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Gawain 0
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Aggiedave picks up a ten foot pole, starts to poke, then runs away screaming...
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."
Gawain 0
QuoteAggiedave picks up a ten foot pole, starts to poke, then runs away screaming...
Aw c'mon Dave...no need to scream...
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
probably 10 acres of super computers somewhere thast flags all buzz words, and phrases...
every move you make every breath you take i'll be watching you.........
Accelerate hard to get them looking, then slam on the fronts and rollright beside the car, hanging the back wheel at eye level for a few seconds. Guaranteed reaction- Dave Sonsky
every move you make every breath you take i'll be watching you.........
Accelerate hard to get them looking, then slam on the fronts and rollright beside the car, hanging the back wheel at eye level for a few seconds. Guaranteed reaction- Dave Sonsky
Quoteprobably 10 acres of super computers somewhere thast flags all buzz words, and phrases...
Yep...certainly is. I have forgotten the name of it but there has been a system intercepting fax, voice, and email for a loooong time. Hell...the CIA even uses the same sort of system to screen resumes. The only way a person will read it is if you have enough of the right words in it to warrant further review.
Scoby 0
QuoteI do feel that our basic right to privacy has gone out the window already.
I've always been baffled by people who claim to love this country and it's freedoms, but are perfectly willing to let those freedoms go. What exactly is it you love anyway? I don't mean this as a personal attack by any means. It just seems to me that the appeal of the US is the personal freedoms. Without that, it's just another country, right? Right?
Gawain 0
Quote.... I have forgotten the name of it but there has been a system intercepting fax, voice, and email for a loooong time......
Everything is still denied, but I believe you are referring to NSA's system supposedly called: ECHELON
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Scoby 0
QuoteHELLO? Do you realize we are at war? Does the term for the greater good mean anything to you?
We are at war? I don't remember Congress declaring war. Oh, the war on terror? Like the war on drugs? And the war on poverty? By those standards, we've been at war perpetually.
Look, we are not at war, so please don't use that as justification for dismantling all that is worthwhile about the US. I can understand why our leaders feed us this crap. What I can't understand is why the sheep are eating it up.
Scoby 0
QuoteQuote.... I have forgotten the name of it but there has been a system intercepting fax, voice, and email for a loooong time......
Everything is still denied, but I believe you are referring to NSA's system supposedly called: ECHELON
There is also a system called CARNIVORE that allegedly does the same thing.
QuoteThere is also a system called CARNIVORE
Yeah.....thats them. I think Eshcelon was the original and Carnivore is the update. I haven't read up on them recently so my memory is a bit fuzzy on it.
Gawain 0
QuoteQuoteI do feel that our basic right to privacy has gone out the window already.
I've always been baffled by people who claim to love this country and it's freedoms, but are perfectly willing to let those freedoms go. What exactly is it you love anyway? I don't mean this as a personal attack by any means. It just seems to me that the appeal of the US is the personal freedoms. Without that, it's just another country, right? Right?
I understand your point of view, I don't agree 100% that's all. Just what personal freedoms have I lost over the past 15 years?
-Does the Govt impose its will in determining what kind of car I drive? NO
-Does the Govt impose its will in determining where I live? NO
-Does the Govt impose its will in who I see/socialize with? NO
-Does the Govt impose its will in what I buy at the grocery store? NO (yes, the FDA is there, but it doesn't force me to buy Corn Flakes when I really want Lucky Charms)
-Does the Govt impose its will in determining how I pursue my career? NO (if anything, the private sector has more road blocks up than the Fed in terms of qualifications, requirements, etc.)
-Does the Govt impose its will on how many children I may have (presuming I make that choice with a mate)? NO
-Does the Govt impose its will on what I may read, write, vote, express, observe or demonstrate? NO
-Does the Govt impose its will on how late I sleep in on the weekend? NO
-Does the Govt impose its will on what kind of beer I buy for the DZ? NO
Is any of this going to change under the new Homeland Security Act? NO ----- WHY? Because, as much as you think no one knows what you're doing, you've been an open book for years. Otherwise you wouldn't get so much junk mail, so much spam, etc. Enterprise Marketing companies had you nailed eons ago. When you use your "savings" card at the grocery store, you don't think there's a data mining company that tailoring promotions to you based on whether you buy Doritos or Granola?
