skreamer 1 #76 October 30, 2002 My bad, should've checked - my knowledge of Von Braun and his rocket programme only stretches as far as a National Geographic documentary I once saw. Wasn't he involved in making the Messerschmit fighter jets that came out right at the end of the war? If Germany had had those jets four years earlier the Battle of Britain might've had a very different outcome.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #77 October 30, 2002 "Trumpeting its benefits is like telling someone with breast cancer how cool tumor biology is, and how good breast cancer is for US research facilities. " Exactly! I also agree with your comments on a conditional response led by the U.N. should Iraq chose to defy sanctions any further. Key words: Should and U.N., not in case they do soon and U.S. led with whoever else they can talk into doing so... "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
antimike 0 #78 October 30, 2002 For one I'm not delusional. You know I'm totally amazed at the narrow minded people who post absured opinions. Quit getting your news from the clinton news network (CNN) And don't forget what happened to our Country 12 and 1/2 months ago. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #79 October 30, 2002 No one is forgetting what happened to our country... But, getting trigger happy and finding justification after the fact is no way to solve any problem... Especially not when you're the voice of millions of people... "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,070 #80 October 30, 2002 >Wasn't he involved in making the Messerschmit fighter jets that > came out right at the end of the war? If Germany had had those jets > four years earlier the Battle of Britain might've had a very different > outcome.... Even two years earlier. When you look at how close germany was to perfecting V-2 guidance systems, how close they were to a two-stage V2 that could reach far outside Germany, and how close they were to a nuclear weapon, we are very, very lucky that we won that war. In fact, if not for one norwegian/american operative (Knut Haukelid) the germans might well have been the first ones to use nuclear weapons on civilians. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fool 0 #81 October 30, 2002 Dennis Miller made a comment about this on his show the other night, saying something along the lines of...If you wanna go to war for the oil, then sell it like that. Don't try and hide it. You wanna win over the American people, come out and say "Hey, how would everybody like to fill up for a 5 spot?" I thought it was mildly amusing, and somewhat true. S.E.X. party #1 "Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "f*#k, what a ride". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
antimike 0 #82 October 30, 2002 QuoteBut, getting trigger happy and finding justification after the fact is no way to solve any problem When would you like to get trigger happy? after 1,000,000 Americans die or is 2,000,000 your threshold. The Man is evil he has links to terror and ANYBODY who thinks he will not use the weapons he has either directly or indirectly is puutin their head in the sand li,ke an arabian ostrich. MY god man he cut up one of the people in his own gov and delivered the body parts to his wife! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
antimike 0 #83 October 30, 2002 PS if we wanted the oil we would have taken it in the first war. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skreamer 1 #84 October 30, 2002 What does invading Iraq to secure oil have to do with 911? (BTW I've been called a lot of things, but narrow-minded is a first - can I buy you a beer? ) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #85 October 30, 2002 I don't necessarily dissagree with your sentiment, but as a country involved in a very volitale time and situation, we must act according to our own protocol... We're a part of the U.N. as well and need to act as such or face the consequences of severing ties with countries that are our allies... No one stays on top forever... No need to expedite the process... Remember the Roman civilization??? "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
antimike 0 #86 October 30, 2002 Quote What does invading Iraq to secure oil have to do with 911? Your the one that said the US was invaing Iraq to secure oil. If we invade Iraq it will because they failed to let inspectors do their jobs. IF we invade Iraq and cause a regime change I'll Bet you what ever you want to bet that the oil stays with the new regime!! ***(BTW I've been called a lot of things, but narrow-minded is a first - can I buy you a beer? Sure you can, sorry I get carried away once in awhile. Ps I drink cold beer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,070 #87 October 30, 2002 >after 1,000,000 Americans die or is 2,000,000 your threshold. How 'bout we go after the man who orchestrated the killing of a few thousand americans, instead of a country who had NOTHING TO DO with it? Think our forces might be better used in Afghanistan and Pakistan to catch the remaining Al Quaeda operatives, or is that a boring war now? Did you forget about the victims of 9/11 already in a desire for a cool new war? >The Man is evil he has links to terror and ANYBODY who thinks he will >not use the weapons he has either directly or indirectly is puutin their > head in the sand li,ke an arabian ostrich. We have more links to terror than he does. We created Al Quaeda with US money and US weapons, for example. We currently support a known terrorist-backing warlord in Pakistan. >MY god man he cut up one of the people in his own gov and > delivered the body parts to his wife! And we gave him millions in support while he did that, in full knowledge that he was gassing the kurds etc. We did that because we liked Iran less and he was fighting Iran. How come he was worthy of our support then, but not now? Is it OK to kill your own people as long as the US gives you money? