DSE 5
Recommended Posts
Quote
So sounds like both you and Diablopilot are recommending that illusioneer deploy his main on a 1K emergency exit?
I can't speak for diablo, but I am/was not saying that.
My cutoff, with my canopy is still about 1.8K as it opens pretty slow and I don't want to be sniveling anywhere close to 1K.
- - -
I am not afraid of tomorrow, for I have seen yesterday and I love today.
I am not afraid of tomorrow, for I have seen yesterday and I love today.
FIRST of all-I do not pretend to be anything other than a beginning jumper 101 jumps is all I have (it is right next to my name), and I have not jumped in 12 years.... 
I was only saying that with with the speed of the plane on a 1-2 second delay I was horizontal to the ground and looking up at the 182 as it flew away while the chute was opening. I did not look at my altimeter but I would would be surprised if I was below 925ft after it was open.
FYI- AAD's were kinda new and no one other than the student rigs had them, so I don't know what will make them fire or not...Didn't have to worry about that.
Now I may be FAT, OLD, FORGETFUL, and UGLY but I am NOT FULL OF SH*T! 
AFFI 0
QuoteI am NOT FULL OF SH*T!
QuoteI was only saying that
More accurately, what you said was “over 1k gives you time to be open cut away if needed and on reserve....”
I guess 12k is over 1k, and so is 1001’ eh?
You did not specify how much over 1k you were referring to, but it came across to those who did not read it correctly (at least to me) that 1k was enough altitude (for the club you were jumping at) sufficient for clear and pulls – and - that jumping from 1k allows time for a jumper to exit, deploy the main and still have enough altitude if there was a problem with the main to initiate emergency procedures for a partial malfunction.
This defies all of the better practices of safe philosophies concerning skydiving that I have been subjected to thus far.
Quotewith the speed of the plane on a 1-2 second delay I was horizontal to the ground and looking up at the 182 as it flew away while the chute was opening. I did not look at my altimeter but I would be surprised if I was below 925ft after it was open.
Horizontal to the ground meaning:
You were belly to earth (horizontal) or standing up (vertical)?
If you are saying that your canopy was open 75 feet after exiting a 182 then you may be mistaken.
The reason some of us are particular about the validity, or if you will, accuracy of such statements is that there are up and coming jumpers who read these forums and I certainly would not want any jumper to get the idea in their head that making exits from 1,000’AGL is sufficient altitude to initiate EPs for a partial malfunction.
So anytime anyone makes statements that are outside the realm of safe possibilities, many of us here will question such claims. Furthermore, when a trained skydiver makes such claims, there is the potential that some may question the validity of their "training".
Mykel AFF-I10
Skydiving Priorities: 1) Open Canopy. 2) Land Safely. 3) Don’t hurt anyone. 4) Repeat…
Skydiving Priorities: 1) Open Canopy. 2) Land Safely. 3) Don’t hurt anyone. 4) Repeat…
QuoteSo sounds like both you and Diablopilot are recommending that illusioneer deploy his main on a 1K emergency exit?
You are assuming something. Bad idea. In no way did I recommend such a thing, I claified something you stated, and add a small peice of information to anyones tool box that might read it.
QuoteEither way, the Cypres isn't likely to fire if you have a low speed mal on a 1K "hop n' pop" emergency exit, right?
Depends at what altitude you chop fom the mal. Chop at less than 300 feet and you're unlikely to ceate enough speed for a fie before impact.
I HIGHLY recommend everyone who owns an AAD ead the manual and understand all of it's fiing parameters.
Making the infomed decision to deploy a main at 1000ft sub terminal, is far better than blindly doing so with a reserve and no information. It's all about knowing the limits of your gear.
----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.
billvon 2,989
.thumb.jpg.4bb795e2eaf21b8b300039a5e1ec7f92.jpg)
>the Expert Cypress fires at 750ft...but makes the "decision" at 1K.
Not really. It makes the decision to fire and then fires milliseconds later. The "makes the decision at 1K" myth arises because when you deploy your main at (say) 900 feet, the cypres will continue to see a descent as you rotate into a head-high position (which means higher pressure over the reserve container, which translates to a lower sensed altitude.) Thus a cypres will fire at around 1000 feet back-to-earth, somewhat lower in a standing attitude and 750 feet if belly-to-earth. In all cases the cypres fires when its firing parameters are met, and does not "delay" 250 feet.
>You're moving too slow to pop it at 1k (decision) and moving too slow to
>pop it at 750.
The cypres will fire if its descent rate is exceeded (and certain other parameters are met) between an altitude of ~750 and ~130 feet. (All from the cypres manual.)
>Either way, the Cypres isn't likely to fire if you have a low speed mal on a
>1K "hop n' pop" emergency exit, right?
If you begin a descent from 1000 feet the cypres is unlikely to save you, as a jumper at Rantoul discovered a few years back.
>So sounds like both you and Diablopilot are recommending that illusioneer
>deploy his main on a 1K emergency exit?
Would depend on a great many factors. If the choice was a large CRW canopy or a smaller reserve, you're probably better off with the CRW canopy. If it's a Velocity 79 vs a PD113, your reserve is probably the better choice. Also keep in mind that a stable exit is _not_ necessarily the best exit if you are going to use your reserve at such an altitude - a PC in the burble might well take many seconds to clear.
Also keep in mind that this is a bit like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. If there is an aircraft emergency so serious that it merits a bailout at 1000 feet, getting out and deploying anything is going to take some large measure of luck.
