Who here prays regularly?

[freebird 0]

I have been dealing with my new found conclusion that if you pray there ain't nobody there.
Before you bash me it is my personal opinion. heres my reason.
Example: A beautiful little 5 year old girl or boy is playing in there yard. A car swoops by grabs the child. All night she/he is raped. Then she/he is killed. Do you think a prayer would have helped? I do not think so.
Hitler and what happened to all of the Jews dehumanizing......
There are horrible things that go on everyday. I can't believe that GOD is here or watching. We are alone for now. If we are not alone than there is only an evil force. Im open to at least believe that.
Mabe 2000 years ago a God of some sort came down here and had a visit mabe he told us we were important to the future of this earth and that he was coming back. I do not believe GOD is here now. I can't. Babies getting beat up and people being put in gas chambers ,slaves......I could go on. Im sorry .......I used to believe in God . Something happened and it just clicked in my head that no way can this be. If there is or was one its either evil or just not around anymore.
Please do not bash me..... it bring tears to my eyes everytime I think about my beliefs it REALLY upsets me to be this way because the way I see the future is changed now .....my life is different....I see things different.............where is the hope? I guess we are the hope of our own future.

[Zennie 0]

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I however don't pray as I believe religion is one of the greatest causes of trouble in the world.

Correction... organized religion is one of the greatest causes of suffering in the world (but also sometimes a tool for good).

My take on God & saviors is naturally a bit different than most. Jesus was a historical figure. There is no reasonable dispute over that. I also believe the things he taught were "ultimate truths", for lack of a better description. Love others as yourself. Be honest. Be kind. Be forgiving. Be firm in your convictions. Don't cling to things with no spiritual substance (such as material things or social/religious status).

Even though I'm agnostic, theology is still a big interest of mine. I've read the Bible (Old & New Testaments), the Dhammapada, Tao Te Ching, gobs of Zen books (go figure). I need to read the Koran.

A really good "comparative religion" overview is "The World's Religions" by Huston Smith.

What I've come to learn is that each religion really provides different takes on the same ultimate truths. I call it "facets of the diamond". Each facet offers a unique view into into the diamond. But each facet alone isn't the diamond. I think you get a clearer picture by studying as many facets as you can.

So in my mind, Jesus was enlightened. The Buddha (Shakyamuni) was enlightened. Lao Tsu was enlightened. Mohandas Gandhi, Martin Luther King & Mother Teresa were enlightened.

And I guess my view on God is that God is everything. God is the universe and everything in it. God is you, me and the computer I'm writing this post on. So for me, trying to be in touch with everything, trying to learn from and follow (as best I can) the examples of the enlightened people that came before me, is being in touch with God.

OK, so I'm weird.

- Z
"Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon

[christoofar 0]

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Well sorry to disagree, but religion is made by people for the purpose of exersizing power over people. Everybody says that their religion is the true one, well which one is true in that case? Did God come to the Jews and tell them not to eat pork and shrimp? Did he come to the muslims and tell them to chop thiefs hands for stealing? Did he come to Chrisitans and tell them to crusade and spread his word bu means of sword and fire? Why do orthodox Jews wear those ridiculous black suits and hats in 100 degree heat? Did God want them to be uncomfortable? The list can go on for hours and be stuck to every religion. I fully appreciate and respect your right to your religion. I just find religion (any) to be corrupt and hypocritical. Religion in my oppinion is the sum of all human fears.

Some of the substance you are talking about, like dress, is really part of a culture, and not really religion... although the two concepts are mixed together. So are particular societies' norms, values and taboos. If you just look at how different groups deal with particular events, like death for example, I think you'll gain a bigger understanding of where Arab muslims are coming from.

Westerners used to wear tons of clothing from the 1700s til the early 1900s, even in the intense heat. And funny hats were all the rage for most of the time during these centuries as well. Education was also very hard to come by for women until just recently as well. We don't recognize most of this because most of us grew up in post WWII and weren't exposed to any of that "old stuff."

Westerners keep forgetting that the origins of advanced complex societies originated in the Middle East and in Asia, not in Europe or the U.S. Granted, these people haven't advanced very far in the past few thousand years... try going to the bathroom in Greece and you'll soon find out.

Sociology majors eat this stuff up for breakfast.

____________________________________________________________
I'm RICK JAMES! Fo shizzle.

[Deuce 1]

People tend to freak when they learn I go to church almost every week, send my kids to parochial school, and pray daily.

I am a Catholic.

