jakee 1,557 #26 April 28, 2004 QuoteMake your damn minds up! You either want a "sterile" plane environment or you don't! If knives are OK, leave us alone. If they're not then don't bring them on the pissing plane yourself! And of course, just saying that to an airport security guy will get you thrown in jail...Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,557 #27 April 29, 2004 Quoteand a 46 year-old, 320 lb. person on the other Mate, if I am ever sat next to someone on a plane who needs to lift up the armrest in order to fit in then I guarantee you that flight will not lift off until I either have a new seat or security has carried me away.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikkey 0 #28 April 29, 2004 QuoteQuoteand a 46 year-old, 320 lb. person on the other Mate, if I am ever sat next to someone on a plane who needs to lift up the armrest in order to fit in then I guarantee you that flight will not lift off until I either have a new seat or security has carried me away. Don't remind me .... I once was on a plane from Bangkok to London (around 12 hour flight) when a fat guy like that sat next to me - profusely sweating and smelling after having had a garlic prawn dinner before going to the airport (happily sharing the story)..... and no empty seats on the plane. Speaking of nightmare flights...--------------------------------------------------------- When people look like ants - pull. When ants look like people - pray. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #29 April 29, 2004 Quote QuoteDoes this seem stupid to anyone else? Being worried about such pathetic items as nail clippers yet actually providing passengers with metal knives and large heavy bat shaped objects. This wasn't even in business class either - it was coach... so a terrorist doesn't even need to be well funded in order to take over an Air France plane! It's not something as simple as a knife or a broken bottle that allows a terrorist to take over an airplane; it's the general attitude, and willingness to comply, of the people on board. I suspect that if we hadn't spent the last decade or so raising a nation of pussies that this wouldn't be a problem. Jim Hear fucking hear!! --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #30 April 29, 2004 QuoteYou're all missing my point. Fine there's now a pathetic collection of semi-weaponry on board - I don't care that much if they're there or not. What pissed me off was the fact that we have to go through such huge security measures to keep such benign things as nail clippers and nail files off the plane only to find the damn airline has brought worse on themselves. Make your damn minds up! You either want a "sterile" plane environment or you don't! If knives are OK, leave us alone. If they're not then don't bring them on the pissing plane yourself! I dropped my dad off at PBI to fly back to NY last week. As we dropped his luggage with the skycaps, I took a glance at the list they had taped down to their counter: all the items that passengers were prohibited from bringing in their carryons. I was amused when I saw Kubotan on there. They are the 5.5" aluminum or wood cylinders used as self-defense keychains. They are prohibited. I made some conversation with a skycap about the irony of prohibiting Kubotans, but allowing walking canes. I specifically asked, "Would they allow someone who walks with a cane to bring it?" (I have also seen specifics of where a cane must be stowed in the cabin, so yes I knew they allow them.) There is a company called "Canemasters" who makes quality wooden canes that can be used as a martial arts weapon. In fact, the crooks of the canes are widened to allow for hooking necks and limbs. Presumably, these are no less allowed than those CVS-type hollow aluminum canes. I asked the skycap, "So all someone has to do is just show up with a cane, maybe fake a little limp, and say they need it to walk, huh?" Yep, was the response. Funny. When you think about it, what can they do? Require you to have a doctor's note excusing you for having a cane? Refuse to let those who need canes have them? So in the end, you can't have a 5.5" piece of blunt aluminum, but you can have a 2 pound shaft of polished oak with a crook on it, which can be used to jab or swing. This is the logic of those who are supposedly protecting us. Now, don't get me wrong, I think we SHOULD be able to bring canes... and Kubotans, and pocketknives. I used to travel with my Spyderco Delica in my pocket. I just read that the TSA, which has been fighting tooth-and-nail to prevent pilots from taking part in the congressionally mandated armed pilots program, has authorized only TWO PERCENT of our pilots to carry firearms on board flights. And the "sky marshal" program that the TSA favors instead has marshals flying on some paltry pathetic percentage of flights. The whole fuckin' thing is a joke. It's why I would sooner drive from FL to NY than take a flight -- and DID, just this month. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
andrewstewart 0 #31 April 29, 2004 QuoteYou're all missing my point. Fine there's now a pathetic collection of semi-weaponry on board - I don't care that much if they're there or not. What pissed me off was the fact that we have to go through such huge security measures to keep such benign things as nail clippers and nail files off the plane only to find the damn airline has brought worse on themselves. Make your damn minds up! You either want a "sterile" plane environment or you don't! If knives are OK, leave us alone. If they're not then don't bring them on the pissing plane yourself! Although I don't agree with their policy (I hate being searched), it actually makes sense in that they know about the knives and bottles, but they don't know what you might be bringing onto the plane, hence the checks. It seems like they have simply determined that their risk model allows their own knives (since every passenger will get some, therefore there is no advantage to an attacker), but doesn't allow a weapon which would give an advantage - and therefore which someone would have to bring on. You're just pissed about being searched, which is fair enough, but their logic itself is not faulty. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
andrewstewart 0 #32 April 29, 2004 QuoteIt's why I would sooner drive from FL to NY than take a flight -- and DID, just this month. - Even if someone does have a weapon, how are they going to get through the armored door to the cabin? My understanding was that such doors are mandatory now. Correct me if I'm wrong. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gawain 0 #33 April 29, 2004 QuoteEven if someone does have a weapon, how are they going to get through the armored door to the cabin? My understanding was that such doors are mandatory now. Correct me if I'm wrong. They aren't "armored", they're reinforced - requiring more time for a person to break through. I believe they refer to them as "4 minute doors" or something like that, meaning that a certain weighted person (say 170 lbs) would need about 4 minutes to break through the door, more than enough time for a pilot to signal a takeover attempt and take other defensive action. Edit to add: I believe the requirement is only for US based airlines, though I'm sure that others have followed suit. A true "armored" door would make it near impossible for the plane to get its nose off the ground.So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright 'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life Make light! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
