Semi stowless bag

[BETO74 0]

Just got a new UPT micron container I decided to go with the semi stoles deployment bag, I'm interesting in anyones experience with it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ipf6tLO43n0

http://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html

[Absolut 0]

Got the semi stowless bag but in a Paratec Next container, jumping a Katana 107 WL close to 2. Works like a charm: definately improved my openings, they are still as soft, but fewer offheading and panorama openings. It is even a little faster to pack and there are only 2 rubbers that can break which is a nice bonus too ;-) would definately recommend it! Can't really see any downside to it if used and sized properly.

[gilead1 0]

BETO74

Just got a new UPT micron container I decided to go with the semi stoles deployment bag, I'm interesting in anyones experience with it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ipf6tLO43n0

clicky.

[Di0 2]

Installed one this weekend.
UPT Semi Stowless bag on a V3 Micron 310.

Funnily enough, last jump with my regular bag decided to give me a nice line dump that left me quite banged up for the rest of the weekend, as in "you're replacing me with a new, modern, better one? There you go, asshole!" LOL.

I put maybe 12 jumps on the stowless one, half of them packed by packer, half of them by me.

What can I say? I need more jumps on it but so far, put me in the Fan Club Section. Openings are indeed way smoother.

For sure it's quicker to pack, yeah.

Also, it seems really well made, definitely reinforced, stiffened and more structured, etc. compared to the "normal" one (might be because my normal one is a 7 years old one, not sure if the ones they make now are also nicer).
But I only have a very very very small experience with it so far. I'll keep an eye on this thread to see if more people post stuff about it.

I'm standing on the edge
With a vision in my head
My body screams release me
My dreams they must be fed... You're in flight.

[Anachronist 2]

I've got a Vector 348 with a semi stowless bag, about 250 jumps on UPT semi-stowless bags. I like them a lot, I've seen some other designs that just looked like people were trying to fix something that wasn't broke. I've never had any issues with them, just pack how the vid describes. It can feel a little funny at first because you don't feel the lines unstowing but you'll quickly get use to it. It basically takes the idea from a BASE tail pocket or reserve line stow system depending on how you look at it; good enough for BASE and reserves, good enough for a main.

Pros:
1- Faster packing
2- Cleaner deployments
3- Fewer rubber bands to deal with

Cons: None

I also had a really unstable wingsuit deployment once and basically tumbled after I pitched (I was jumping a bigger suit than I probably should have been at the time) and the outside vid shows the bag staying completely stable during deployment as though nothing was wrong.

[phoenixlpr 0]

Anachronist

I've got a Vector 348 with a semi stowless bag, about 250 jumps on UPT semi-stowless bags. I like them a lot, I've seen some other designs that just looked like people were trying to fix something that wasn't broke. I've never had any issues with them, just pack how the vid describes. It can feel a little funny at first because you don't feel the lines unstowing but you'll quickly get use to it. It basically takes the idea from a BASE tail pocket or reserve line stow system depending on how you look at it; good enough for BASE and reserves, good enough for a main.

Pros:
1- Faster packing
2- Cleaner deployments
3- Fewer rubber bands to deal with

Cons: None

I also had a really unstable wingsuit deployment once and basically tumbled after I pitched (I was jumping a bigger suit than I probably should have been at the time) and the outside vid shows the bag staying completely stable during deployment as though nothing was wrong.

Some says you are a test jumper if it's newer than 5 years.

[Deimian 43]

Di0

Funnily enough, last jump with my regular bag decided to give me a nice line dump that left me quite banged up for the rest of the weekend, as in "you're replacing me with a new, modern, better one? There you go, asshole!" LOL.

Sounds familiar. On my last jump in my previous canopy, when I already knew I was going to replace the canopy in the hangar, I was "daisy-chaining" it, right after landing, when it inflated again with a wind gust and pulled like a mofo, trapping my hand in the lines. My fingers were numb by the time I could take out the hand. It looked like revenge to me. I guess I deserve it

Sorry for the off-topic

[johnmatrix 21]

I got one for V353 and am very happy with it. Done about 350 jumps on it.

[hillson 0]

Have one in my V308.

Will never go back to a standard deployment bag again.

[rehmwa 2]

hillson

Have one
Will never go back to a standard deployment bag again.

this is it ^^


wife got a new rig, so I scavenged her semi-stowless from the last rig and put it in my Mirage - love it


so that's a Vector bag, pulled from a Javelin Odyssey, and now in a Mirage.....

