King air Horizontal stabilizer injury

[Yourmother 0]

Just wondered if we could get a better report on the events that led to this injury.....For all king air DZs

[BillyVance 34]

Quite a few people have struck the King Air horizontal stabilizer. One girl did it at the Pell City DZ a while back when they had a King Air. Broke her arm.

Simply put, DON'T do a poised exit by jumping up in a big stance into the wind. Many King Air pilots don't cut all that much power for exit.

Now that I'm jumping Mullins King Air this weekend in a birdman suit for the first time, man I am gonna have to ball up on exit for a second then open up, otherwise it's gonna be bad!

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[jakee 1,497]

I often exit the King Air on my back, it's fun to do, and I can see the damn tailplane pass over me before opening my wings up

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[monkycndo 0]

I learned in a KA. As long as you don't jump up, the horizontal stabilizer is not much of an issue.

Billy, when you go out in a WS, hop out, keep your wings tucked and your head up to watch the plane. As soon as you see any part of the HS, open the wings and off you go. Only takes a second. Even from rear float it is not that big a deal.

50 donations so far. Give it a try.

You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

[MakeItHappen 15]

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Just wondered if we could get a better report on the events that led to this injury.....For all king air DZs

I don't know the details of the accident you are refering to.

But in the old news category you might try this article.

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Make It Happen
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DiveMaker

[DJL 235]

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Many King Air pilots don't cut all that much power for exit.

I've jumped every single exit imaginable out of our King Air including a ton of CRW with poised exits. No prob with the HS to date. The one and only BM jump I've done I tucked just as a matter of my training. Having seen some of the lift people get out the door I would advise all to tuck with a birdman first out of low tail aircraft. We also have a very firm understanding at our DZ that you don't even dream of getting out of the plane until the pilot is configured for jump run.

"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher

[AFFI 0]

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don't even dream of getting out of the plane until the pilot is configured for jump run.

Unless of course there is an emergency situation - a year or two back there was an emergency exit out of a Beech, several jumpers had to bail out around 2k, one person did a poised exit and was KO'd by the HS - Cypress fire saved the life.

There is a philosophy that dictated teaching newcomers to the sport the importance of a diving for emergency exits for this very reason.
I believe that it is a philosophy worthy of consideration.

Mykel AFF-I10
Skydiving Priorities: 1) Open Canopy. 2) Land Safely. 3) Don’t hurt anyone. 4) Repeat…

[riggerrob 643]

Diving exit wastes fewer seconds in the doorway.

[piratemike 0]

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don't even dream of getting out of the plane until the pilot is configured for jump run.

We do hop-n-pops out of our king air a lot, the pilot doesn't put down the flaps, and sometimes doesn't even level off all that much. You just tuck and go out, no jumping up, it's never been a problem.

I've seen two videos of stalls in king airs. They both involved people on the back seats.

Don't sit back there, during climb or exit. During climb the plane climbs more efficiently with the weight farther forward, during exit, given a very specific turn of events you can contribute heavily to the stall sitting back there.

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[pilotdave 0]

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During climb the plane climbs more efficiently with the weight farther forward

I've heard that from a lot of people (including pilots), but I don't think it's true. It'd depend on the plane and where the CG is, but an aft CG will normally result in a (slightly) faster rate of climb, shorter takeoff, and even faster cruise speed.

CG has to be kept within limits, but I think a lot of people have a mistaken idea that a forward CG is always better.

The horizontal stabilizer produces downward lift, to hold the tail town and the nose up. A wing generates a nose-down moment when producing lift, so the stabilizer is needed to counter it. But the farther forward the CG is, the more "negative lift" the stabilizer has to make. All that lift downward is exactly equivalent to added weight. Pull the CG aft and it's like reducing the weight of the plane. To create that downward lift, the elevator is pulled up. That adds drag.

Aft CG decreases the aircraft's longitudinal stability. But as long as it's kept within limits, there's nothing wrong with an aft CG. Problem is that we can't see where our current CG is or know what the limits are in terms of where we're sitting in the plane. So it's safest to keep the CG forward. Especially true on exit when jumpers like to move toward the door, shifting the CG farther and farther aft.