So what personal freedoms do you not have, that you feel you had 5, 10, 20, 30 years ago? I want to know.
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
QuoteSo what personal freedoms do you not have, that you feel you had 5, 10, 20, 30 years ago? I want to know.
*cough*gun rights*cough*
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."
Gawain 0
Quote*cough*gun rights*cough*
Touche...in the purest form...but are you really prevented from buying and owning a gun?
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
QuoteWhen you use your "savings" card at the grocery store
Exactly the reason I didn't use those things for years. Until I found one laying in the parking lot at work a couple months ago....
QuoteQuoteprobably 10 acres of super computers somewhere thast flags all buzz words, and phrases...
Yep...certainly is. I have forgotten the name of it but there has been a system intercepting fax, voice, and email for a loooong time. Hell...the CIA even uses the same sort of system to screen resumes. The only way a person will read it is if you have enough of the right words in it to warrant further review.
NSA - National Security Agency - Mission: Signals Intercept. 9 story building. 4 above ground, 5 below. It's functioning is so secret that it makes the CIA look like the Home Shopping Network.
"The National Security Agency is the largest spy agency in the United States, and perhaps the world. Twice as big as the CIA, the NSA eavesdrops on communications worldwide. "
"News cameras have never been allowed inside the ultra-secret agency - until now. Martin provides a look at America's most secret spy agency, which is on 350 acres south of Baltimore, studded with giant antennas and protected by barbed wire and guard dogs. "
"Does the NSA eavesdrop? "We're involved in signals intelligence," Hayden said.
"Signals intelligence means operating listening posts all over the world to intercept billions of radio transmissions, phone calls, emails and faxes and to uncover terrorist plots and other foreign threats to the United States. "
Billions.
How good are they?
"Conversations of air defense gunners preparing to take a shot at an American plane over Iraq are monitored and warnings are sent out via a top-secret chat room. "
Read the entire article. Pretty interesting.
CBS news
The name of the system is Echelon.
"Echelon is an attempt to capture all satellite, microwave, cellular and fiber-optic communications worldwide, including communications to and from the United States. U.S. National Security Agency (NSA) computers then use sophisticated filtering technology to sort through e-mails, faxes and phone conversations in search of certain keywords or other "flags." Other intelligence agencies apparently ask the NSA to flag specific words, phrases, organizations or people for surveillance purposes. "
The words "all" and "worldwide" are pretty impressive in the first line.
Echelon
"Born from a seven-page presidential memorandum signed by President Truman, the NSA is the largest, wealthiest, most powerful and least known secret agency in our government. "
Whew!
Quotebut are you really prevented from buying and owning a gun?
No...but I have been restricted as to what types and buried in govt. buraucracy. I found it appaulling in North Carolina that in order to buy a handgun you have to go to the Sheriff's Department and get a "Buy Permit" which costs $5 and can take several weeks to get. Oh yeah....and in certain jurisdictions like Fayetteville you can only get 5 permits per month. If they can't outlaw it they'll just try and make it such a hassle that the average person just gives up. Bullshit if you ask me. In Montana I can walk in and buy as many guns as I can afford and the NCIC check only takes a couple minutes. That's the way it should be!!!
Scoby 0
So the much vaunted American freedoms are the right to choose Hot Pockets over Jose Ole frozen burritos and the right to get a Chevy instead of a Ford? Pardon me if I'm unimpressed.
The right to privacy is fundamental to a free society. I do not want to censor my speech because someone may be listening, no matter how remote the possibility. You may be a perfect citizen, but I certainly do say and write things that other people might not like, both in seriousness and in jest.