I don't care if you believe in God or not, as opposed to the aggressively anti-God folks. Religion was the cure for the Dark Ages, and the birth of the Renaissance. I don't feel any need to flame athiests or those who are anti-religion, and the multitude of people who are virulently anti-Catholic.

I easily tolerate agnostics and athiests, why can't they tolerate my beliefs?

Yes there was buggery in the monastaries, still is. Yes there are homosexual child molesting priests. Some priests break their vows. We are human and we will sin. My religion is just the framework for my belief that there will be a judgement when it's over. I believe those that choose to injure others will face God's judgment. That makes it so much easier for me to sleep at night. Some people get away with it in this life, for some crime does pay. I believe there will be a reckoning when it's over.

My pre jump prayer is an old fire-and-brimstone prayer that's fallen out of favor. It is the prayer of St. Michael the Archangel, my guardian angel (Patron Saint of Paratroopers and other dangerous professions, including Police Officers)

Saint Michael, Archangel
Defend us in battle.
Be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the devil.
May God rebuke him, we humbly pray.
And you, prince of the heavenly host, by the power of God, thrust into hell Satan and the other evil spirits who prowl the world for the ruin of souls.

That boils down to "help me resist temptation and choose to do the right thing"

Nevertheless, after that prayer a couple of weeks ago, Skybytch grabbed my butt, and I grabbed hers right back, and we went skydiving!

God laughed at our antics, methinks.

Religion is just background music.

Take a chill-pill, all.

[judedre 0]

i only pray to my dead mother who passed bout 2 years ago on the way to altitude i always say look after me mum and if this shit dont open i will see you in a coupla minutes have a nice warm spot waitin for me then under canopy i always say thanks mom am i a freak or what...

[jraf 0]

True, I agree and I don't think you are weird. We all have a different way of perceiving the world. As mentioned I talk to trees, stones, the sun... . I constantly try to better myself though my perception of the world and not through the croocked mirror of religion. Religion is part of the global culture. I also have studied religious movements and their principles. Based on my findings I decided not to be part of it.

jraf

Me Jungleman! Me have large Babalui.
Muff #3275

[Marz 0]

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Correction... organized religion is one of the greatest causes of suffering in the world (but also sometimes a tool for good).

"religion is for those who don't want to go to hell... spirituality was discovered by those on their way back..."

Love that quote!

_________________________________________
Did I just kill another thread?

[christoofar 0]

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Religion is just background music.

That is the best euphamism I have heard this millenium.

____________________________________________________________
I'm RICK JAMES! Fo shizzle.

[Sinkster 0]

You're not the first to take issue with the problem of pain and evil in the world. (or how could a good God let it happen) (and believe me, I too have seen innocents suffer greivously (in a personal way))

However, biblically, there is a reason for it as follows:

1. God created the fact of freedom--man performs the acts of freedom.

2. God made evil possible; but free will creatures make evil actual.

3. The ability to do something does not necessitate doing it. God is able to control everything, yet he allows free will.

There are more carefully worded arguments along those lines as well, but at least take comfort in the fact that the bible teaches that God is in the process of restoring his creation and that evil and suffering will be eliminated in due time.

Make no mistake, God will not be mocked and those who harm others will be punished. And just as well God will restore those who have wrongly suffered.

And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, "Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away." He who was seated on the throne said, "I am making everything new!" Then he said, "Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true." (Revelation 21:3-5)

[Zennie 0]

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I easily tolerate agnostics and athiests, why can't they tolerate my beliefs?

I can and do.

It's interesting though, I seem to have the same problem only in reverse.

- Z
"Always be yourself... unless you suck." - Joss Whedon

[Deuce 1]

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I easily tolerate agnostics and athiests, why can't they tolerate my beliefs?

I can and do.

It's interesting though, I seem to have the same problem only in reverse.

Next time you're in Antioch, we'll go to this club I belong to. We do sit-kneel-stand aerobics and sing for about 45 minutes, eat a cracker and drink a sip of wine, shake hands and go have breakfast.

You'll dig it. After breakfast about half the time I go skydive nearby

[christoofar 0]

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I easily tolerate agnostics and athiests, why can't they tolerate my beliefs?

I can and do.

It's interesting though, I seem to have the same problem only in reverse.

Next time you're in Antioch, we'll go to this club I belong to. We do sit-kneel-stand aerobics and sing for about 45 minutes, eat a cracker and drink a sip of wine, shake hands and go have breakfast.