Dave

[billvon 2,997]

> During climb the plane climbs more efficiently with the weight farther forward . . .

That is, in general, a myth that pilots like to promulgate. Because although it is generally not true, there have been more slow/stall problems with aft CG's than with forward CG's - and forward CG's are more of a problem on landing than anywhere else, when skydivers have already exited.

[riggerrob 643]

I've seen two videos of stalls in king airs. They both involved people on the back seats.

Don't sit back there, during climb or exit.

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To further your logic, sitting behind the doorframe is BANNED ALL THE TIME at Pitt Meadows. The pilot fears that too much weight, too far aft - even during loading - will tilt our King Air back on its tail. The aft fuselage on King Airs is pretty fragile.
King Air tail repairs start at $30,000!

[diablopilot 2]

Also seen it done on a Caravan.


When loading, weight should be foward before the tail is loaded. IMO the LAST slot on a Caravan that should ever be filled for takeoff is the spot in the tail. After takeoff if the pilot allows than someone can shift into that slot. I have had pilots in Caravans say that on lighter loads they like having someone back there to adjust the CG, but not for takeoff.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[denete 3]

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We do hop-n-pops out of our king air a lot, the pilot doesn't put down the flaps, and sometimes doesn't even level off all that much. You just tuck and go out, no jumping up, it's never been a problem.

This might be a silly question, but what do you mean by "tuck"? Kind of a reversed arch?

- David

SCR #14809

"our attitude is the thing most capable of keeping us safe"
(look, grab, look, grab, peel, punch, punch, arch)

[AFFI 0]

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This might be a silly question, but what do you mean by "tuck"? Kind of a reversed arch?

Loke a Cannonball off a diving board?

[piratemike 0]

By tuck, I do mean a reverse arch. Sort of a reverse arch while diving out of the door.

And I kind of feel like I do it to get out of the plane faster to avoid the wind.

[Grips 0]

I am wondering about tall people doing poised exits on the Caravan?

I am 6'4". Is this anything to be concerned about?

[diablopilot 2]

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I am wondering about tall people doing poised exits on the Caravan?

I am 6'4". Is this anything to be concerned about?

I don't think it's any sort of problem. You are not jumping "up" out of the door are you? It's a bad idea on ANY aircraft.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[billeisele 130]

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I am wondering about tall people doing poised exits on the Caravan?

I am 6'4". Is this anything to be concerned about?

I have not hit it yet - but don't jump up.

Give one city to the thugs so they can all live together. I vote for Chicago where they have strict gun laws.

[BillyVance 34]

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I am wondering about tall people doing poised exits on the Caravan?

I am 6'4". Is this anything to be concerned about?

I have not hit it yet - but don't jump up.

I'm 5'-6" and ten years ago made a poised exit out of a king air on a crw jump, fired the pc right out the door and it went over the stabilizer. I ended up with 7 or 8 line twists, fabric burn the entire length of the bridle and the next guy to exit after me got a brown streak in his britches.

Ever since, I've made sure to count one-one thousand then pitch.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[billeisele 130]

I have not hit it yet - but don't jump up.

I'm 5'-6" and ten years ago made a poised exit out of a king air on a crw jump, fired the pc right out the door and it went over the stabilizer. I ended up with 7 or 8 line twists, fabric burn the entire length of the bridle and the next guy to exit after me got a brown streak in his britches.

Ever since, I've made sure to count one-one thousand then pitch.



hop n' pop vs. pop n' hop

Give one city to the thugs so they can all live together. I vote for Chicago where they have strict gun laws.

[JohnMitchell 16]

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But in the old news category you might try this article.

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Jan wrote as if that were the first time. Back in the 80s, a jumper exiting solo from an old Twin Beech struck his head on the horizontal stabilizer and never deployed his canopy. It was on a night jump, I believe it was in CA, and it was the combination of big suit, aggressive exit, and the aircraft in a nose high, full power configuration.

If I have to leave a plane in an unusual configuration, I leave in a tuck.