I realize that our preferences and purchases have been tracked for years by private industry. However, I am not okay with it. And when I use my "savings card" at the grocery store, some data mining company is noting how many Doritos some guy named "Rick Kowalski" is buying...
The right to privacy is fundamental to a free society. I do not want to censor my speech because someone may be listening, no matter how remote the possibility. You may be a perfect citizen, but I certainly do say and write things that other people might not like, both in seriousness and in jest.
I realize that our preferences and purchases have been tracked for years by private industry. However, I am not okay with it. And when I use my "savings card" at the grocery store, some data mining company is noting how many Doritos some guy named "Rick Kowalski" is buying...
OMIGOD!! You can only buy five guns per month?? That's only sixty guns per year!!!QuoteOh yeah....and in certain jurisdictions like Fayetteville you can only get 5 permits per month.
Speed Racer
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QuoteThat's only sixty guns per year!!!
Yep.....and I'm certainly not going to go out and buy 60 guns per year even if I could afford it. However, I am highly irritated by the fact that the govt is interfering in private commerce.
Scoby 0
QuoteYep.....and I'm certainly not going to go out and buy 60 guns per year even if I could afford it. However, I am highly irritated by the fact that the govt is interfering in private commerce.
Well, it's better than living in Texas, where the dildo control laws mean that a women can only own 5 dildos in total! What's funny is that a lot of people who think gun control is an abomination are probably all in favor of dildo control. Which is not to say you are, of course...
Gawain 0
QuoteSo the much vaunted American freedoms are the right to choose Hot Pockets over Jose Ole frozen burritos and the right to get a Chevy instead of a Ford? Pardon me if I'm unimpressed.
Did you happen to miss the other 7 bullet points I cited? Freedom is about choice. Freedom is an environment where we may pursue life, liberty and happiness. Choice in how I get educated, choice in political affiliation, choice of religion, choice of where I live, choice of who I live with. Not just the choice, but the environment to have these opportunities available. I submit to you that we have these things.
QuoteThe right to privacy is fundamental to a free society. I do not want to censor my speech because someone may be listening, no matter how remote the possibility. You may be a perfect citizen, but I certainly do say and write things that other people might not like, both in seriousness and in jest.
This is the Internet and anyone/everyone, ad infinitum, is listening and/or reading what we write here. Is that an infringement on our privacy?
QuoteAnd when I use my "savings card" at the grocery store, some data mining company is noting how many Doritos some guy named "Rick Kowalski" is buying...
How does that affect Rick Kowalski's life, liberties and privacy? You are now having a direct impact on that, crunch on that.
So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
QuoteWhich is not to say you are, of course...
Absolutely not!!! I think women should be able to own as many toys as they like. They should also be required to demonstrate proper use for me....
Scoby 0
QuoteDid you happen to miss the other 7 bullet points I cited? Freedom is about choice. Freedom is an environment where we may pursue life, liberty and happiness. Choice in how I get educated, choice in political affiliation, choice of religion, choice of where I live, choice of who I live with. Not just the choice, but the environment to have these opportunities available. I submit to you that we have these things.
And I submit to you that the rest of the western world has these things too. But it's not enough to point out what freedoms we have left when the important ones are being eroded. Having your speech monitored by the government is a chilling of the freedom of speech.
QuoteThis is the Internet and anyone/everyone, ad infinitum, is listening and/or reading what we write here. Is that an infringement on our privacy?
That is a straw man. I'm not arguing against people reading what other people have to say. I'm arguing against the government monitoring and aggregating it.
QuoteHow does that affect Rick Kowalski's life, liberties and privacy? You are now having a direct impact on that, crunch on that.
Sorry, if it wasn't obvious, "Rick Kowalski" isn't a real person. Data from savings cards has already been used in lawsuits. I choose to add some random noise to the data.
Scoby 0
QuoteAbsolutely not!!! I think women should be able to own as many toys as they like. They should also be required to demonstrate proper use for me....
Right...perhaps proficiency tests should be required for both!
I never said Iraq was an extreme Islamic movement.
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!
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