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[erdnarob 1]

I have now several hundred jumps with Jerry Baumschen Aerosports D-Bag which is like a reserve D-Bag where you stow the lines in zigzag into a pocket closed by strong magnets (reserves have Velcro). Jerry now has changed magnets for tuck tabs. I wrote an article in Blue Skies magazine (Feb, 2012 if my memory is good) about my testing. My D-Bag like the Vector UPT one has two rubber bands to close the D-Bag flap ( I put tandem tube stows on mine). My opening are smoother and more orderly than anything I had before. You can see pictures almost frame by frame of one of my openings in the magazine. Suspension lines are straight and taut. That kind of bag let the lines go smoothly from the D-Bag pocket middle unlike the standard D-Bag which are rocking from left to right when the lines unstow. If you check the lines order when unstowing, there is no comparison between the two types of bags since the semi stowless D-Bag provide more cleaner lines unstowing.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[Skydivesg 7]

When my Vector customers ask about the semi stowless bag I send them my review.

see attached

Be the canopy pilot you want that other guy to be.

[DSE 5]

Anachronist

I've got a Vector 348 with a semi stowless bag, about 250 jumps on UPT semi-stowless bags. I like them a lot, I've seen some other designs that just looked like people were trying to fix something that wasn't broke. I've never had any issues with them, just pack how the vid describes. It can feel a little funny at first because you don't feel the lines unstowing but you'll quickly get use to it. It basically takes the idea from a BASE tail pocket or reserve line stow system depending on how you look at it; good enough for BASE and reserves, good enough for a main.

Pros:
1- Faster packing
2- Cleaner deployments
3- Fewer rubber bands to deal with

Cons: None

I also had a really unstable wingsuit deployment once and basically tumbled after I pitched (I was jumping a bigger suit than I probably should have been at the time) and the outside vid shows the bag staying completely stable during deployment as though nothing was wrong.

I'd suggest that on some bags, the magnet placement/sewing can be a con. I saw a second magnet-close Dbag with a shattered magnet this weekend, rendering the bag unusable. Some bags sew them in so they can't slam shut, others don't.

However, I'll never go back to rubber band stows again either.

[Anachronist 2]

DSE

I'd suggest that on some bags, the magnet placement/sewing can be a con. I saw a second magnet-close Dbag with a shattered magnet this weekend, rendering the bag unusable. Some bags sew them in so they can't slam shut, others don't.

However, I'll never go back to rubber band stows again either.

I'm not a fan of the magnet closure for that same reason too, and the extremely unlikely but possible "what if my altimeter (digital) finds itself right next to the magnet in my gear bag?" I don't always pack after I'm done jumping so the bag isn't always in the container.

I think tuck tabs are the way to go.

[phoenixlpr 0]

[replyI'm not a fan of the magnet closure for that same reason too, and the extremely unlikely but possible "what if my altimeter (digital) finds itself right next to the magnet in my gear bag?"

[DSE 5]

As I've stated before, I'm a proponent of the UPT and Jerry Baumchen designs. All of my rigs but one have these bags in them. Factory support from both Jerry and UPT is outstanding, should one need it.

[Akegata 0]

I got a semi stowless bag for my Vector 350 about 70 jumps ago.
The only thing I can say about it is that I am assuming that in 10 years time every manufacturer will provide stowless bags as default, and everyone will wonder why the hell people used ~8 rubbed bands on their bags for so long.

[mxk 1]

I feel like I should to provide some balance to this thread. I have a Dacron-lined Spectre 230 in a Vector V358. This combination DOES NOT work with UPT's semi-stowless bag.

I ordered it with some apprehension because V358 is the biggest container that supports the semi-stowless bag, Spectre 230 is already listed as full-fitting, and I've added Dacron lines to that. Everyone I asked, including people at UPT (with Skydivesg's help) and on this forum, said that the combination should be fine. The first time I packed it, I could see that the bag will not work. A fact later confirmed by Kenneth Gajda @ UPT. Dacron lines add too much bulk in the pocket (the tabs have trouble staying closed), and the big main causes the whole thing to be more of a ball shape that just wants to pop out of the container. There is nowhere near enough friction to keep it in and the dynamic corners do not help either.

I replaced the bag with a regular one and couldn't be happier. Personally, I wouldn't recommend a semi-stowless bag for mains above 200 sqft. You only have two locking stows and those made me a bit uncomfortable thinking about what would happen if one breaks just after bag extraction. This may be a non-issue, but for a big main I prefer having 4 locking stows. Having the lines exposed and facing the BOC also greatly improved the overall fit. Packing time is a matter of practice, but I doubt that a semi-stowless bag would save me more than minute.

