invisible)

SIG/SAUER 2x twelve gauge over single 222 Drilling
with Zeis variable.
(seldom used, too expensive to crawl around with)

Valmet 212 base with number of exchange over & under barrels and optics for anything between big game and goose.)

Shotguns:

Remington SP-10 ( 10 gauge magnum, my all around shotgun of choise)

Remington 870, 12 gauge, various barrels ( my light brush shotgun)

Valmet Leijona 12 gauge over & under (general purpose)

Handguns:

Ruger KMK 678 heavy barrel / stainless with aimpoint and silencer ( My back pack poacher, used when out at the islands out of season to nick of a meal now and then)

Taurus 357 mag with scope (just had to have it)

Colt 1911 / 45, Norinco 45, Glock 9 mm etc... used for practical competitions before it became a rambo game.

There are somewhat over 40 guns on my license but I just took a pick on my favorites. Without bragging on my capabilities lets put it this way: I have been shooting / hunting over 40 years and there was a time in my life when I was doing it on professional basis.... AND WITH THIS BACKGROUND I AM FLAMING YOU AND YOUR 300 YARD RUNNING HEAD SHOTS AS UNETHICAL BS. Matter closed on my behalf.

Now that I have got that one out of my system, to the real topics:

1) Use of silencer: Became legal in Finland roughly 10 years ago.... superb and recommended. Reduced the environmental noise impact to 0 and for instance in my case resulted to almost exclusive 22/rifle hunting of small game. Still illegal in US I think?

2) I do not know how it is now, but last time I was bow hunting in USA the use of cross bow was illegal
(Louisiana 2000). In Scandinavia as well. I find it strange... because should I have a choice... stalking
big game with CB would be my preferred hunting method. Experiences / opinions?

3) Hand gun hunting, illegal in Scandinavia for reason beyond my understanding. Would be excellent
for stalking dear & moose in brush. Experiences?

Well thats it for time being. Looking forward to your comments.

Cheers JL

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[smiles 0]

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/binladen/

Smiles

[w4p2 0]

On that instance I would have to part with my "if you shoot it, you eat it policy"

Or on the other hand

It could be interesting in the "odd foods" thread.

Now thinking the matter more closely,

my "if you shoot it you eat it" policy could be adapted on wider use for bringing the end to the wars or if not, at least to hunger.

Well well well... these just might be the founding moments of international Kill It Eat It Society for Eternal Peace.

Now who would like to be a general in a world ruled by KIEISEP- society.

Cheers: JL