JohnRich 4 #1 May 6, 2004 In the news: Jail for man who left bag in airportA plumber who left an unattended bag containing a teddy bear, some fruit and clothes in an airport lounge was jailed yesterday for causing a full-scale security alert. Magistrates sentenced Jose da Silva, age 25, to 10 days in jail under public nuisance laws. Full Story Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #2 May 6, 2004 Another example of people making an honest human mistake and paying for it severely not because of the severity of the mistake but ONLY because of the intensely irrational reaction that others had to that mistake. Rather like the situation where that kid brought the rubber-band gun to school. I said the same thing in that thread. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuckbrown 0 #3 May 6, 2004 I doubt this would happen in the US. Since our legal system is based on the English model, I'm also surprised this happened in the UK. There's a concept in the law called criminal intent which seems to be missing here. You have to intend to do the act which broke the law. It doesn't seem like he intended to lose his luggage. Hopefully he'll appeal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #4 May 6, 2004 QuoteI doubt this would happen in the US. QuoteTake, for example, the case of Richard Bizarro. (No, I am not making up his name.) This hapless guy needed to relieve himself last Saturday after his flight was within 30 minutes of landing. Because he had the audacity to break Uncle Sam's bathroom curfew, he now faces up to 20 years in prison. Yep, that's right, folks – no joke – take a dump, go to jail. http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26447 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuckbrown 0 #5 May 6, 2004 QuoteQuoteI doubt this would happen in the US. QuoteTake, for example, the case of Richard Bizarro. (No, I am not making up his name.) This hapless guy needed to relieve himself last Saturday after his flight was within 30 minutes of landing. Because he had the audacity to break Uncle Sam's bathroom curfew, he now faces up to 20 years in prison. Yep, that's right, folks – no joke – take a dump, go to jail. http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26447 I think if you read between the lines of that article, he was violating orders from the aircrew to remain seated. You disobey a lawful command from aircrew and you deserve to go to jail. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #6 May 6, 2004 "We take these things very seriously and this was a serious security issue. The sentence reflects that and we would reiterate the dangers of leaving luggage unattended." There is no "danger" in "leaving luggage unattended." All the danger comes from the reaction to the leaving of the luggage. This guy should have said, "The sentence reflects that and we would reiterate the REPERCUSSIONS of leaving luggage unattended." That's entirely different, and more in line with what actually happened. Because really, no one was in ANY DANGER simply because harmless items were left in luggage that was unattended. It is entirely inaccurate to say "dangers of leaving luggage." --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #7 May 6, 2004 QuoteQuoteQuoteI doubt this would happen in the US. QuoteTake, for example, the case of Richard Bizarro. (No, I am not making up his name.) This hapless guy needed to relieve himself last Saturday after his flight was within 30 minutes of landing. Because he had the audacity to break Uncle Sam's bathroom curfew, he now faces up to 20 years in prison. Yep, that's right, folks – no joke – take a dump, go to jail. http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=26447 I think if you read between the lines of that article, he was violating orders from the aircrew to remain seated. You disobey a lawful command from aircrew and you deserve to go to jail. You draw no distinction between an order to remain in your seat and don't go to the lavatory, and an order to, say, open an emergency exit after a crash landing and the cabin is filling with smoke? You're pretty harsh, there. I say that a rule that you cannot relieve yourself within 30 minutes of the end of the flight is unreasonable, since people DO NOT HAVE CONTROL OVER THAT NEED. At the start of the flight, you can agree to the rule, and by the end you can find out that you were really in no position to agree to abide by it, since you couldn't have known what your gut was going to do later on. Are the airlines and the TSA really saying that they require this guy to have SHIT IN HIS PANTS just to stay within the rules? If that were me, I'd sue the shit out of the airline and the TSA. Someone out there (chuck?) is saying that yes, this guy should indeed do 20 years in prison on taxpayers' dollars because he couldn't hold it and was unwilling to shit in his pants? Fuck this system, man. Something is gonna break, soon. We just can't fucking go on with this level of INSANITY. --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #8 May 6, 2004 QuoteI'd sue the shit out of the airline and the TSA. Just make sure not to do 30 minutes before you land Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuckbrown 0 #9 May 7, 2004 Please don't attribute comments to me that I didn't say. I was pointing out a distinction between facing criminal penalties for an intentional action (disregarding a LAWFUL order of aircrew) and accidently leaving luggage in an airline terminal. Nothing more, nothing less. Personally, I agree that TSA is pretty screwed up. We could get better security by having pilots armed and cockpits inaccessible from the passenger cabin. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #10 May 7, 2004 "We could get better security by having pilots armed" Thats another (unattended) bag of worms. For what its worth folks, anyone leaving a bag unattended at a UK airport over the last few years needs to be removed from society for their own protection. They are obviously oblivious to the painfully regular PA announcements, and written warnings posted around the concourse, regarding the perils of leaving any item of luggage unattended within a UK airport.-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #11 May 7, 2004 They had to mobilize a security team because this plumber was stupid. They might have really been needed elsewhere. Don't lock him up, it wasn't criminal. But it was dumb and cost manpower, make him pay $$$ for his stupid action. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #12 May 7, 2004 "The airport was closed for three hours and 1,000 passengers and staff had to leave as an Army bomb disposal team investigated. Three incoming flights were diverted and 15 planes grounded." Thats quite a security team. Okay Birmingham airport isn't as busy as say Gatwick, Heathrow (London) or Manchester, but its still a major upset. If I was waiting for a flight and was delayed by at least 3 hours because of this, I'd be mighty pissed. How much would you fine him? I'm guessing a plumber can't afford the re-positioning costs of the diverted aircraft alone, without considering costs of mobilising the bomb squad and subsequent missed connections of the 15 grounded aircraft. 10 days in a low security prison sounds like quite good value compared to the true cost of this guys mistake. Betcha he takes his holdall with him next time he nips out for a smoke-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuckbrown 0 #13 May 7, 2004 If us Yanks had spent the last 30+ years worrying about IRA bombs we might have your take on things. Still the problem of criminal intent makes this seem a bit too much. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #14 May 7, 2004 Quote...anyone leaving a bag unattended at a UK airport over the last few years needs to be removed from society for their own protection. They are obviously oblivious to the painfully regular PA announcements, and written warnings posted around the concourse, regarding the perils of leaving any item of luggage unattended within a UK airport. Quote...Speaking through an interpreter... Are the announcements in Portugese?-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
caz 0 #15 May 7, 2004 I live and work in London where we are pretty much reminded daily of terrorist threats from various sources, espectially since the Madrid bombings. The amount of times I've been severely delayed going to or from work due to suspected bomb alerts (left luggage) on trains, tubes and buses is shocking. And any delay on the already over burdened London transport system like this has repercussions throughout the entire day. So I'm all for that idiot being made to pay for his mistake. How hard is it to keep hold of your stuff! ~~~ London Skydivers ~~~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nacmacfeegle 0 #16 May 7, 2004 "Are the announcements in Portugese?" Not sure Tom, and I sincerely doubt it, but I'm pretty sure the warning signs are multilingual.-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