Not really. It makes the decision to fire and then fires milliseconds later. The "makes the decision at 1K" myth arises because when you deploy your main at (say) 900 feet, the cypres will continue to see a descent as you rotate into a head-high position (which means higher pressure over the reserve container, which translates to a lower sensed altitude.) Thus a cypres will fire at around 1000 feet back-to-earth, somewhat lower in a standing attitude and 750 feet if belly-to-earth. In all cases the cypres fires when its firing parameters are met, and does not "delay" 250 feet.
>You're moving too slow to pop it at 1k (decision) and moving too slow to
>pop it at 750.
The cypres will fire if its descent rate is exceeded (and certain other parameters are met) between an altitude of ~750 and ~130 feet. (All from the cypres manual.)
>Either way, the Cypres isn't likely to fire if you have a low speed mal on a
>1K "hop n' pop" emergency exit, right?
If you begin a descent from 1000 feet the cypres is unlikely to save you, as a jumper at Rantoul discovered a few years back.
>So sounds like both you and Diablopilot are recommending that illusioneer
>deploy his main on a 1K emergency exit?
Would depend on a great many factors. If the choice was a large CRW canopy or a smaller reserve, you're probably better off with the CRW canopy. If it's a Velocity 79 vs a PD113, your reserve is probably the better choice. Also keep in mind that a stable exit is _not_ necessarily the best exit if you are going to use your reserve at such an altitude - a PC in the burble might well take many seconds to clear.
Also keep in mind that this is a bit like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. If there is an aircraft emergency so serious that it merits a bailout at 1000 feet, getting out and deploying anything is going to take some large measure of luck.
This is not an argument I really think should have been... All new jumpers should listen to your instructors!
I do not have the experience to advise anyone on doing anything other than what is standard safe jumping! I was not suggesting any deviation from safe jumping, just telling what I thought I remembered from 12 years ago.
I do not have the experience to advise anyone on doing anything other than what is standard safe jumping! I was not suggesting any deviation from safe jumping, just telling what I thought I remembered from 12 years ago.
can you clarify? I was under the impression that a cypres wouldn't fire until you'd exceeded the activation height of 1500ft - emergency exit at 1200ft would therefore not have any impact on the cypres?
I think i'm a bit confused by a couple of differing posts in this thread. Cheers 
Quote3000ft?? You might want to ask your instructors again...
I do hop&pops between 2800-3000ft, I think it would be pretty ridiculous to use your reserve at that altitude. I can understand pulling silver on a 1800-2000ft exit, 1500 for sure. But 3000 ft is more than enough altitude
Incidentally, I made my lowest exit yet yesterday. I was practicing accuracy and we exited a C182 at ~2100'.
It was plenty high - I waited about 3 seconds and pulled and still had 1500' to deal with any issues.
I actually thought it was especially exciting to get out that low.
If you look at illusioneer's profile you can see that the gear he jumped 12 years ago did not have a Cypres or a slow opening main. I'm only 28, but I hear back in the early days of skydiving rounds they would deploy lower than we do today on our high performance canopies.
I've done a freefall from 300' using my BASE rig. I would say that your emergency exit altitude should depend on the gear that's on your back.
I've done a freefall from 300' using my BASE rig. I would say that your emergency exit altitude should depend on the gear that's on your back.
hackish 8
I enjoy these discussions because we can all learn from them.
I was told that the jumpmaster would tell us on an emergency exit if we're to use the reserve, otherwise he would just grab our pilot and throw us out the door.
I've been consistently told that it takes 1000' for a parachute to open. I've always disagreed but need more jumps to observe better. Last time I finished all my tasks, control checks and such from a 3500 IAD I was at 2800. Does part of this come from the kinetic energy from the plane causing me to pass through 1000' of air (some of it in the forward direction???)
Suppose you did go for the main with a 1500' exit. If you passed 1000' at high speed as your main is opening and the AAD did fire would the proper procedure be to cut away the main or just leave them both up and hope they fly side by side?
I understand there there isn't any easy way to cut away the reserve but suppose the reserve did fail and you threw out the main pilot then the main would come out wouldn't it?
-Michael
I was told that the jumpmaster would tell us on an emergency exit if we're to use the reserve, otherwise he would just grab our pilot and throw us out the door.
I've been consistently told that it takes 1000' for a parachute to open. I've always disagreed but need more jumps to observe better. Last time I finished all my tasks, control checks and such from a 3500 IAD I was at 2800. Does part of this come from the kinetic energy from the plane causing me to pass through 1000' of air (some of it in the forward direction???)
Suppose you did go for the main with a 1500' exit. If you passed 1000' at high speed as your main is opening and the AAD did fire would the proper procedure be to cut away the main or just leave them both up and hope they fly side by side?
I understand there there isn't any easy way to cut away the reserve but suppose the reserve did fail and you threw out the main pilot then the main would come out wouldn't it?
-Michael
riggerrob 643
Propwash is far too small to affect opening.
You would be wiser to ask the pilot for an extra twenty or thirty or forty knots of airspeed before you exit.
Not likely to happen during an emergency ...
The conversation will probably end with: "Shut the F up and get out of my airplane!"
Hee!
Hee!
You would be wiser to ask the pilot for an extra twenty or thirty or forty knots of airspeed before you exit.
Not likely to happen during an emergency ...
The conversation will probably end with: "Shut the F up and get out of my airplane!"
Hee!
Hee!
Either way, the Cypres isn't likely to fire if you have a low speed mal on a 1K "hop n' pop" emergency exit, right?
So sounds like both you and Diablopilot are recommending that illusioneer deploy his main on a 1K emergency exit?
Share this post
Link to post
Share on other sites