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skreamer 1 #88 October 31, 2002 QuoteIf we invade Iraq it will because they failed to let inspectors do their jobs. But they were doing that before 911 and there was no great rush to invade Iraq then. Did you know that BP has just posted a massive loss? In fact all the big oil companies' profits are down. I suspect the oil companies are putting pressure on the USA and its allies to invade Iraq. BP Ammoco is afterall the biggest company in Europe. The two biggest vultures (BP and Shell) are not even American. And if you want to look at human rights abuses, look at what Shell did in Africa - propping up corrupt evil dictatorships in order to keep pumping crude. Given some of the arguments posted here I will accept that oil is not the only reason that an invasion of Iraq is imminent, but I really do feel that it is a large reason. Will PS isn't it ironic that Shell is a Dutch company? (boy do they love their bicycles and energy efficient everything in the Netherlands) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #89 October 31, 2002 Skreamer, are you going to be in Eloy for the big one? "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
antimike 0 #90 October 31, 2002 QuoteHow 'bout we go after the man who orchestrated the killing of a few thousand americans, instead of a country who had NOTHING TO DO with it DAAAH I think we did and still are. Bill do you really think he did it alone. I know your not that naive. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #91 October 31, 2002 easy tiger, don't bite off more than you can chew now... "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #92 October 31, 2002 QuoteQuotethe administration has been unable to find one between Al Quaeda and Hussein None the less.....I would REALLY like to know who was paying Abu Nidal's salary and exactly what he was up to when he was killed recently ,by Iraqi Secret Police, inside Iraq. Me thinks some James Bond type stuff was going on. I'm sure the "general public" will never know. Aparently, Saddam has plenty of enemies in the Islamic world. Coulda knocked me down with a feather when I read that the Iraqis had dusted Abu Nidal! What was up with that!?"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skreamer 1 #93 October 31, 2002 I really really wish I could go to that, but unfortunately I used up most of my leave (and money!) on the freefly festival in Sweden. I will be going back to California next year though (but considering the number of americans [family included] I've managed to piss off, I'll be keeping a REALLY low profile... ) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,070 #94 October 31, 2002 >DAAAH I think we did and still are. Bill do you really think he did it >alone. I know your not that naive. No, Al Quaeda cells all over the region (some even in the US) participated. The administration tried very, very hard to link 9/11 to Iraq but could not find any conclusive evidence. There are far more links to Saudi Arabia and Pakistan than to Iraq, so going after them for 9/11 is like shooting the chief of police in Oklahoma City for the bombing there. Not only was it not his fault, you waste a bullet better spent shooting at the real terrorist. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,070 #95 October 31, 2002 >Coulda knocked me down with a feather when I read that the Iraqis > had dusted Abu Nidal! What was up with that!? Looks like the Iraqis have a war on terror too! Even Russia has gotten in on the latest fashion in foreign policy. Wouldn't suprise me if they use it as an excuse to invade Chechnya. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #96 October 31, 2002 That sucks... guess we'll just have to have some fun for ya then... You are the same skreamer I met at Perris last summer right? Just checkin... "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skreamer 1 #97 October 31, 2002 Quote You are the same skreamer I met at Perris last summer right? Just checkin... Nope, I was at Skydance last spring. Why is there somebody else out there that spots as bad as me?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diver123 0 #98 October 31, 2002 I could be mistaken, but I could've sworn I met a guy at Perris Valley last SUMMER who identified himself as skreamer here... Hm... "pull high! It's lower than you think..." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Push 0 #99 October 31, 2002 Dude, that's pure propaganda. Iraq probably does have ties to Al Qaeda - they hate each other. Not to say that it wouldn't be nice to remove Hussein from power. Like it or not though, the resources of the US are limited. Large, but limited. How many wars are they planning to fight at the same time? With a weak economy to boot? Put the money and manpower to better use. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Push 0 #100 October 31, 2002 QuoteWouldn't suprise me if they use it as an excuse to invade Chechnya. What is happening there anyway? Chechnians staged an uprising, Russia invaded to subdue it, had another Afghanistan (oooohhh don't even get me started on that stupidity, my father served there). Then they leave them to their own devices and what do they do? Instead of organizing their country? They bomb apartment buildings. So Russia invades again. And now we had the theater siege. It's one thing to fight for your freedom against an occupying army. It's another to bomb buildings and take hundreds of completely innocent people hostage. On the other hand, knowing Russia they did their share of human rights abuses. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