I replace about 1-3 rubber bands every 10-15 jumps at the first sign of wear (before they break!). Large bands for locking stows, small ones for the rest, singe stows with 3" bights that provide 6-10 lbs of extraction force (I know PD recommends 8-12, but couldn't get that with other configurations). I keep spare non-locking bands attached, so I never have to replace a rubber band in the middle of the day. Also, not all rubber bands are created equal. My DZ provides them for free, but I found their small bands to be weaker than the Keener ones I buy from ParaGear or ChutingStar.

[RMURRAY 1]

Akegata

I got a semi stowless bag for my Vector 350 about 70 jumps ago.
The only thing I can say about it is that I am assuming that in 10 years time every manufacturer will provide stowless bags as default, and everyone will wonder why the hell people used ~8 rubbed bands on their bags for so long.

for security and orderly payout of the lines. for example if the pilot chute hesitates with the bag out of the container, the lines are still in control. I am not sold yet but may be in 10 year...I find easier and faster to pack with rubber bands.

[BigMikeH77 0]

mxk

Personally, I wouldn't recommend a semi-stowless bag for mains above 200 sqft. You only have two locking stows and those made me a bit uncomfortable thinking about what would happen if one breaks just after bag extraction. This may be a non-issue, but for a big main I prefer having 4 locking stows.

And this is absolutely valid - I'm not challenging your comfort level in any sense but rather just adding my own experience; I too am a bigger guy and with a larger main, a 210 Spectre on microline. I jump one of Jerry Baumchen's NoStoBags. Not long ago I was in a two-out situation and the locking stows did keep the main in the bag. However, I DID replace them immediately prior to the jump so they couldn't have been in stronger shape. I use larger bands and double-stow. Surely, had one or both of those stows not held it would have been a much more interesting two-out.

I am wondering now IF the mass of larger canopies in a semi-stowless makes them more susceptible to out of sequence deploymentsas opposed to smaller wings. Anyone have a thought on this?

[JerryBaumchen 1,354]

Hi mxk,

Quote

Dacron-lined Spectre 230

I recently built a NoStoBag for a 230 canopy. I added a 3rd grommet so that the owner had a choice of using 2 or 3 rubber bands to keep the canopy portion of the bag closed.

Since my 3-sided line stow pouch is on the bottom side customers do not have a problem with lines bulging out of the sides; at least no one has told me that they are having any problems ( fingers crossed ).

Just sayin',

Jerry Baumchen

[Lethal1ty17 0]

I can attest to how important it is to close ALL of the tabs on the bag and not just the side ones. You WILL get line dump, and it WILL NOT feel good. Nevermind the less-than-deal body position...I was but a we baby bird learning to fly a wingsuit back then.

[Hellis 0]

RMURRAY

***I got a semi stowless bag for my Vector 350 about 70 jumps ago.
The only thing I can say about it is that I am assuming that in 10 years time every manufacturer will provide stowless bags as default, and everyone will wonder why the hell people used ~8 rubbed bands on their bags for so long.

for security and orderly payout of the lines. for example if the pilot chute hesitates with the bag out of the container, the lines are still in control. I am not sold yet but may be in 10 year...I find easier and faster to pack with rubber bands.

In my opinion what you describe here is the opposit of a rubberband bag.
Each time a rubberband release lines you get a rocking motion on the bag, slack in the lines, lines shaking from side to side.
Is that orderly payout?
With semi/stowless bags all the lines come out in the center without shaking the whole system.

Security?
If rubberbands would never break I would agree with you.
But because they do it can easily create a linedump.

....But you have to replace them in time!
Sometimes they have gone on the first jump for me. And that is not sequrity in my opinion.

[sundevil777 102]

Quote

Security?
If rubberbands would never break I would agree with you.
But because they do it can easily create a linedump.

....But you have to replace them in time!
Sometimes they have gone on the first jump for me. And that is not sequrity in my opinion.

I agree, that is why I don't use rubberbands for the critical locking stows. The non-locking stows breaking isn't a big deal, but the canopy dump from broken locking stows is. Something much less likely to break is better such as tube stows.

I'm not familiar with the "locking" method of the stowless bags. Are they not vulnerable to failure?

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Hellis 0]

sundevil777

Quote

Security?
If rubberbands would never break I would agree with you.
But because they do it can easily create a linedump.

....But you have to replace them in time!
Sometimes they have gone on the first jump for me. And that is not sequrity in my opinion.

I agree, that is why I don't use rubberbands for the critical locking stows. The non-locking stows breaking isn't a big deal, but the canopy dump from broken locking stows is. Something much less likely to break is better such as tube stows.

I'm not familiar with the "locking" method of the stowless bags. Are they not vulnerable to failure?

They probably are, but I have never had any issues.
Mine is held shut with 4x3 magnets.
I feel confident it stays closed since my canopy is smaler than the bag. If it would be the other way around, I would not jump it.