Pammi 0
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jessefs 0
Thank you everyone for the confirmation that this post has a purpose. Being new to a sport and community can be a little bit intimidating sometimes and the vast majority of you make it fun, educational, and comfortable. Thank you for that
jesse
<* Spread the Love! *>
jesse<* Spread the Love! *>
jfields 0
Quotehow is this helpful information?
I'd say in a number of ways. First, it goes towards the issue of the continuity of our sport. Second, it is a lesson to be learned about the added danger factor of impaired skydiving. Third, it gives me more information about a particular dropzone.
Continued screw-ups of this nature lead skydiving closer and closer to a point where it becomes unfeasible. Honestly, one major incident with a student/tandem going in could shut a dropzone down completely. Waivers or no waivers, an irate family of a dead student could put enough pressure on a DZ to close it. And that is true whether the DZ is a one Cessna weekend place or a huge multi-turbine facility that runs 365 days. All it would take is for the student to be the son/daughter of the wrong person. When the first major DZ gets shut down, with instructors/DZOs going to jail and/or bankruptcy, a lot of people will question whether the liability of owning/working at a DZ is worth it. And the costs will just continue to rise, for the DZs, and for us.
I won't jump impaired. I'm a lightweight drinker, and won't go further than that. However, I'm not a jerk about it and don't much care what people do after the beer light goes on, as long as they are safe before getting in the air the next day, and not endangering others on the ground. But I hope the people that are on the fringe of this issue take it to heart and reconsider the urge to jump when they really shouldn't.
On to the last issue, and the one most likely to piss some people off. This is my opinion only, and based on events which I haven't witnessed in person. Nonetheless, the number of fatalities trouble me, and they are not disputed.
I think SDC has a major problem. To some degree, the drug use there must be accepted. If it weren't, events like this wouldn't be recurring to the degree they have been. Before jumping to conclusions, I am NOT inferring or stating that everyone there has a problem. I'm sure that most people there are both great folks and safety conscious. A large number of you post here, and I'd be happy to jump with you all some day. DiverDriver has even been a pilot there. I have full confidence in his abilities and firmly believe that he does his job safely and with absolute dedication to the lives of his passengers.
However, there seems to be a huge disconnect between a stated "no drugs" policy and reality. That happens lots of places. But most of them don't involve life-and-death activities. Does it really matter if a desk jockey (like myself) went to work impaired? Probably not. (So what if my DZ.com posts were a little more incoherent.
) Would it if I were, say... an air traffic controller? Absolutely. People with other lives in their hands as part of their jobs should be held to a different standard. It is the difference between individual choice and responsibility to others in your care.
It is hard to think of a situation where someone's life is more directly in another's care than that of a AFF or tandem instructor. While this particular incident did not involve a student, it did involve an instructor, and it did show incredibly poor judgement. It is a very small step from doing solo jumps while high to taking students while high. Before you protest that they are totally different, consider the fact that the former is already risking the lives of others, by being in the plane and in the air at the same time.
I hope the senior management at SDC makes some changes. First, they need to take a good look at how they run things and what their priorities are. I'm not talking about "spin control" where the only object is adjusting the media's perceptions. I'm talking about a real soul searching where they evaluate whether or not they want to be knowing participants in the deaths of innocent people. If an irresponsible attitude toward drugs and safety is condoned, it is only a matter of time before more accidents happen.
People have brought up the whole issue of "Policing ourselves". I think the idea is great. We keep things inside the skydiving family and watch each other's backs. The problem is that it isn't working. Some places are good about keeping impaired people on the ground. Others obviously aren't. I'd be the last one to do anything to curtail the activities people partake in after the beer light goes on, as long as they are relatively safe. Want to drink til you puke? Go ahead. Smoke a pile of pot? Go ahead. Neither will effect me as long as you are clear before you get on the next plane in the morning. There is a point where I draw the line though, even on beer light activities on the ground. Some drugs just shouldn't be on a DZ, no matter what. People doing cocaine, PCP, or other "hard drugs" should just be given the boot. If things go wrong with them, it isn't just puking in a trash can or getting a case of the munchies. The risk of them doing harm to some innocent bystander (or themselves) is just too high. While these weren't a factor in this incident, they were in another relatively recent one. I can't believe that nobody notices substantial drug use. Whether it is a friend who saw it being done or someone in the loading area who smells it, it should be caught before the plane leaves the ground. The impaired people shouldn't be allowed to lift off.
Rather than a simple, "Sorry he died, time to move on" approach, I think there are a whole lot of lessons to be learned here. However, I think there is a lot of denial going around. I feel bad for every skydiver that dies. But I also feel badly for everyone around them that had their lives in jeopardy because of a few people's selfishness and/or inaction. We all choose what risk we are willing to take. That is a part of skydiving. It isn't fair for a few people to add unneccesary risk for everyone else without their knowledge or consent.
End of rant.
billvon 2,998
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>no, i would not. because i own my own company.
Ah, OK. Yours is a slightly different case, then. I would suggest that it is easier to be in favor of drug testing if you face no negative consequences due to a false positive. Most people do not have that luxury.
Ah, OK. Yours is a slightly different case, then. I would suggest that it is easier to be in favor of drug testing if you face no negative consequences due to a false positive. Most people do not have that luxury.
billvon 2,998
>then whats to stop you getting retested if you KNOW you are clean?
At least two employment agreements I've seen prohibit a retest. You test positive on the accurate test, you're fired. No second GC/MS test. If you refuse to take the more accurate test, or you ask for a different test etc you are dismissed. A lawyer told me it was to prevent an endless series of retests while they drink gallons of water.
At least two employment agreements I've seen prohibit a retest. You test positive on the accurate test, you're fired. No second GC/MS test. If you refuse to take the more accurate test, or you ask for a different test etc you are dismissed. A lawyer told me it was to prevent an endless series of retests while they drink gallons of water.
jf:
You said it, bro!
____________________________________________________________
I'm RICK JAMES! Fo shizzle.
You said it, bro!
____________________________________________________________
I'm RICK JAMES! Fo shizzle.
I'm totally in agreement with you Jose, and Christoofa. Anyone who jumps while impaired is endangering themselves and others, and I would friggin flip out if one day when my kids go make the tandem they are itching to do, I find out the tandem master has been doing either. I'm very open-minded about whatever anyone wants to do (including myself) after the beer light is on, but like Jose put so well...why screw up a good jump by being high or drunk?
Besides, it looks bad for the rest of us. Shit, I don't like when I hear on the radio some guy this morning talking about how he loves skydiving BECAUSE he can die at it and it won't hurt. It makes the rest of us look like idiots who don't care about life. It's back to the old discussions about trying to get good press for the sport.
I'm thinking that if you are getting that bored with the aspects of how amazing it is to just be up there in the air, or that complacent about the possible dangers, you are asking for a bitch slap from the skydive gods to remind you.
Pamela
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