You'll dig it. After breakfast about half the time I go skydive nearby

45 minutes? Where is this club?! Every club I've ever been to likes to "0wn" you from 07:45 'til 11:30... so you're starving by the time you get out.

My current club has a hundred-year-old university attached to it they have me for the whole day during some semesters!

____________________________________________________________
I'm RICK JAMES! Fo shizzle.

[Skyrad 0]

I pray everyday, I was born into a Muslim family but recently did a Alpha course and came to know God through Jesus. I go to church most sundays. I pray the lords prayer just as we start to roll down the runway to take off, and I say a little prayer of thanks for the privallage of being able to Skydive just before I jump. I don't pray for God to keep me safe before I jump because if anything happens to me then that is his will.
Know one really knows whos right (Jews, Muslims, Christians) apart from God and I'm sure he'd be heartbroken to see what we do to each other in his name.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[TheBile 0]

Not me, I'm an atheist.
It makes me laugh when I hear, "Skydiving up there is the closest you'll get to God." No it isn't. Hit the ground at 120mph when both chutes fail and you'll be standing right next to him.

Gerb

I stir feelings in others they themselves don't understand. KA'CHOW !

[mujie96 0]

I pray in the plane after I touch my handles a million times or so and review all my emergency procedures. If I'm in the 182, I pray twice. It can't hurt. I would think that skydivers would tend to be a little more spiritual than most, even if we are a little rowdy.
Jess

Just keep swimming...just keep swimming....

[JohnnyD 0]

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Not me, I'm an atheist.

It makes me laugh when I hear, "Skydiving up there is the closest you'll get to God." No it isn't. Hit the ground at 120mph when both chutes fail and you'll be standing right next to him.

Too funny. You are quite the atheist.
Also an atheist, except I do join hands for the pre-dinner prayer when I dine with a good friend who always does that prayer. I find it very enjoyable.

[seedy 0]

How does this:

---

"Not me, I'm an atheist. "

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jive with this:

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"you'll be standing right next to him. "

I intend to live forever -- so far, so good.

[dreamsville 0]

Religion and its symbols are misused by some for coercive means. This does not detract from its value as a creed worth following.

People follow a faith on their own accord by the actions and examples of others, but seldom by those who only preach a strict creed of what takes to be saved, else damnation follows. The word for this might be didactic (some say "Bible Bashing").

Having said that, I find that I pray before bed each night and in thanks for the many blessings, one of the greatest of which is the Earth and Sky that we share in this sport. As I get older, I pray less for myself than for others who are in a jam. I also admit that I might fall asleep without a prayer sometimes after that extra beer.

Harry

I don't drink during the day, so I don't know what it is about this airline. I keep falling out the door of the plane.

Harry, FB #4143

[freebird 0]

Im still the same way. I do alot of double checking. I do not pray I do not believe God is here..I believe in pulling before impact.

[Muenkel 0]

Wow, there are really interesting responses here. I am always curious as to how different people deal with their different spirituality.

I have often wondered. What if God exists and it is only 1 God, not many Gods. If this is the case, how did we end up with so many different religions? I would assume that if there is only 1 God, there is only 1 truth, yet we humans have drawn billions of different conclusions. Does this mean a bunch of us are in a whole bunch of deep shit?

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Chris

[ernokaikkonen 0]

>I believe in pulling before impact.

LMAO! Good one!

[rgoper 0]

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I do not believe God is here..I believe in pulling before impact.

Free:

your quite correct, god is not here, he resides in heaven, but his angels are here watching over us. and it's good you do pull before impact, because it's highly unlikely that jesus is going to pull for you!

--Richard--
"We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist"

[JohnnyD 0]

>I would assume that if there is only 1 God, there is only 1 truth, yet we humans have drawn billions of different conclusions. Does this mean a bunch of us are in a whole bunch of deep shit?
I think all the conclusions are wrong (except mine, of course) and God, in whatever form you believe in, is nothing more than a socially acceptable version of a childhood imaginary friend with the ability to address the concerns of adults.
My $.02

[jlmiracle 7]

[
Next time you're in Antioch, we'll go to this club I belong to. We do sit-kneel-stand aerobics and sing for about 45 minutes, eat a cracker and drink a sip of wine, shake hands and go have breakfast.

You'll dig it. After breakfast about half the time I go skydive nearby

[mujie96 0]

I once saw a bumper sticker that said "God is too big for just one religion" or something to that effect. Deep huh?
Jess

Just keep swimming...just keep swimming....